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Por ibarra55 |

Hello Everyone,

I have hit a wall regarding Nicolas Sanchez Moreno and Maria Flores who had in Lagos de Moreno, Jalisco

A)Pedro Jose b. 1713
B)Luisa (Moreno) b. 1715 m. to Ylario Parada on 21 Jan 1734 in Lagos
C)Ana Maria b. 1717
D)Jose b. 1719
E)Miguel Tomas b. 1721 m. Maria Antonia Dias on 18 February 1743 in Atotonilco el Alto
F)Maria Francisca b. 1723
G)Juana Quieteria b. 1725
H)Maria Guadalupe b. 1728 m. to Jose Antonio Munoz on 4 Feb 1744 in Lagos
I)Antonio Teodicio b. 1730

and in La Barca, Jalisco

A)Lorenza de los Santos b. 1731
B)Jose Joaquin b. 1734
C)Jose b. 1737

If anyone knows anything more about the families of Nicolas or Maria I'd be really grateful for the help. Thank You!

Hello,
I placed the links below upon looking at the ones from La Barca they appear to be a different family. I have not been able to find the marriage for Nicolas and Maria either. Thanks for your help.

A)Pedro Jose b. 1713 https://familysearch.org/pal:/MM9.3.1/TH-1-18573-16784-4?cc=1874591&wc=…

B)Luisa (Moreno) b. 1715 m. to Ylario Parada on 21 Jan 1734 in Lagos
https://familysearch.org/pal:/MM9.3.1/TH-1-18573-16683-32?cc=1874591&wc…
https://familysearch.org/pal:/MM9.3.1/TH-1-18571-5811-56?cc=1874591&wc=…

C)Ana Maria b. 1717 https://familysearch.org/pal:/MM9.3.1/TH-1-18573-16437-44?cc=1874591&wc…

D)Jose b. 1719 https://familysearch.org/pal:/MM9.3.1/TH-1-18568-47310-20?cc=1874591&wc…

E)Miguel Tomas b. 1721 m. Maria Antonia Dias on 18 February 1743 in Atotonilco el Alto
https://familysearch.org/pal:/MM9.3.1/TH-1-18568-46460-61?cc=1874591&wc…
https://familysearch.org/pal:/MM9.3.1/TH-1-18428-30555-43?cc=1874591&wc…

F)Maria Francisca b. 1723 https://familysearch.org/pal:/MM9.1.1/NBM8-T5W

G)Juana Quieteria b. 1725 https://familysearch.org/pal:/MM9.3.1/TH-1-18568-45073-18?cc=1874591&wc…

H)Maria Guadalupe b. 1728 m. to Jose Antonio Munoz on 4 Feb 1744 in Lagos
https://familysearch.org/pal:/MM9.3.1/TH-1-18568-43591-67?cc=1874591&wc…
https://familysearch.org/pal:/MM9.3.1/TH-1-18560-26564-34?cc=1874591&wc…

I)Antonio Teodicio b. 1730 https://familysearch.org/pal:/MM9.3.1/TH-1-18562-61171-43?cc=1874591&wc…

I wasn't able to find a connection to any of the other families in Lagos. The puesto or haciendo El Potrero could be a clue to finding a relation to one of them. I don't know who owned it or which families lived there or even the geographical location. If you can get that info it might be of help.

Also look through the volumes of Información Matrimonial for 1713-1715, 1711-1712, and 1711 to see if you can find a record for Nicolas Sanchez Moreno and Maria Flores.

Armando

Hello,

I have some more information that may help find the origins of this couple. After some more searching I have not found the marriage for Nicolas and Maria yet but I have found some more marriages of their children.

A)Maria Francisca b. 1723 https://familysearch.org/pal:/MM9.1.1/NBM8-T5W married Jose Leonardo de Parada y Villalpando (brother of Hilario)29 May 1742 in Lagos de Moreno.
https://familysearch.org/pal:/MM9.3.1/TH-1-18560-23046-99?cc=1874591&wc…

B)Juana Quieteria b. 1725 https://familysearch.org/pal:/MM9.3.1/TH-1-18568-45073-18?cc=1874591&wc… married Jose Ramon Parada (brother of Leonardo and Hilario)6 Jun 1745 in Lagos de Moreno. https://familysearch.org/pal:/MM9.3.1/TH-1-18560-25896-39?cc=1874591&wc…

It seems that the Parada family was close to the Sanchez Flores Family. The rancho they lived at Los Conejos is close to a rancho called El Potrero de Afuera both in Lagos. The mother of the three brothers used different surnames (Manriques, Villalpando, and Navarette) so I have not been able to figure out their origins either. It seems, also, that Miguel, Luisa, Maria Francisca used the name Angulo after the 1740's. Luisa and Maria Francisca used, indiscriminately, the names: Moreno, Sanchez, Flores, and Angulo. Miguel was the patriarch of a large family of Angulos that settled in the Atotonilco el Alto area.

