Online Status

Por MariaCortez |

Alicia,

That sounds like an excellent idea. If you end up getting a group together
be sure to let us know.

How about discussing this at our next meeting? Can I add it to the agenda?

Maria

> Message: 1
> Date: Tue, 20 Jun 2006 16:37:50 EDT
> From: Latina1955@aol.com
> Subject: Re: [Nuestros Ranchos] Albums
> To: general@nuestrosranchos.org
> Message-ID: <326.6197171.31c9b69e@aol.com>
> Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII"
>
> Dream talking, huh?
>
> I love your idea....we did the same thing when we went to Puerto Vallarta
> and Cancun. We hired the driver and his van to take us around and paid
> for the
> meals (he went home at night). It wasn't inexpensive (about $100.00 per
> day), but it was worth it because we got to hear the history of the
> towns, were
> taken places no tourists would have gone (and some places where they
> did go),
> ate area local places (both inexpensive/delicious and pricier ones).
>
> If you want to go from dreaming to reality....I would be the first to
> volunteer to go with you guys next summer. I have so wanted to see
> Tlalatenango....but most of my family members are not interested.
>
> Esperanza
>
>
> ------------------------------
>
> Message: 2
> Date: Tue, 20 Jun 2006 14:47:39 -0600
> From: "Jose Aguayo"
> Subject: Re: [Nuestros Ranchos] Albums
> To: , "Alicia Carrillo"
>
> Message-ID: <004f01c694aa$c5b08930$bf03b043@DHNPQT61>
> Content-Type: text/plain; format=flowed; charset="utf-8";
> reply-type=original
>
> Hola Sra. Carillo:
> I am a new member of the group with special interest in the Zacatecan
> cities
> you noted in your dream tour. I would be interested in going if someone
> organizes such a tour. Keep me informed if your plans grow legs.
> Jose Aguayo
> ----- Original Message -----
> From: "Alicia Carrillo"
> To:
> Sent: Tuesday, June 20, 2006 10:15 AM
> Subject: Re: [Nuestros Ranchos] Albums
>
>
> > Vamonos Helyn,
> >
> > And anyone else in the group. Helyn and I were dream
> > talking..........while dream talking we were putting together a group
> tour
> > to Mexico. We would hire a group van and driver to take us to our
> > collective ancestral cities or towns such as Tlaltenango, Momax,
> Colotlan,
> > Jalpa, Calvillo, Aguascalientes, Teocaltiche, Nochistlan etc etc.
> >
> > When we went for my brother's wedding in Guadalajara in 1997, my husband
> > hired the van driver at the airport. The driver hired someone to take
> his
> > place for those 7 days. We rented a suburban, came back, picked him up
> > allowing him time to pack his bags and notify his family that he would
> be
> > away for 7 days.
> >
> > While most of the time was spent either in or close to Guadalajara, we
> did
> > go to Tonala, Nochistlan, Tlachichila and Zapotlanejo. We paid for his
> > meals and lodging if outside of Guadalajara, if in Guadalajara he went
> > home for the evening.
> >
> > So you see this dream talking has legs, it is doable if we think this is
> > something we might want to do.
> >
> > The dreamer,
> > Alicia
>

Maria and all,

It looks like this dream talking could become a reality and sure we can discuss it at our next meeting.

We have 5 dream travelers to date. I think this would make a tour, but of course we would love to have more travelers. Aside from visiting our ancestral towns and cities we can see if we coul have a guest speaker in Mexico do a presentation. Maybe we can get one of the cronistas? The dream continues................Yes, I do belive it would be a good topic for discussion at our next meeting.

1. Jose Aguayo,
2. Esperanza,
3. Helyn Sparkman
4. Alicia Carrillo
5. Patricia Corbera

The Dreamer,
Alicia

Alicia,

That sounds like an excellent idea. If you end up getting a group together
be sure to let us know.

How about discussing this at our next meeting? Can I add it to the agenda?

