A lady in one of my other genealogy groups asked if there is a way to trace one's family back to the Aztecs. Any and all information will be appreciated.
Thanks, Gloria
A study published by Andrés Moreno-Estrada et al. in 2014 used the dataset from the Bustamate lab that was used for the tests of the DNA of Sandra Cisneros and for Jessica Alba. The study was talked about on this site shortly after it was published. You can read the study if you get a free account to Science Mag. You will have the option for free registration when you try to open the link at http://science.sciencemag.org/content/344/6189/1280.full
Once you do you can get all of the details of the DNA results of Native Mexicans and Cosmpolitan Mexicans from all over Mexico including two of the three states this site is dedicated to which are Jalisco and Zacatecas.
Even without free registration you can see the following ADMIXTURE results for different Native Mexican tribes such as Huichol, Purepecha, Nahua Jalisco and other Nahuas, and different Mayan tribes. As pointed out by RJQ the Aztecs were a Nahua tribe. If you notice almost all tribes have the purple which is a group of autosomal SNPs shared by all of them that have the purple. The Huichol have almost all of the very light blue and Mayans have a lot of the orange. The Nahua Jalisco have a mix of the purple, the Huichol light blue, and the orange Mayan. If you also look at the cosmopolitan samples from Zacatecas and Jalisco you will see they also have a mix of purple, light blue, and orange.
In summary we all have a mix of autosomal DNA that the Huichol, Nahua, and Mayan also have because many the SNPs are from many thousands of years ago from when they first populated Mexico around 14,000 years ago and some are from being mixed since several tribes such as the Tlaxcalans and Otomí assisted in the conquest of Mexico.
As far as mtDNA A that Linda mentioned it is all over Mexico and with a Full Sequence mtDNA test, which is the best kind of mtDNA test, she would show to be a subclade of A2. In a 2012 study of Native Mexicans A2 was 55% of Huichol, 57% of Nahua, 49% of Otomí Sierra, and 79% of Maya. That study is at http://journals.plos.org/plosone/article?id=10.1371/journal.pone.0044666 The graph has the mtDNA haplogroups mislabeled but the text of the study and the table have the correct names of A2, B2, C1, and D1.
I just realized I hadn't included a link to the image of the ADMIXTURE results of Native and Cosmopolitan Mexicans that shows the autosomal SNPs in different colors and shows that people from Zacatecas and Jalisco have a mix of Huichol, Nahua, and Mayan autosomal DNA. It's at https://d2ufo47lrtsv5s.cloudfront.net/content/sci/344/6189/1280/F2.larg…
On the PBS show "Finding your Roots," Sandra Cisneros was given a test that she was the first to receive as it was a new DNA test to show from what tribe, Nation one was from. Several people have left comments to find out what test that was but they have been ignored.
"Which DNA test did Sandra Cisneros take to show her Mayan roots? Dr. Gates mentioned it was new"
I thought all of us of Native Americans from New Mexico and Mexico who show Native blood had our DNA traced back to Mayans, no?
Emilie
Port Orchard, WA
> To: research@lists.nuestrosranchos.org
> From: sarod77@hotmail.com
> Date: Fri, 15 Apr 2016 16:21:32 -0700
> Subject: [Nuestros Ranchos] Sandra Cisneros
>
> On the PBS show "Finding your Roots," Sandra Cisneros was given a test that
> she was the first to receive as it was a new DNA test to show from what
> tribe, Nation one was from. Several people have left comments to find out
> what test that was but they have been ignored. "Which DNA test did Sandra
> Cisneros take to show her Mayan roots? Dr. Gates mentioned it was new"
>
I really don't know anything about this subject only added what I had seen on PBS and thought I would share so maybe an expert or someone with more knowledge would add to this conversation.
I had a question about the science site with the Mayan, Huichol and Nahua
mixtures but my question is not very clear. I know that some of my
ancestors were from the Caxcan tribe headed by the Mendoza's and I don't
know what happened to the Caxcan people, maybe they disappeared or maybe
they just mixed with the Spanish people like Chief Blas de Mendoza. but
does anyone know how that DNA is researched? are they part of the Mayan,
Huichol or NAhuas or have they just disappeared? so as an example say that
all my indigenous ancestors were Caxcan people from Teocaltiche and since
I don't see the Caxcan tribe listed as one of the tribes of the Native
Mexicans on the admixture picture, would my Caxcan DNA be reclassified
under another tribe or would it be redistributed among several different
tribes or just not be listed
Check out the following posts my prima Alicia made on Nuestros Ranchos a
few years back. I've attached them here because the Tachiquin last name is
most likely a Caxcan last name that still survives today. As far as I know
there are still some Tachiquin families in el barrio de San Sebastian in
Nochistlan, not far from Teocaltiche. I'm not sure how much of European and
other DNAs have been mixed into this family over the years. My DNA has
Caxcan DNA as most if not all of the people with ancestry in this part of
Mexico does. The Caxcanes have been mixed in with European, African, Middle
Eastern, Asian DNA's present in this part of Mexico. This is the mestisaje
that makes us Mexican. I'm not aware of any pure Caxcan people living
today, but the Tachiquin elders are probably the closest we can get to pure
Caxcan DNA. Years ago Family Tree DNA listed my indigenous DNA as Mayan,
but today it's just listed as Native American most likely because they know
there are distinct and different indigenous DNA throughout Mexico. Mayans
are quite a bit farther south in Mexico so I'm pretty sure Caxcanes are not
Mayan. Based on some quick research, there are some sites stating the
Caxcan are part of the Uto-Aztecan family as are the aztecas, huicholes,
zacatecos, nahuas and matlatzincas. Since DNA research in Mexico is in its
infancy so to speak, more refined markers identifying Caxcan DNA are not
available as far as I know. Maybe that will change with the work of Dr.
