Pedro Muñoz - son or not son of Nicolás Muñoz de Jerez ?

Good morning,

I figured as a new recent member I could pose my first question (many more to follow haha) and be hopeful that someone can shed some light on a roadblock.

My inquiry involves my ancestors Pedro Muñoz and Maria Gonzales, married in 1672 in Lagos de Moreno. Unfortunately the matrimonio record does not list the pretensos parents names nor have I ever encounter the información matrimonial.

I have located the baptisms of 7 children.

After letting this line sit for a while I went on familysearch where individuals have designated
-Pedro Muñoz as the son of Nicolás Muñoz de Jerez and Ana Josefa Gómez de Portugal

Maria Gonzales as the daughter of Francisco Gonzales de Hermosillo and Francisca de Torres

This baffles me, since I can only draw 2 conclusions to connect Nicolás Muñoz de Jerez as Pedro’s father
1. The madrina of Pedro and Maria’s son Miguel (born 1683) was Mariana Muñoz (well documented daughter of Nicolás Muñoz de Jerez)
2. Some of Pedro’s grandchildren (children of his sons) are listed with the full surname of “Muñoz de Jerez”

I however can draw other conclusions why it may not be true since
1. Nicolás Muñoz de Jerez and Ana Josefa Gómes de Portugal were married in Sept 1658 - this tree on family search has no sources but claims Pedro was born 1660, meaning he would be around 12 years old marrying in 1672 (although could work, since their first child was born 3 years later in 1675, he would be ~15)
2. My Pedro Muñoz, Maria Gonzales, and all the children were documented as “mestizos” when clearly Nicolás Muñoz de Jerez and Ana Josefa are always listed as “españoles” (although Pedro’s grandchildren -the ones who all began utilizing Muñoz de Jerez” are all listed as “españoles”

The 1669 padrón for Lagos does not show any household of Nicolás Muñoz de Jerez (which I have documental evidence that his family were residents of León, Guanajuato around this time period)

The 1676 padrón for Lagos the household of Nicolás Muñoz de Jerez is present -sans any Pedro in the household- but is of essentially no help since by 1676 Pedro is already married with a child.

I suppose has anyone ever come across any other documental proof of Nicolás Muñoz de Jerez having a son named Pedro? Perhaps a will/testimony? Any land grants? Anything essentially with mentioning of children or possessions. Or is my Pedro not even of this family.

I took the initiative to message the profile that posted this ancestry and the user didn’t address nothing other than the fact that he was banned from genealogical groups and went on a rant about how everyone disputes his information, how unfairly he is treated blah blah blah.

In any event this line intrigues me greatly since Pedro and Maria are twice my ancestors. And is also of great interest since many of my ancestors for multi generations on other lines were part of the Muñoz de Jerez family’s ownership.

Any help or guidance is appreciated

Comentario

After reading your post I could not see a link to my paternal Munoz line. 

One name that I noticed was Ana Josefa Gómez de Portugal. 

One of the founders of Lagos De Moreno was man named Juan Gomes de Portugal or Capitan Juan Gomes de Portugal. He was married to Cathalina LOPEZ de la MAdrid de la Cuadra y de NAVA Lopez.

They got married about 1558 at Spain.

Juan was the illegitimate grandson of Manuel1st king of Portugal. Juan had up to 17 children. 

When I see the name ending with Gomez de Portugal in the Lagos de Moreno area I assume there is a link to Capitan Juan and his link to royalty.

Good luck on your hunt!

David M.

Comentario

I have never seen the evidence as to who his father is.   Though I did see that he descended from a Jewish woman.  The thing is that when I see the posts that say his father was the king they list someone that wasn’t his mother. 

Rick A. Ricci

Comentario

Hello Rick

I understand your skepticism. My friend looked into my genealogy, and got back to me a few days later saying I was related to Manuel the 1st saying he needs to take a knee and kiss the ring next time he see's me stuff like that.  I thought he was pulling my leg and decided to look into it and prove him wrong.

The more I looked into it the more it made sense. King Manuals 1 son  Luís Duke of Beja of Portugal never married Violante Gomez or at least there is no record of it. She was labelled a Converso from Jewish to Christianity after the Christian Reconquista  of Spain. as a result their children were considered illegitimate. The church was reluctant to marry a Converso or baptize a converso child. The name "Gomez de Portugal". comes from Violante Gomez, and the de Portugal part comes from Luis Duke of Beja of Portugal. 

This is link to one of the sources I found.

  https://www.genealogieonline.nl/en/mcdonald-family-site/I509485.php

Thanks

David M.

 

Comentario

Can you cite a primary source?   A few years ago a genealogist that lived in Colorado did much research on this line, and she could not find any primary sources.  

I have seen that many people take it as a given, but I still would like to see a primary source.