Maria

> Dream talking, huh?
>
> I love your idea....we did the same thing when we went to Puerto Vallarta
> and Cancun. We hired the driver and his van to take us around and paid
> for the
> meals (he went home at night). It wasn't inexpensive (about $100.00 per
> day), but it was worth it because we got to hear the history of the
> towns, were
> taken places no tourists would have gone (and some places where they
> did go),
> ate area local places (both inexpensive/delicious and pricier ones).
>
> If you want to go from dreaming to reality....I would be the first to
> volunteer to go with you guys next summer. I have so wanted to see
> Tlalatenango....but most of my family members are not interested.
>
> Esperanza
>
>

Hi Alicia,
Add one more to the "dream list," my husband actually asked if he could be included when I told him about the "dream trip."
Tino and Pat Corbera

Alicia Carrillo wrote:
Maria and all,

It looks like this dream talking could become a reality and sure we can discuss it at our next meeting.

We have 5 dream travelers to date. I think this would make a tour, but of course we would love to have more travelers. Aside from visiting our ancestral towns and cities we can see if we coul have a guest speaker in Mexico do a presentation. Maybe we can get one of the cronistas? The dream continues................Yes, I do belive it would be a good topic for discussion at our next meeting.

1. Jose Aguayo,
2. Esperanza,
3. Helyn Sparkman
4. Alicia Carrillo
5. Patricia Corbera

The Dreamer,
Alicia

Alicia,

That sounds like an excellent idea. If you end up getting a group together
be sure to let us know.

How about discussing this at our next meeting? Can I add it to the agenda?

Maria

> Dream talking, huh?
>
> I love your idea....we did the same thing when we went to Puerto Vallarta
> and Cancun. We hired the driver and his van to take us around and paid
> for the
> meals (he went home at night). It wasn't inexpensive (about $100.00 per
> day), but it was worth it because we got to hear the history of the
> towns, were
> taken places no tourists would have gone (and some places where they
> did go),
> ate area local places (both inexpensive/delicious and pricier ones).
>
> If you want to go from dreaming to reality....I would be the first to
> volunteer to go with you guys next summer. I have so wanted to see
> Tlalatenango....but most of my family members are not interested.
>
> Esperanza
>
>

Depending on when you all do it, I may join you as well. As some of you know, my parents now live part time in Villa Guerrero, Jalisco now that they are retired.

I would also be more than happy to facilitate Esteban Valdes Salazar meeting and speaking with you all. He is extremely knowledgeable about the microhistory of Colotlan and Tlaltenango not to mention his native Totatiche. He is an avid genealogical researcher and has an almost infective passion for history and genealogy.

There is decent lodging in Colotlan and Totatiche. It gets a bit rougher in the smaller towns. You can probably hire a private bus for a few days to get you between places. Then you would just need a tour guide and someone to help you book lodging.

Arturo,

Thanks for offering up Esteban Valdes, Salazar, hopefully this will become a reality and not just a dream and if it does happen I hope you can join us. Since we are early into the dream/thought process we don't know yet what the best time frame is for everyone. The Northern California group will meet July 29 in Brentwood and Maria Cortez has suggested that we add this Dream Trip to our agenda. Before we meet I would like to get an idea from those people who have expressed an interest in this trip to tell us what month in 2007 you would prefer. If we get a consensus or near consensus on the date or dates we can begin to discuss all the other issues and options and ideas such as guest speaker, lodging, transportation etc.

Aguascalientes and Teocaltiche also have very decent lodging as well as good eateries and as for the tour guide and ground transportation, my cousins in Nochistlan and Tlachichila can assist me with some of these details, unless someone else has other ideas or good resources.

Thanks everyone for your input.

Alicia

Depending on when you all do it, I may join you as well. As some of you know, my parents now live part time in Villa Guerrero, Jalisco now that they are retired.

I would also be more than happy to facilitate Esteban Valdes Salazar meeting and speaking with you all. He is extremely knowledgeable about the microhistory of Colotlan and Tlaltenango not to mention his native Totatiche. He is an avid genealogical researcher and has an almost infective passion for history and genealogy.

There is decent lodging in Colotlan and Totatiche. It gets a bit rougher in the smaller towns. You can probably hire a private bus for a few days to get you between places. Then you would just need a tour guide and someone to help you book lodging.

I am a Coloradoan who has expressed an interest in the "Dream Trip". Best
times for me are in the months of April, June, or July. Autumn would not
work for me because I am going to Spain to do some research there.
Jose Aguayo

Jose Aguayo wrote:

>Arturo:
>I am a Coloradoan who has expressed an interest in the "Dream Trip". Best
>times for me are in the months of April, June, or July. Autumn would not
>work for me because I am going to Spain to do some research there.
>
okay. . .hmmm, so who are you going to take with you from the group. Are
you going to Seville?