Carlos Bustamante at Stanford University.
Saludos,
Juan Aguayo
See past post below:
Lisa,
As you may know, surnames were not used by the native American people.
Having
said that, the surname of Tachiquin is indigenous to the area of Nochistlan
and
is the only known indian surname that survived and was not converted to
spanish
or the castillian language.
Aside from this, I don't know anything else about this surname other than
it was
and is an original indian surname. Would your grandfather by chance be from
Tenayuca or Toyahua in the municipality of Nochistlan?
Can any one tell me about the Name Tachiquin. My Great Grandfather's name is
Pedro Tachiquin, we do not know anything about him except that he was
indio, and
from Nochistlan. I would like to know about the people in that area if any
one
can help me I sure would appreciate it. Many thanks.
- Login
or register
to post comments
Tachiquin Surname's origins
Submitted by oldcar53 on Wed, 2011-03-23 03:00.
Lisa,
Good news, I knew that I'd read something somewhere about the surname
Tachiquin
and today I had time to look into it and found the following.
In the book Nochistlan de Zacatecas by Evelia Clotilde Quirarte there's a
section that tells of a few indian surnames.
The surname Tachiquin corresponds to families that originated in the Barrio
of
San Sebastian of Nochistlan. The Tachiquin surname is believed to have
originally been tlachiunqui that was then converted to tlachinqui. The
letter t
before the letter L is characteristic of the language of the cazcan nation
indigenous to the area of Nochistlan and the surrounding areas. She states
that
the etimology of the word tlachiuanite means to cast a spell. (espanol),(
hechizar, aojar, el encantador, el que hechiza)
She believed that the original Tachiquin may have been an important healer
or
medicine man or man of influence in the Caxcan community.
In 1913, a person with the name of Tachiquin was honored for giving his
life for
defending Nochistlan.
I hope this helps.
Alicia,
San Jose, Ca.
On Mon, Apr 18, 2016 at 12:37 AM, Danny Alonso wrote:
> I had a question about the science site with the Mayan, Huichol and Nahua
> mixtures but my question is not very clear. I know that some of my
> ancestors were from the Caxcan tribe headed by the Mendoza's and I don't
> know what happened to the Caxcan people, maybe they disappeared or maybe
> they just mixed with the Spanish people like Chief Blas de Mendoza. but
> does anyone know how that DNA is researched? are they part of the Mayan,
> Huichol or NAhuas or have they just disappeared? so as an example say that
> all my indigenous ancestors were Caxcan people from Teocaltiche and since
> I don't see the Caxcan tribe listed as one of the tribes of the Native
> Mexicans on the admixture picture, would my Caxcan DNA be reclassified
> under another tribe or would it be redistributed among several different
> tribes or just not be listed
>
> Danny C. Alonso
The above comments on Caxcan surnames was interesting. I was wondering if other NA groups have surnames in Mexico.
I know that there are Yucatec Maya surnames, and they're fairly common. They tend to be regular words, sometimes rather "funny" to our minds. My ex-husband was yucateco, and his maternal surname was Uc, which mean piojo. His mother is Uc Cab (honey). Chan is a common name, not sure of the meaning, as is Balam, which I believe is jaguar. Pech means agarrapatas. I've seen Dzul as well.
Thank you for this information. It's very informative. I was not aware of
any of it before.
Danny C, Alonso
On Mon, Apr 18, 2016 at 9:12 AM, Juan Aguayo
wrote:
> Danny,
>
> Check out the following posts my prima Alicia made on Nuestros Ranchos a
> few years back. I've attached them here because the Tachiquin last name is
> most likely a Caxcan last name that still survives today. As far as I know
> there are still some Tachiquin families in el barrio de San Sebastian in
> Nochistlan, not far from Teocaltiche. I'm not sure how much of European and
> other DNAs have been mixed into this family over the years. My DNA has
> Caxcan DNA as most if not all of the people with ancestry in this part of
> Mexico does. The Caxcanes have been mixed in with European, African, Middle
> Eastern, Asian DNA's present in this part of Mexico. This is the mestisaje
> that makes us Mexican. I'm not aware of any pure Caxcan people living
> today, but the Tachiquin elders are probably the closest we can get to pure
> Caxcan DNA. Years ago Family Tree DNA listed my indigenous DNA as Mayan,
> but today it's just listed as Native American most likely because they know
> there are distinct and different indigenous DNA throughout Mexico. Mayans
> are quite a bit farther south in Mexico so I'm pretty sure Caxcanes are not
> Mayan. Based on some quick research, there are some sites stating the
> Caxcan are part of the Uto-Aztecan family as are the aztecas, huicholes,
> zacatecos, nahuas and matlatzincas. Since DNA research in Mexico is in its
> infancy so to speak, more refined markers identifying Caxcan DNA are not
> available as far as I know. Maybe that will change with the work of Dr.
> Carlos Bustamante at Stanford University.
>
>
> Saludos,
>
> Juan Aguayo
>
> See past post below:
>
> Lisa,
>
> As you may know, surnames were not used by the native American people.
> Having
> said that, the surname of Tachiquin is indigenous to the area of Nochistlan
> and
> is the only known indian surname that survived and was not converted to
> spanish
> or the castillian language.