In the marriage of Maria Francisca and Leonardo Parada Francisca's father Nicolas uses the name Angulo Moreno.

While I was looking through the marriage records of Lagos a man named Francisco Sanchez Moreno is a testigo in some of the marriages. I believe he was the progeny of the marriage of a Francisco Sanchez and Ana Tavera that took place in Lagos 27 Sep 1620 due to his disaperance from the records around the late 1600's and the death record of a Francisco Sanchez Tavera (Bachiller) that gives his death as 3 April 1698 in Lagos de Moreno. The marriage record of Francisco and Ana only shows the names of the two. I believe Francisco Sanchez and Ana Tevera to be the grandparents of Nicolas but do not have records to prove it yet.

I have also seen in Lagos records reference to an Andres Sanchez who was the owner of El Labor de San Antonio or Hacienda San Antonio before Carlos de Alcala was its owner in the first half of the 1600's. Carlos was the grandfather of a number of Alcala's who were the godparents of the children of Nicolas and Maria. It may be a possibility that Andres Sanchez and Francisco Sanchez were related.

Also the baptismal godparents of Nicolas and Maria's children seem interesting to note, not sure how much it can help find their origins however.

Godfather of Luisa Sanchez: Estaban de Anda Altamirano y Moreno, the son of Esteban de Anda Saenz de Viduarre and his first wife Josefa Moreno de Ortega.

Godmother of Juana Quiteria Sanchez: Francisca Xaviera de Anda y Moreno, sister of Esteban and wife of Alonso III Moreno de Ortega.
Godfather of Juana: Manuel Alcala Hurtado de Mendoza brother-in-law of Esteban de Anda and son of Lucas Alcala y Garcia de Lara and Maria Guerra Valdes Gallardo (sister of Lorenzo)

Godfather of Miguel Sanchez: Miguel de Alcala Hurtado de Mendoza, brother of Manuel.

Godfather of Jose Sanchez Moreno: Bernardo Rodriguez de Portugal son of Alferez of Lagos Francisco Rodriguez and Ana Gomez de Portugal.

Godfather of Ana Maria Sanchez: Antonio Landeros, son of Agustin Landeros and Juana Gonzalez de Laris (Rubalcava) who was married to Clara Rodriguez de Portugal widow of Lorenzo Guerra Valdez Gallardo owner of Los Sauces and the sister of Bernardo Rodriguez Portugal.

Godparents of Maria Guadalupe Sanchez: Juan de Villalobos Campo and Antonia Petra Galvan de Rojas.

Once again thanks for your time and help and to everyone at Nuestros Ranchos for fantastic resources it offers to all of us. Thanks!

Regards,
Richard Ibarra

Richard,

That's great work you have done in your investigation.

Juan de Villalobos Campo and Antonia Petra Galvan de Rojas were my ancestors. Four of their children married into the Moreno de Ortega family. Nicolás Sánchez Moreno is probably related to the Moreno de Ortega family based on what you have posted.

The first Esteban de Anda Altamirano was the original owner of San Antonio de los Sauces according to a book by Mario Gómez Mata cronista de Lagos de Moreno. He was the grandfather of Esteban de Anda Altamirano y Sáenz de Vidaurre who married Josefa Moreno de Ortega y González de Hermosillo. I don't know if there was another San Antonio at the time.

The Moreno de Ortega family also married into the Gómez de Portugal and Rodríguez de Portugal family. They also married into the Ortiz de Parada family a few times. The Parada family you are talking about probably descend from Sebastián de Parada and María Ortíz de Saavedra which who gave their descendants the Ortiz de Parada compounded surname.

Some of the families mentioned had relatives in Guanajuato in the towns of San Felipe, San Pedro Piedra Gorda (Ciudad Manuel Doblado), León, and San Francisco del Rincón.

Sánchez could come from Sánchez de Porras and Flores could come from Flores de la Torre (Flores a la Torre).

I wish I could be of more help. Maybe someone else can help more.