I've heard that a lot of what you can find in the Archivo de Indias in
Seville can also be found in Mexico City (Ask Mickey Garcia). I also
heard that it takes a lot of preliminary work just to be able to get
into some of the libraries in Spain. Almost like you have to know
someone just to get in. I don't really know just some things I"ve heard.

Mickey Can you comment for us?

joseph

>Jose Aguayo
>

I don't know if going on the grand tour is in MY future, but I always thought that a trip to the Jalisco-Zacatecas area would at some time coincide with the Mariachi Festival in Guadalajara (September). After all that research - you gotta party, right?
I will look forward to see how all this progresses - Good luck!!

Natalie

In Guadalajara there is always something going on. In October are "Las fiestas de Octubre", this goes on for one month during October throughout Guadalajara. Every night there are live performances as in music, song and dance, live theatre, poetry readings etc and is spread out throughout the city.

In April Aguascalientes has it's Feria de San Marcos that I believe lasts for a week and is supposed to be spectacular.

Every town has it's yearly Fiestas Patronales, which is the feast of the Patron Saint of each town. I believe Enrique talked about Papiaquis in Nochistlan but I can't recall what month it takes place. My town of Tlachichila Zac is in September, begins the 15th and ends the 28th, it's the feast of San Agustin. It feels and sounds like a Mariachi Festival. There are at least 10 wonderful Mariachis with many of them natives of Tlachichila and Nochistlan as this is an area of the country that produces many musicians. You also have Bandas and Conjuntos Norteños, all in the same plaza and it lasts for 2 weeks.

I will do some research about the various ancestral towns to see when their fiestas take place, Natalie is right you have to party after doing so much research.

Alicia

I concur with Alicia, in the large cities: Guadaljara, Zacatecas and Aguascalientes something is always going on. All three cities have major universities with major museums, libraries, cultural events as well as fun places to be merry. All three cities are hubs for their region with fine, world class accomodations, some of these hotels were re-adapted to hostels or 5 star hotels; for exaple in Zacatecas their finest hotel was built around a former "bullring"; the Quinta Real. Here's their website: www.quintareal.com.
I was Nochistlan in January. They have a couple of nice small hotels, i stayed at the one accross the street from the "Jardin" - nice. Many of the towns we hail from have very informative websites, check them out. For Fiestas, the link below will take you to Nochistlan's.
http://www.nochistlan.gob.mx/fiestas.html
Nochistlan's papaqui's are in mid-January, the "Fiestas de Octubre, Peregrinaje de la Virgen de Toyahua and "HIjo Ausente" are listed in the site above. El Hijo ausente is the day that Nochistlan welcomes all its sons and daughters back to Nochistlan from all over the world - literally.
Teocaltiche is only 15 minutes from Nochistlan, while Aguascalientes is about an hour. Teocaltiche has a feast in early November.

The pictures I posted recently in the Nuestros Ranchos website are captured moments from the 2006 papaqui.

I may join you in the group tour....at this time i dont want to specify a favorable time for me, usually I can join the group most times fo the year.

Enrique Legaspi Frias

Alicia Carrillo wrote:
In Guadalajara there is always something going on. In October are "Las fiestas de Octubre", this goes on for one month during October throughout Guadalajara. Every night there are live performances as in music, song and dance, live theatre, poetry readings etc and is spread out throughout the city.

In April Aguascalientes has it's Feria de San Marcos that I believe lasts for a week and is supposed to be spectacular.

Every town has it's yearly Fiestas Patronales, which is the feast of the Patron Saint of each town. I believe Enrique talked about Papiaquis in Nochistlan but I can't recall what month it takes place. My town of Tlachichila Zac is in September, begins the 15th and ends the 28th, it's the feast of San Agustin. It feels and sounds like a Mariachi Festival. There are at least 10 wonderful Mariachis with many of them natives of Tlachichila and Nochistlan as this is an area of the country that produces many musicians. You also have Bandas and Conjuntos Norteños, all in the same plaza and it lasts for 2 weeks.

I will do some research about the various ancestral towns to see when their fiestas take place, Natalie is right you have to party after doing so much research.