>
> Aside from this, I don't know anything else about this surname other than
> it was
> and is an original indian surname. Would your grandfather by chance be from
> Tenayuca or Toyahua in the municipality of Nochistlan?
>
> Alicia,
> San Jose, Calif
>
> ________________________________
> From: "lisacruz_1967@hotmail.com"
> To: research@lists.nuestrosranchos.org
> Sent: Mon, March 14, 2011 5:56:49 PM
> Subject: [Nuestros Ranchos] Help with a Surname
>
> Can any one tell me about the Name Tachiquin. My Great Grandfather's name
> is
> Pedro Tachiquin, we do not know anything about him except that he was
> indio, and
> from Nochistlan. I would like to know about the people in that area if any
> one
> can help me I sure would appreciate it. Many thanks.
>
> - Login
> <
> http://www.nuestrosranchos.org/user/login?destination=comment%2Freply%2…
> >
> or register
> <
> http://www.nuestrosranchos.org/user/register?destination=comment%2Frepl…
> >
> to post comments
>
> Tachiquin Surname's origins
>
> Submitted by oldcar53 on Wed, 2011-03-23 03:00.
>
> Lisa,
>
> Good news, I knew that I'd read something somewhere about the surname
> Tachiquin
> and today I had time to look into it and found the following.
>
> In the book Nochistlan de Zacatecas by Evelia Clotilde Quirarte there's a
> section that tells of a few indian surnames.
>
> The surname Tachiquin corresponds to families that originated in the Barrio
> of
> San Sebastian of Nochistlan. The Tachiquin surname is believed to have
> originally been tlachiunqui that was then converted to tlachinqui. The
> letter t
> before the letter L is characteristic of the language of the cazcan nation
> indigenous to the area of Nochistlan and the surrounding areas. She states
> that
> the etimology of the word tlachiuanite means to cast a spell. (espanol),(
> hechizar, aojar, el encantador, el que hechiza)
>
> She believed that the original Tachiquin may have been an important healer
> or
> medicine man or man of influence in the Caxcan community.
>
> In 1913, a person with the name of Tachiquin was honored for giving his
> life for
> defending Nochistlan.
>
> I hope this helps.
>
> Alicia,
> San Jose, Ca.
>
>
> On Mon, Apr 18, 2016 at 12:37 AM, Danny Alonso
> wrote:
>
> > I had a question about the science site with the Mayan, Huichol and Nahua
> > mixtures but my question is not very clear. I know that some of my
> > ancestors were from the Caxcan tribe headed by the Mendoza's and I don't
> > know what happened to the Caxcan people, maybe they disappeared or maybe
> > they just mixed with the Spanish people like Chief Blas de Mendoza. but
> > does anyone know how that DNA is researched? are they part of the Mayan,
> > Huichol or NAhuas or have they just disappeared? so as an example say
> that
> > all my indigenous ancestors were Caxcan people from Teocaltiche and since
> > I don't see the Caxcan tribe listed as one of the tribes of the Native
> > Mexicans on the admixture picture, would my Caxcan DNA be reclassified
> > under another tribe or would it be redistributed among several different
> > tribes or just not be listed
> >
> > Danny C. Alonso
> > -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- --
> > Nuestros Ranchos Research Mailing List
> >
> > To post, send email to:
> > research(at)nuestrosranchos.org
> >
> > To change your subscription, log on to:
> > http://www.nuestrosranchos.org
I am 30 to 40% native american. The best web page that has dna analysis is
gedmatch. Using oracle 4.
You need to get dna test in one of the mayor companies 23 and me,
familytreedna , ancesntry or National geo. The best was 23 and me but it
has change. Fanily tree dna is the best in market i think.
Then you can up load data to
dna.land
https://www.gedmatch.com : this is the best it has oracle 4 and you can
choose what territory to search on.
Jose Luis Zambrano De Santiago "El Euforia".
On Sun, Apr 17, 2016 at 10:37 PM, Danny Alonso wrote:
> I had a question about the science site with the Mayan, Huichol and Nahua
> mixtures but my question is not very clear. I know that some of my
> ancestors were from the Caxcan tribe headed by the Mendoza's and I don't
> know what happened to the Caxcan people, maybe they disappeared or maybe
> they just mixed with the Spanish people like Chief Blas de Mendoza. but
> does anyone know how that DNA is researched? are they part of the Mayan,
> Huichol or NAhuas or have they just disappeared? so as an example say that
> all my indigenous ancestors were Caxcan people from Teocaltiche and since
> I don't see the Caxcan tribe listed as one of the tribes of the Native
> Mexicans on the admixture picture, would my Caxcan DNA be reclassified
> under another tribe or would it be redistributed among several different
> tribes or just not be listed
>
> Danny C. Alonso
IN familytreedna you can start a group for your tribe.
Jose Luis Zambrano De Santiago "El Euforia".
On Wed, Apr 20, 2016 at 10:55 AM, JOSE L. Zambrano
wrote:
> I am 30 to 40% native american. The best web page that has dna analysis is
> gedmatch. Using oracle 4.
>
> You need to get dna test in one of the mayor companies 23 and me,
> familytreedna , ancesntry or National geo. The best was 23 and me but it
> has change. Fanily tree dna is the best in market i think.
>
> Then you can up load data to
>
> dna.land
>
> https://www.gedmatch.com : this is the best it has oracle 4 and you can
> choose what territory to search on.
>
>
>
> Jose Luis Zambrano De Santiago "El Euforia".
