I think what is getting lost in many of these posts is that there were not enough Italian ancestors in Los Altos de Jalisco, or the environs, for an amount of 33% Italian/Greek to be real. Even full Italians don't get 100% Italian DNA in a lot of DNA tests. DNA divides on average about 50% so for a person to really have 33% Italian/Greek they would have to have more than 33% of their genealogical tree with Italian ancestors so the Italian DNA wouldn't get lost in the over the many generations and instead would just recombine. The documented ancestry of the people of the region and the DNA of the people from the region that have tested doesn't support such a large amount of Italian DNA. The 23andme ethnicity calculator is normally much closer to the documented ancestry when looking at autosomal DNA. FTDNA is much better for Y-DNA, mtDNA, and is also useful for finding additional matches from autosomal DNA.

Last March as part of the group, *Nuevo Mundo Historical and Genealogical
Society of Silicon Valley*, I presented a Powerpoint presentation on this
topic, the first colonizers to the America's based solely on the book
mentioned below.

According to Peter Boyd Bowman's book titled Indice Biografico de Cuarenta
Mil Pobladores Españoles De America en el Siglo XVI, Tomo 1 - 1493-1519,
There were 44 Portuguese, 61 Italians, 36 of other origins, most of these
were mariners and merchants. Those who were Italian were mostly from Genoa,
although most of them resided in Sevilla. Most of these arrived and settled
in the Dominican Republic, although some returned to Spain. Genoa at the
time, was known as the center of ship building and sea merchants in the
Iberian Peninsula, therefore it also produced the most mariners. Mariners
was not the same as sailors, those who were mariners and merchants usually
came from well educated, more prosperous families.

Of the first 5,481 colonizers who came to America from 1493-1519, the
majority were from Andalucia.
*These are all provinces within the Community of Andalucia - They were
called comunidades rather than states in España*
For every 6 colonizers, one was identified as a vecino, or neighbor of
Andalucia.
}Sevilla – 1,259 or 58%, Cordoba (180), Jaen (120)
}Huelva - 439 or 20%, Toledo (101), Cadiz (122)

*These provinces were not from Andalucia*
Salamanca (255), Burgos (63), Badajoz (440), Segovia (42) Avila (40)
To a smaller degree, Granada comprising Almeria, Granada and Malaga, 54 or
2.4%, although in 1493, Granada was still not considered part of España as
it was still under Muslim Rule, it was the last community to be conquered
from the Moorish Arabs.

*Among the merchants there were small groups from many of the larger
provinces such as Castilla La Vieja, Zamora, Salamanca, Toledo, Madrid,
Logroño, Valladolid, Segovia and Leon. Why so few? These were the more
educated persons who had either requested permission from King Ferdinand or
had been ordered to accompany Cristobal Colon on his 3 trips to America.*
*Genoveses were from the large Italian commercial families of Sevilla. The
Castellon, Grimaldo and Cataño** families.*milies.

On Wed, Nov 23, 2016 at 8:30 PM, wrote:

> It should be noted that the Crown of Aragon included large portions of
> Italy
> including Sicily and Naples. Under the marriage of Ferdinand and Isabella,
> Castile and Aragon were combined into one state now known as Spain. This
> should explain any Italian lineage you find in Mexico.
>

Last March as part of the group, *Nuevo Mundo Historical and Genealogical
Society of Silicon Valley*, I presented a Powerpoint presentation on this
topic, the first colonizers to the America's based solely on the book
mentioned below.

According to Peter Boyd Bowman's book titled Indice Biografico de Cuarenta
Mil Pobladores Españoles De America en el Siglo XVI, Tomo 1 - 1493-1519,
There were 44 Portuguese, 61 Italians, 36 of other origins, most of these
were mariners and merchants. Those who were Italian were mostly from Genoa,
although most of them resided in Sevilla. Most of these arrived and settled
in the Dominican Republic, although some returned to Spain. Genoa at the
time, was known as the center of ship building and sea merchants in the
Iberian Peninsula, therefore it also produced the most mariners. Mariners
was not the same as sailors, those who were mariners and merchants usually
came from well educated, more prosperous families.

Of the first 5,481 colonizers who came to America from 1493-1519, the
majority were from Andalucia.
*These are all provinces within the Community of Andalucia - They were
called comunidades rather than states in España*
For every 6 colonizers, one was identified as a vecino, or neighbor of
Andalucia.
}Sevilla – 1,259 or 58%, Cordoba (180), Jaen (120)
}Huelva - 439 or 20%, Toledo (101), Cadiz (122)

*These provinces were not from Andalucia*
Salamanca (255), Burgos (63), Badajoz (440), Segovia (42) Avila (40)
To a smaller degree, Granada comprising Almeria, Granada and Malaga, 54 or
2.4%, although in 1493, Granada was still not considered part of España as
it was still under Muslim Rule, it was the last community to be conquered
from the Moorish Arabs.

*Among the merchants there were small groups from many of the larger
provinces such as Castilla La Vieja, Zamora, Salamanca, Toledo, Madrid,
Logroño, Valladolid, Segovia and Leon. Why so few? These were the more
educated persons who had either requested permission from King Ferdinand or
had been ordered to accompany Cristobal Colon on his 3 trips to America.*
*Genoveses were from the large Italian commercial families of Sevilla. The
Castellon, Grimaldo and Cataño** families.*milies.

On Wed, Nov 23, 2016 at 8:30 PM, wrote:

> It should be noted that the Crown of Aragon included large portions of
> Italy
> including Sicily and Naples. Under the marriage of Ferdinand and Isabella,
> Castile and Aragon were combined into one state now known as Spain. This
> should explain any Italian lineage you find in Mexico.
>

Vanessa,

Almost everyone with ancestry from Mexico and Hispanics from U.S. Southwest get a lot of Italian/Greek in their AncestryDNA results. Not a lot of Spaniards and Portuguese have posted their AncestryDNA.

At 23andme Mexicans, including people from Jalisco, and Latin Americans get a lot of Iberian but only sometimes some Italian and no Greek which shows up as Balkan. If they do get Italian it is normally 3% or less but for Spaniards and Portuguese it is not uncommon for them to get 3% or more Italian and a very minute amount of Greek. So the Italian looks to be from more ancient ancestry that has persisted through the Iberian ancestry.

FTDNA myOrigins does not try to separate Iberian and Italian so Mexicans and other Latin Americans wouldn't see a difference there. However, Greeks get a lot of Asia Minor with FTDNA myOrigins but most Hispanics don't.

The Oracles in the Admixture calculators at www.gedmatch.com probably won't show Italian as a possible source of the DNA. You can try them and see what you get for your mother.

Since all three companies have very different results for people from Jalisco, Mexico, Latin America, and Iberia it is hard to tell which company is doing the best job especially when we can't see what other people around the world are getting at AncestryDNA. They all use some HGDP reference populations along with some proprietary datasets that they have created but haven't shared with the other companies or the public. AncestryDNA and 23andme have larger reference datasets than FTDNA myOrigins. Each company also uses their own methodology. 23andme has a proprietary program to phase the datasets before using them as a reference. 23andme has the additional ability to phase customers when a parent and a child have tested. That helps to reduce false positives. So if you were to test yourself and your mother at 23andme her results would be better than if you tested her there by yourself.

Armando