Alicia

well not sure I am going, but things you should consider is getting some
local input on the weather. There is a hot time and a rainy time. The
rainy time could be a challenge as far as getting around. Just what I've
heard so maybe its not that big a deal to consider. Also at certain
times you might get the fiestas. . .maybe around Christmas time. .
.maybe Arturo knows about this.

joseph

Alicia Carrillo wrote:

>Arturo,
>
>Thanks for offering up Esteban Valdes, Salazar, hopefully this will become a reality and not just a dream and if it does happen I hope you can join us. Since we are early into the dream/thought process we don't know yet what the best time frame is for everyone. The Northern California group will meet July 29 in Brentwood and Maria Cortez has suggested that we add this Dream Trip to our agenda. Before we meet I would like to get an idea from those people who have expressed an interest in this trip to tell us what month in 2007 you would prefer. If we get a consensus or near consensus on the date or dates we can begin to discuss all the other issues and options and ideas such as guest speaker, lodging, transportation etc.
>
>Aguascalientes and Teocaltiche also have very decent lodging as well as good eateries and as for the tour guide and ground transportation, my cousins in Nochistlan and Tlachichila can assist me with some of these details, unless someone else has other ideas or good resources.
>
>Thanks everyone for your input.
>
>Alicia
>
>
>Depending on when you all do it, I may join you as well. As some of you know, my parents now live part time in Villa Guerrero, Jalisco now that they are retired.
>
>I would also be more than happy to facilitate Esteban Valdes Salazar meeting and speaking with you all. He is extremely knowledgeable about the microhistory of Colotlan and Tlaltenango not to mention his native Totatiche. He is an avid genealogical researcher and has an almost infective passion for history and genealogy.
>
>There is decent lodging in Colotlan and Totatiche. It gets a bit rougher in the smaller towns. You can probably hire a private bus for a few days to get you between places. Then you would just need a tour guide and someone to help you book lodging.

The area is very arid and there are basically two seasons, a season of mud and a season of dust. The temperatures do vary somewhat, but it never gets really hot because the altitude is so high... unless of course you get down in the Bolanos canyon. The rainy season can be somewhat treacherous for travel in back areas since there are flash floods (heavy tropical rains where no rain has fallen for months) and mud but the roads have improved tremendously in recent years and most paved roads are well drained, etc.

I think the best time of the year to go is in early autumn. There are still lots of rituals related to end of the corn growing season (September) and the weather is ideal then... almost no rain but things are still green and temperatures don't drop so much at night.

The spring is also nice, especially if anybody wants to make a jaunt down to the beach. December and early January are not a good time to go because half of the Mexican immigrants in the US go down and flights are very expensive, it is impossible to find lodging or rental cars, etc.

We can perhaps try to figure out when some of the towns have their Fiestas and try to coordinate around those. These tend to be in the winter however... people historically had less work then I suppose.

I spent 30 days in Mexico in 2003, we went the last week of March and 3 weeks of April. We were in Guadalajara during Easter and everything was closed for abt 4 days.. that was a surprise but the festivities with the churchs were amazing. I was in Guadalajara, Tapalpa, El Grullo, El Limon and then went on by bus to Zacatecas City for 4 days and then into Jerez Zacatecas for a week.. the weather was cool in the evenings and beautiful during the day. We returned to Guadalajara for Easter week.
Weather is something to consider..
Linda in Everett

arturoramos wrote:

The area is very arid and there are basically two seasons, a season of mud and a season of dust. The temperatures do vary somewhat, but it never gets really hot because the altitude is so high... unless of course you get down in the Bolanos canyon. The rainy season can be somewhat treacherous for travel in back areas since there are flash floods (heavy tropical rains where no rain has fallen for months) and mud but the roads have improved tremendously in recent years and most paved roads are well drained, etc.

I think the best time of the year to go is in early autumn. There are still lots of rituals related to end of the corn growing season (September) and the weather is ideal then... almost no rain but things are still green and temperatures don't drop so much at night.

The spring is also nice, especially if anybody wants to make a jaunt down to the beach. December and early January are not a good time to go because half of the Mexican immigrants in the US go down and flights are very expensive, it is impossible to find lodging or rental cars, etc.

We can perhaps try to figure out when some of the towns have their Fiestas and try to coordinate around those. These tend to be in the winter however... people historically had less work then I suppose.

History, Culture and General Discussion