>
>
> On Sun, Apr 17, 2016 at 10:37 PM, Danny Alonso
> wrote:
>
>> I had a question about the science site with the Mayan, Huichol and Nahua
>> mixtures but my question is not very clear. I know that some of my
>> ancestors were from the Caxcan tribe headed by the Mendoza's and I don't
>> know what happened to the Caxcan people, maybe they disappeared or maybe
>> they just mixed with the Spanish people like Chief Blas de Mendoza. but
>> does anyone know how that DNA is researched? are they part of the Mayan,
>> Huichol or NAhuas or have they just disappeared? so as an example say that
>> all my indigenous ancestors were Caxcan people from Teocaltiche and since
>> I don't see the Caxcan tribe listed as one of the tribes of the Native
>> Mexicans on the admixture picture, would my Caxcan DNA be reclassified
>> under another tribe or would it be redistributed among several different
>> tribes or just not be listed
>>
>> Danny C. Alonso
The new dna test was performed by Stanford professor Carlos Bustamante. I'm
by no means an expert on indigenous DNA in Mexico, but I do know there are
measurable differences within the various tribes in Mexico, many of which
do not trace back to the Mayans.
Saludos,
Juan Aguayo
On Fri, Apr 15, 2016 at 6:21 PM, wrote:
> On the PBS show "Finding your Roots," Sandra Cisneros was given a test that
> she was the first to receive as it was a new DNA test to show from what
> tribe, Nation one was from. Several people have left comments to find out
> what test that was but they have been ignored. "Which DNA test did Sandra
> Cisneros take to show her Mayan roots? Dr. Gates mentioned it was new"
>
The new dna test was performed by Stanford professor Carlos Bustamante. I'm
by no means an expert on indigenous DNA in Mexico, but I do know there are
measurable differences within the various tribes in Mexico, many of which
do not trace back to the Mayans.
Saludos,
Juan Aguayo
On Fri, Apr 15, 2016 at 6:21 PM, wrote:
> On the PBS show "Finding your Roots," Sandra Cisneros was given a test that
> she was the first to receive as it was a new DNA test to show from what
> tribe, Nation one was from. Several people have left comments to find out
> what test that was but they have been ignored. "Which DNA test did Sandra
> Cisneros take to show her Mayan roots? Dr. Gates mentioned it was new"
>
As Juan Aguayo pointed out, the test provided to Cisneros (and, I believe, Jessica Alba in her episode) was provided by Dr. Carlos Bustamante at Stanford. His website https://bustamantelab.stanford.edu/ provides an opportunity to fill out a questionnaire if you are interested in his study on Native American ancestry. The link is on the lower right of the page. The test is not available to the public-- what we saw in the episodes is just a special opportunity given to a few people.
Here's our chance to express our interest, though, and maybe Dr. Bustamante will make the test available to us in the future!
The short answer would be no, its very unlikely that someone can factually find of what native tribe their descendants were from, for once, there was too much mixture after the establishment of the colony to say that a line of native ancestry was of a single party, Aztecs were one of many Nahuatl tribes (although some writings would argue that all Nahuatl were Aztecs) and the ones favored by the Spanish, which in turn made their documentation highly romanticized, consequently many people think in all natives from the Mexico region as Aztecs, but the there were many others and vary by regions. Also is important to note that this subcultures are distinguish by language and not biologically, is obvious that while the different tribes migrated, some of them would mix along the way. Thus wouldn't be impossible to find an Aztec with a Chichimeca dna.
I wouldn't say impossible though, may be as time pass, or like when related to some lineages like the Moctezuma's, that were somehow documented and established, their "Ducado" still exist, many other tribes married their aristocrat kids with Spanish to keep their wealth, etc. They may be traceable.
Now if someone wants to know if they have Native blood, regardless of which tribe/culture they come from, then that's easier, as Linda mentioned, dna can't give a bit more information*, also good old plain genealogy with documents can provide many clues, But focusing only on finding this facts is very counterproductive, and for many, disappointing. I personally don't recommended. Mexico, as much denial as there is been for decades, was in fact a "melting pot", all the way from Africa to Asia, from South America to the North, is way better to open the "vault" of our ancestry and be surprised by its content.
*Note, it was known that Asian natives were brought and many were left in Mexico, specially from the Philippines, (and the same the other way around), their christian names makes it impossible to trace with documents, although very small in number, some people may have their dna, but would be considered "native dna" simply because they are Hispanics, don't take my word for granted, as far as I remember these groups are not yet fully distinguishable from each other.
when I had my MTDNA (Mother to Daughter only) it came back that my first Mother was Native American Group A. In Mexico she would have been Nahua and that was part of the Aztec Nation. I have no idea what DNA the men would have had.. Unfortunately I have had no luck tracking that line back any further than 1850 or so in Michoacan, Mexico.
Linda Castanon-Long
Aztec Lineage
To all who replied, thank you!
Gloria
Aztec, Mayan, Bustamante, Andres Moreno Estrada
A study published by Andrés Moreno-Estrada et al. in 2014 used the dataset from the Bustamate lab that was used for the tests of the DNA of Sandra Cisneros and for Jessica Alba. The study was talked about on this site shortly after it was published. You can read the study if you get a free account to Science Mag. You will have the option for free registration when you try to open the link at http://science.sciencemag.org/content/344/6189/1280.full
Once you do you can get all of the details of the DNA results of Native Mexicans and Cosmpolitan Mexicans from all over Mexico including two of the three states this site is dedicated to which are Jalisco and Zacatecas.