Armando

Hello,

Thanks again for the info. I finally found the informacion matrimonial for Nicolas Sanchez Moreno and Maria Flores. Here is a link to the page: https://familysearch.org/pal:/MM9.3.1/TH-1-18576-8384-92?cc=1874591&wc=…

It says Nicolas was the son of "padres no conocidos" so maybe he was adopted by the Sanchez Morenos, or was an illegitimate son of a woman of the Sanchez Moreno family and an unknown Angulo. The second option could explain why in the 1740's Nicolas and some of his children started going by the last name Angulo, as he may have found out who his father was. Any ideas on how to get more information on stuff like this?

Also I found a couple more members of the Sanchez Moreno family,

Onofre Sanchez Moreno m. Maria Rojas and had Onofre Bernabe Sanchez Moreno

Maria Rojas died 27 May 1703 vuida de Onofre her son was her Alvacea
and Onofre Bernabe died 27 May 1713 leaving Br. Jacinto Gonzalez de Laris as his Alvacea

Maria Flores was the daughter of Nicolas Flores and Petronila Ponce, originally from Teocaltiche but had been staying with her aunt Josefa Moya married to Simon Perez in Lagos- thats how she met Nicolas Sanchez. I found the Marriage of Nicolas Flores and Petronila as well in Teocaltiche, Petronila is the daughter of Diego Ponce and Josefa Moya or Chavez Fragoso and Nicolas is listed as the son of Francisco Flores and Francisca Flores both from Jalostotitlan.

Also concerning the Parada family the Sanchez family married, the informacion matrimonial of Leonardo Parada and Maria del Rosario Angulo Moreno states they were originally from the villa de Leon. Could that help find their origins as well? Heres the link to the images, this is also the first time Nicolas Sanchez uses the name Angulo.

https://familysearch.org/pal:/MM9.3.1/TH-1-18569-67359-86?cc=1874591&wc…

Thanks in advanced for any help.

Richard Ibarra

How did you know that the mother of Petronila Ponce used the surname Chávez Fragoso? Do you have names of the parents of Josefa Moya or Chávez Fragoso?

A sister of Petronila, Rosa María, married Manuel Chávez Fragoso y Villalobos according to the following page

http://gw5.geneanet.org/sanchiz?lang=es;p=manuel;n=chavez+fragoso+villa…

I looked up the marriage record and it states there was a dispensa

Film 299823 Matrimonios 1663-1702

https://familysearch.org/pal:/MM9.3.1/TH-266-12446-30278-40?cc=1410092&…

That dispensa has not been indexed. It's possible that dispensa is in one of the following two films

Guadalajara Matrimonios 1690-1709 Film 167980 938 pages
Guadalajara Matrimonios 1693-1712 Film 167981 394 pages

Have you found anything more on Francisco Flores and Francisca Flores?

You have been doing a great job with your investigation. If you keep looking at marriages of descendants you might find a dispensa that could help you with Nicolás Sánchez Moreno. Other documents that could help you are wills which aren't indexed for Jalisco. Only a trip to Lagos would help you there.

Armando

Hey Armando

I noticed Josefa de Moya used Chavez in the baptisms of some of her children:
Rosa Maria https://familysearch.org/pal:/MM9.1.1/ND1N-SQB
and
Alejandro https://familysearch.org/pal:/MM9.1.1/J93R-XQG

I assumed because of Rosa Maria's marriage to Manuel Chavez Fragoso Josefa was also a Chavez Fragoso and noticed there was a couple Pedro Chavez Fragoso and Jacinta Moya that seemed to line up chronologically making her Manuel's First Cousin. Of course the dispensa would be needed to prove this but its my working hypothesis until I get a chance to look through those dispensas.

I tried looking for Francisco and Francisca Flores but I couldn't find anything. I also looked through Retonos de Espana en la Nueva Galicia to see if they were in the Flores de la Torre chapter but no luck there. Seeing as they were listed as being from Jalostotitlan I'm leaning towards the idea of them being related in some way to Diego Flores de la Torre y Arias de Valdes, son of the last Encomendero and who was Alcalde Mayor of Lagos and teniente de Alcalde in Jalostotitlan, marrying- supposedly in Jalostotitlan- Teresa Gonzalez de Hermosillo y Gonzalez Florida. However I have no documentary evidence yet just hypothesis.

I've looked at as many of the Informacion Matrimoniales as I could for Nicolas Sanchez's decendents but can not find any mention of his parents yet. Wills sadly will have to wait a while if I can only view them by going to Lagos.

By the way if there are some people in Compostela Nayarit by the name Sanchez Moreno with relationships to an Angulo family there, how likely is it that they are related to the family in Lagos?

Thanks for all your help by the way I really appreciate it.

Richard Ibarra

Genealogy Research