Even without free registration you can see the following ADMIXTURE results for different Native Mexican tribes such as Huichol, Purepecha, Nahua Jalisco and other Nahuas, and different Mayan tribes. As pointed out by RJQ the Aztecs were a Nahua tribe. If you notice almost all tribes have the purple which is a group of autosomal SNPs shared by all of them that have the purple. The Huichol have almost all of the very light blue and Mayans have a lot of the orange. The Nahua Jalisco have a mix of the purple, the Huichol light blue, and the orange Mayan. If you also look at the cosmopolitan samples from Zacatecas and Jalisco you will see they also have a mix of purple, light blue, and orange.
In summary we all have a mix of autosomal DNA that the Huichol, Nahua, and Mayan also have because many the SNPs are from many thousands of years ago from when they first populated Mexico around 14,000 years ago and some are from being mixed since several tribes such as the Tlaxcalans and Otomí assisted in the conquest of Mexico.
As far as mtDNA A that Linda mentioned it is all over Mexico and with a Full Sequence mtDNA test, which is the best kind of mtDNA test, she would show to be a subclade of A2. In a 2012 study of Native Mexicans A2 was 55% of Huichol, 57% of Nahua, 49% of Otomí Sierra, and 79% of Maya. That study is at http://journals.plos.org/plosone/article?id=10.1371/journal.pone.0044666 The graph has the mtDNA haplogroups mislabeled but the text of the study and the table have the correct names of A2, B2, C1, and D1.
DNA
..
just fascinating!
Thank you for the follow up information.
Linda Castanon-Long
ADMIXTURE results of Native and Cosmopolitan Mexicans
I just realized I hadn't included a link to the image of the ADMIXTURE results of Native and Cosmopolitan Mexicans that shows the autosomal SNPs in different colors and shows that people from Zacatecas and Jalisco have a mix of Huichol, Nahua, and Mayan autosomal DNA. It's at https://d2ufo47lrtsv5s.cloudfront.net/content/sci/344/6189/1280/F2.larg…
Sandra Cisneros
On the PBS show "Finding your Roots," Sandra Cisneros was given a test that she was the first to receive as it was a new DNA test to show from what tribe, Nation one was from. Several people have left comments to find out what test that was but they have been ignored.
"Which DNA test did Sandra Cisneros take to show her Mayan roots? Dr. Gates mentioned it was new"
Sandra Cisneros
I thought all of us of Native Americans from New Mexico and Mexico who show Native blood had our DNA traced back to Mayans, no?
Emilie
Port Orchard, WA
> To: research@lists.nuestrosranchos.org
> From: sarod77@hotmail.com
> Date: Fri, 15 Apr 2016 16:21:32 -0700
> Subject: [Nuestros Ranchos] Sandra Cisneros
>
> On the PBS show "Finding your Roots," Sandra Cisneros was given a test that
> she was the first to receive as it was a new DNA test to show from what
> tribe, Nation one was from. Several people have left comments to find out
> what test that was but they have been ignored. "Which DNA test did Sandra
> Cisneros take to show her Mayan roots? Dr. Gates mentioned it was new"
>
Mayans, Aztecs or que?
I really don't know anything about this subject only added what I had seen on PBS and thought I would share so maybe an expert or someone with more knowledge would add to this conversation.
Mayans, Aztecs or que?
I had a question about the science site with the Mayan, Huichol and Nahua
mixtures but my question is not very clear. I know that some of my
ancestors were from the Caxcan tribe headed by the Mendoza's and I don't
know what happened to the Caxcan people, maybe they disappeared or maybe
they just mixed with the Spanish people like Chief Blas de Mendoza. but
does anyone know how that DNA is researched? are they part of the Mayan,
Huichol or NAhuas or have they just disappeared? so as an example say that
all my indigenous ancestors were Caxcan people from Teocaltiche and since
I don't see the Caxcan tribe listed as one of the tribes of the Native
Mexicans on the admixture picture, would my Caxcan DNA be reclassified
under another tribe or would it be redistributed among several different
tribes or just not be listed
Danny C. Alonso
Mayans, Aztecs or que?
Danny,
Check out the following posts my prima Alicia made on Nuestros Ranchos a
few years back. I've attached them here because the Tachiquin last name is
most likely a Caxcan last name that still survives today. As far as I know
there are still some Tachiquin families in el barrio de San Sebastian in
Nochistlan, not far from Teocaltiche. I'm not sure how much of European and
other DNAs have been mixed into this family over the years. My DNA has
Caxcan DNA as most if not all of the people with ancestry in this part of
Mexico does. The Caxcanes have been mixed in with European, African, Middle
Eastern, Asian DNA's present in this part of Mexico. This is the mestisaje
that makes us Mexican. I'm not aware of any pure Caxcan people living
today, but the Tachiquin elders are probably the closest we can get to pure
Caxcan DNA. Years ago Family Tree DNA listed my indigenous DNA as Mayan,
but today it's just listed as Native American most likely because they know
there are distinct and different indigenous DNA throughout Mexico. Mayans
are quite a bit farther south in Mexico so I'm pretty sure Caxcanes are not
Mayan. Based on some quick research, there are some sites stating the
Caxcan are part of the Uto-Aztecan family as are the aztecas, huicholes,
zacatecos, nahuas and matlatzincas. Since DNA research in Mexico is in its
infancy so to speak, more refined markers identifying Caxcan DNA are not
available as far as I know. Maybe that will change with the work of Dr.
Carlos Bustamante at Stanford University.
Saludos,
Juan Aguayo
See past post below:
Lisa,
As you may know, surnames were not used by the native American people.
Having
said that, the surname of Tachiquin is indigenous to the area of Nochistlan
and
is the only known indian surname that survived and was not converted to
spanish
or the castillian language.
Aside from this, I don't know anything else about this surname other than
it was
and is an original indian surname. Would your grandfather by chance be from
Tenayuca or Toyahua in the municipality of Nochistlan?
Alicia,
San Jose, Calif
________________________________
From: "lisacruz_1967@hotmail.com"
To: research@lists.nuestrosranchos.org
Sent: Mon, March 14, 2011 5:56:49 PM
Subject: [Nuestros Ranchos] Help with a Surname
Can any one tell me about the Name Tachiquin. My Great Grandfather's name is
Pedro Tachiquin, we do not know anything about him except that he was
indio, and
from Nochistlan. I would like to know about the people in that area if any
one
can help me I sure would appreciate it. Many thanks.
- Login
or register
to post comments
Tachiquin Surname's origins
Submitted by oldcar53 on Wed, 2011-03-23 03:00.
Lisa,
Good news, I knew that I'd read something somewhere about the surname
Tachiquin
and today I had time to look into it and found the following.
In the book Nochistlan de Zacatecas by Evelia Clotilde Quirarte there's a
section that tells of a few indian surnames.
The surname Tachiquin corresponds to families that originated in the Barrio
of
San Sebastian of Nochistlan. The Tachiquin surname is believed to have
originally been tlachiunqui that was then converted to tlachinqui. The
letter t
before the letter L is characteristic of the language of the cazcan nation
indigenous to the area of Nochistlan and the surrounding areas. She states
that
the etimology of the word tlachiuanite means to cast a spell. (espanol),(
hechizar, aojar, el encantador, el que hechiza)
She believed that the original Tachiquin may have been an important healer
or
medicine man or man of influence in the Caxcan community.
In 1913, a person with the name of Tachiquin was honored for giving his
life for
defending Nochistlan.
I hope this helps.
Alicia,
San Jose, Ca.
On Mon, Apr 18, 2016 at 12:37 AM, Danny Alonso wrote:
> I had a question about the science site with the Mayan, Huichol and Nahua
> mixtures but my question is not very clear. I know that some of my
> ancestors were from the Caxcan tribe headed by the Mendoza's and I don't
> know what happened to the Caxcan people, maybe they disappeared or maybe
> they just mixed with the Spanish people like Chief Blas de Mendoza. but
> does anyone know how that DNA is researched? are they part of the Mayan,
> Huichol or NAhuas or have they just disappeared? so as an example say that
> all my indigenous ancestors were Caxcan people from Teocaltiche and since
> I don't see the Caxcan tribe listed as one of the tribes of the Native
> Mexicans on the admixture picture, would my Caxcan DNA be reclassified
> under another tribe or would it be redistributed among several different
> tribes or just not be listed
>
> Danny C. Alonso
Indigenous surnames
The above comments on Caxcan surnames was interesting. I was wondering if other NA groups have surnames in Mexico.
I know that there are Yucatec Maya surnames, and they're fairly common. They tend to be regular words, sometimes rather "funny" to our minds. My ex-husband was yucateco, and his maternal surname was Uc, which mean piojo. His mother is Uc Cab (honey). Chan is a common name, not sure of the meaning, as is Balam, which I believe is jaguar. Pech means agarrapatas. I've seen Dzul as well.
Anyway, just an interesting topic.
Laura Gonzalez
Mayans, Aztecs or que?
Juan,
Thank you for this information. It's very informative. I was not aware of
any of it before.
Danny C, Alonso
On Mon, Apr 18, 2016 at 9:12 AM, Juan Aguayo
wrote:
> Danny,
>
> Check out the following posts my prima Alicia made on Nuestros Ranchos a
> few years back. I've attached them here because the Tachiquin last name is
> most likely a Caxcan last name that still survives today. As far as I know
> there are still some Tachiquin families in el barrio de San Sebastian in
> Nochistlan, not far from Teocaltiche. I'm not sure how much of European and
> other DNAs have been mixed into this family over the years. My DNA has
> Caxcan DNA as most if not all of the people with ancestry in this part of
> Mexico does. The Caxcanes have been mixed in with European, African, Middle
> Eastern, Asian DNA's present in this part of Mexico. This is the mestisaje
> that makes us Mexican. I'm not aware of any pure Caxcan people living
> today, but the Tachiquin elders are probably the closest we can get to pure
> Caxcan DNA. Years ago Family Tree DNA listed my indigenous DNA as Mayan,
> but today it's just listed as Native American most likely because they know
> there are distinct and different indigenous DNA throughout Mexico. Mayans
> are quite a bit farther south in Mexico so I'm pretty sure Caxcanes are not
> Mayan. Based on some quick research, there are some sites stating the
> Caxcan are part of the Uto-Aztecan family as are the aztecas, huicholes,
> zacatecos, nahuas and matlatzincas. Since DNA research in Mexico is in its
> infancy so to speak, more refined markers identifying Caxcan DNA are not
> available as far as I know. Maybe that will change with the work of Dr.
> Carlos Bustamante at Stanford University.
>
>
> Saludos,
>
> Juan Aguayo
>
> See past post below:
>
> Lisa,
>
> As you may know, surnames were not used by the native American people.
> Having
> said that, the surname of Tachiquin is indigenous to the area of Nochistlan
> and
> is the only known indian surname that survived and was not converted to
> spanish
> or the castillian language.
>
> Aside from this, I don't know anything else about this surname other than
> it was
> and is an original indian surname. Would your grandfather by chance be from
> Tenayuca or Toyahua in the municipality of Nochistlan?
>
> Alicia,
> San Jose, Calif
>
> ________________________________
> From: "lisacruz_1967@hotmail.com"
> To: research@lists.nuestrosranchos.org
> Sent: Mon, March 14, 2011 5:56:49 PM
> Subject: [Nuestros Ranchos] Help with a Surname
>
> Can any one tell me about the Name Tachiquin. My Great Grandfather's name
> is
> Pedro Tachiquin, we do not know anything about him except that he was
> indio, and
> from Nochistlan. I would like to know about the people in that area if any
> one
> can help me I sure would appreciate it. Many thanks.
>
> - Login
> <
> http://www.nuestrosranchos.org/user/login?destination=comment%2Freply%2…
> >
> or register
> <
> http://www.nuestrosranchos.org/user/register?destination=comment%2Frepl…
> >
> to post comments
>
> Tachiquin Surname's origins
>
> Submitted by oldcar53 on Wed, 2011-03-23 03:00.
>
> Lisa,
>
> Good news, I knew that I'd read something somewhere about the surname
> Tachiquin
> and today I had time to look into it and found the following.
>
> In the book Nochistlan de Zacatecas by Evelia Clotilde Quirarte there's a
> section that tells of a few indian surnames.
>
> The surname Tachiquin corresponds to families that originated in the Barrio
> of
> San Sebastian of Nochistlan. The Tachiquin surname is believed to have
> originally been tlachiunqui that was then converted to tlachinqui. The
> letter t
> before the letter L is characteristic of the language of the cazcan nation
> indigenous to the area of Nochistlan and the surrounding areas. She states
> that
> the etimology of the word tlachiuanite means to cast a spell. (espanol),(
> hechizar, aojar, el encantador, el que hechiza)
>
> She believed that the original Tachiquin may have been an important healer
> or
> medicine man or man of influence in the Caxcan community.
>
> In 1913, a person with the name of Tachiquin was honored for giving his
> life for
> defending Nochistlan.
>
> I hope this helps.
>
> Alicia,
> San Jose, Ca.
>
>
> On Mon, Apr 18, 2016 at 12:37 AM, Danny Alonso
> wrote:
>
> > I had a question about the science site with the Mayan, Huichol and Nahua
> > mixtures but my question is not very clear. I know that some of my
> > ancestors were from the Caxcan tribe headed by the Mendoza's and I don't
> > know what happened to the Caxcan people, maybe they disappeared or maybe
> > they just mixed with the Spanish people like Chief Blas de Mendoza. but
> > does anyone know how that DNA is researched? are they part of the Mayan,
> > Huichol or NAhuas or have they just disappeared? so as an example say
> that
> > all my indigenous ancestors were Caxcan people from Teocaltiche and since
> > I don't see the Caxcan tribe listed as one of the tribes of the Native
> > Mexicans on the admixture picture, would my Caxcan DNA be reclassified
> > under another tribe or would it be redistributed among several different
> > tribes or just not be listed
> >
> > Danny C. Alonso
> > -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- --
> > Nuestros Ranchos Research Mailing List
> >
> > To post, send email to:
> > research(at)nuestrosranchos.org
> >
> > To change your subscription, log on to:
> > http://www.nuestrosranchos.org
Mayans, Aztecs or que?
I am 30 to 40% native american. The best web page that has dna analysis is
gedmatch. Using oracle 4.
You need to get dna test in one of the mayor companies 23 and me,
familytreedna , ancesntry or National geo. The best was 23 and me but it
has change. Fanily tree dna is the best in market i think.
Then you can up load data to
dna.land
https://www.gedmatch.com : this is the best it has oracle 4 and you can
choose what territory to search on.
Jose Luis Zambrano De Santiago "El Euforia".
On Sun, Apr 17, 2016 at 10:37 PM, Danny Alonso wrote:
> I had a question about the science site with the Mayan, Huichol and Nahua
> mixtures but my question is not very clear. I know that some of my
> ancestors were from the Caxcan tribe headed by the Mendoza's and I don't
> know what happened to the Caxcan people, maybe they disappeared or maybe
> they just mixed with the Spanish people like Chief Blas de Mendoza. but
> does anyone know how that DNA is researched? are they part of the Mayan,
> Huichol or NAhuas or have they just disappeared? so as an example say that
> all my indigenous ancestors were Caxcan people from Teocaltiche and since
> I don't see the Caxcan tribe listed as one of the tribes of the Native
> Mexicans on the admixture picture, would my Caxcan DNA be reclassified
> under another tribe or would it be redistributed among several different
> tribes or just not be listed
>
> Danny C. Alonso
Mayans, Aztecs or que?
IN familytreedna you can start a group for your tribe.
Jose Luis Zambrano De Santiago "El Euforia".
On Wed, Apr 20, 2016 at 10:55 AM, JOSE L. Zambrano
wrote:
> I am 30 to 40% native american. The best web page that has dna analysis is
> gedmatch. Using oracle 4.
>
> You need to get dna test in one of the mayor companies 23 and me,
> familytreedna , ancesntry or National geo. The best was 23 and me but it
> has change. Fanily tree dna is the best in market i think.
>
> Then you can up load data to
>
> dna.land
>
> https://www.gedmatch.com : this is the best it has oracle 4 and you can
> choose what territory to search on.
>
>
>
> Jose Luis Zambrano De Santiago "El Euforia".
>
>
> On Sun, Apr 17, 2016 at 10:37 PM, Danny Alonso
> wrote:
>
>> I had a question about the science site with the Mayan, Huichol and Nahua
>> mixtures but my question is not very clear. I know that some of my
>> ancestors were from the Caxcan tribe headed by the Mendoza's and I don't
>> know what happened to the Caxcan people, maybe they disappeared or maybe
>> they just mixed with the Spanish people like Chief Blas de Mendoza. but
>> does anyone know how that DNA is researched? are they part of the Mayan,
>> Huichol or NAhuas or have they just disappeared? so as an example say that
>> all my indigenous ancestors were Caxcan people from Teocaltiche and since
>> I don't see the Caxcan tribe listed as one of the tribes of the Native
>> Mexicans on the admixture picture, would my Caxcan DNA be reclassified
>> under another tribe or would it be redistributed among several different
>> tribes or just not be listed
>>
>> Danny C. Alonso
Sandra Cisneros
The new dna test was performed by Stanford professor Carlos Bustamante. I'm
by no means an expert on indigenous DNA in Mexico, but I do know there are
measurable differences within the various tribes in Mexico, many of which
do not trace back to the Mayans.
Saludos,
Juan Aguayo
On Fri, Apr 15, 2016 at 6:21 PM, wrote:
> On the PBS show "Finding your Roots," Sandra Cisneros was given a test that
> she was the first to receive as it was a new DNA test to show from what
> tribe, Nation one was from. Several people have left comments to find out
> what test that was but they have been ignored. "Which DNA test did Sandra
> Cisneros take to show her Mayan roots? Dr. Gates mentioned it was new"
>
Sandra Cisneros
The new dna test was performed by Stanford professor Carlos Bustamante. I'm
by no means an expert on indigenous DNA in Mexico, but I do know there are
measurable differences within the various tribes in Mexico, many of which
do not trace back to the Mayans.
Saludos,
Juan Aguayo
On Fri, Apr 15, 2016 at 6:21 PM, wrote:
> On the PBS show "Finding your Roots," Sandra Cisneros was given a test that
> she was the first to receive as it was a new DNA test to show from what
> tribe, Nation one was from. Several people have left comments to find out
> what test that was but they have been ignored. "Which DNA test did Sandra
> Cisneros take to show her Mayan roots? Dr. Gates mentioned it was new"
>
Sandra Cisneros' DNA test/ Dr. Carlos Bustamante
As Juan Aguayo pointed out, the test provided to Cisneros (and, I believe, Jessica Alba in her episode) was provided by Dr. Carlos Bustamante at Stanford. His website https://bustamantelab.stanford.edu/ provides an opportunity to fill out a questionnaire if you are interested in his study on Native American ancestry. The link is on the lower right of the page. The test is not available to the public-- what we saw in the episodes is just a special opportunity given to a few people.
Here's our chance to express our interest, though, and maybe Dr. Bustamante will make the test available to us in the future!
Rosalinda
Amazing!
thanks to all for the conversation and information. I will go the site and show my interest.
glad i already did
glad i already did
Tracing Aztec Lineage
The short answer would be no, its very unlikely that someone can factually find of what native tribe their descendants were from, for once, there was too much mixture after the establishment of the colony to say that a line of native ancestry was of a single party, Aztecs were one of many Nahuatl tribes (although some writings would argue that all Nahuatl were Aztecs) and the ones favored by the Spanish, which in turn made their documentation highly romanticized, consequently many people think in all natives from the Mexico region as Aztecs, but the there were many others and vary by regions. Also is important to note that this subcultures are distinguish by language and not biologically, is obvious that while the different tribes migrated, some of them would mix along the way. Thus wouldn't be impossible to find an Aztec with a Chichimeca dna.
I wouldn't say impossible though, may be as time pass, or like when related to some lineages like the Moctezuma's, that were somehow documented and established, their "Ducado" still exist, many other tribes married their aristocrat kids with Spanish to keep their wealth, etc. They may be traceable.
Now if someone wants to know if they have Native blood, regardless of which tribe/culture they come from, then that's easier, as Linda mentioned, dna can't give a bit more information*, also good old plain genealogy with documents can provide many clues, But focusing only on finding this facts is very counterproductive, and for many, disappointing. I personally don't recommended. Mexico, as much denial as there is been for decades, was in fact a "melting pot", all the way from Africa to Asia, from South America to the North, is way better to open the "vault" of our ancestry and be surprised by its content.
*Note, it was known that Asian natives were brought and many were left in Mexico, specially from the Philippines, (and the same the other way around), their christian names makes it impossible to trace with documents, although very small in number, some people may have their dna, but would be considered "native dna" simply because they are Hispanics, don't take my word for granted, as far as I remember these groups are not yet fully distinguishable from each other.
Aztec Lineage
Dear RJQ,
I will pass on the information to the lady who asked the question.
Thank you very much for replying.
Gloria
tracing back to Aztecs
when I had my MTDNA (Mother to Daughter only) it came back that my first Mother was Native American Group A. In Mexico she would have been Nahua and that was part of the Aztec Nation. I have no idea what DNA the men would have had.. Unfortunately I have had no luck tracking that line back any further than 1850 or so in Michoacan, Mexico.
Linda Castanon-Long