Nuestros Ranchos Site

-----Original Message-----
From: Al Duarte
[mailto:aduarte@...]
Sent: Thursday, September 09, 2004
9:33 AM
To: ranchos@yahoogroups.com
Subject: RE: [ranchos]
Names

In
my genealogy research using records of baptism (1700-1800) from Zacatecas
and Chihuahua, I found when a child was born out of wedlock, the child would
take the mother's last name.  The father's name was never mentioned or

size=2>-----Original Message-----
From: Joseph Puentes
[mailto:makas@...]
Sent: Wednesday, September 15, 2004 2:26
PM
To: loulou_rodriguez; LosRanchos
Subject: [ranchos]
wrong Las Animas, sorry

oops sorry I should have read
further before I just posted my message.
My relatives came from Las Animas
that is close to Santa Maria de Los
Angeles not the one close to
Nochistlan,

sorry,

joseph

oops sorry I should have read further before I just posted my message.
My relatives came from Las Animas that is close to Santa Maria de Los
Angeles not the one close to Nochistlan,

sorry,

joseph

Hi Everyone!
I realize my introduction to the Ranchos Group is well overdue. My
name is Lourdes Rodriguez Jimenez. I have been researching my
ancestors off and on for a few years now but have dedicated much time
to my research over the last year. My family is from a ranch

Here is some humor that I found in a message board.  I
hope you get a laugh out of it like I did and realize
that all of our ancestors did this.
 
ANCESTORS GUIDE TO NAMING

  1) Thou shalt name your male children: James, John,
  Joseph, Abel, Richard, Thomas or William.

  2) Thou shalt name your female children: Elizabeth,
  Mary, Martha, Maria, Sarah, Ida, Virginia or Mae.

  3) Thou shalt leave NO trace of your female
children.

  4) Even after naming your children using the above
  lists, thou shalt never refer to them by those names
  again; instead, thou shalt call them by strange
  nicknames, such as: Ike, Eli, Polly, Dolly, and
Sukey.

  5) Thou shalt not use any middle names on ANY legal
  documents or census reports and whenever possible,
use only initials on legal documents.

  6) Thou shalt learn to sign all documents illegibly
so that your surname can be spelled, or misspelled in
  various ways: Tipper, Topper, Hopper, Tucker,
Tapper.

  7) Thou shalt, after no more than

Hi Everyone!
I realize my introduction to the Ranchos Group is well overdue. My 
name is Lourdes Rodriguez Jimenez. I have been researching my 
ancestors off and on for a few years now but have dedicated much time 
to my research over the last year. My family is from a ranch called 
Las Animas (also known as Daniel Camarena) which is located 
approximately 1-2 miles outside of Nochistlan, Zacatecas. 

The surnames I am researching are as follows: Rodriguez, Jimenez, 
Romo, Oropesa, Ramires, Ortega, Contreras, Martines, Borrayo, 
Lomelin, Cervantes (Quesada), Melendres, Padilla, Donlucas, Nunon 
(Nunez), Delgadillo, Quirarte, Prieto and Macias. I have not traced 
any of my ancestors outside of Nochistlan, yet! My earliest data 
dates back to the mid 1800s - late 1700s.

I was really exciting about finding this group and I truly look 
forward to working with all of you, sharing ideas, tips and 
information.

Sincerely,
Loulou

 

Alicia: I understand that there is a term, that has been passed down for generations.

"hijos de la Iglesia"

Happy Hunting/Helyn

alice_wissing wrote:

Thanks everybody for your interesting feedback.  Another perspective
is that if an illegitimate child was born of an Indian woman without
a last name and a man with one, the child would be given the
father's last name by default.

As far as some states never mentioning or listing the father's name,
why would the priests try so hard to protect his identity?  Double
standards, perhaps, or is there a Catholic or cultural thing I'm not
understanding?

Thanks - I always learn so much from this group.

Alicia

---

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size=2>-----Original Message-----
From: alice_wissing
[mailto:alice_wissing@...]
Sent: Friday, September 10, 2004
9:20 AM
To: ranchos@yahoogroups.com
Subject: [ranchos]
Responses to my Names Message

Thanks everybody for
your interesting feedback.  Another perspective
is that if an
illegitimate child was born of an Indian woman without
a last name and a
man with one, the child would be given the
father's last name by
default.

As far as some states never mentioning or listing the father's
name,
why would the priests try so hard to protect his identity? 
Double
standards, perhaps, or is there a Catholic or cultural thing I'm
not
understanding?

Thanks - I always learn so much from this
group.

Alicia

Thanks everybody for your interesting feedback.  Another perspective
is that if an illegitimate child was born of an Indian woman without
a last name and a man with one, the child would be given the
father's last name by default.

As far as some states never mentioning or listing the father's name,
why would the priests try so hard to protect his identity?  Double
standards, perhaps, or is there a Catholic or cultural thing I'm not
understanding?

Thanks - I always learn so much from this group.

Alicia

Thanks everybody for your interesting feedback.  Another perspective 
is that if an illegitimate child was born of an Indian woman without 
a last name and a man with one, the child would be given the 
father's last name by default.

As far as some states never mentioning or listing the father's name, 
why would the priests try so hard to protect his identity?  Double 
standards, perhaps, or is there a Catholic or cultural thing I'm not 
understanding?
 
Thanks - I always learn so much from this group.

Alicia

Hello Janet.

I think I had contact with you in the past. I am sorry to tell you, 
but my Cervantes ancestors are all from the Zacoalco area (Santa 
Catarina, San Marcos, Atotonilco el Bajo, San Andres, Los Pozos). 
Also, I strongly believe that my Ramirez line is from El Crucero, a 
town close to Zacoalco.

However, I do have ancestors from Atenguillo and Acatitlan, which is 
close to Guachinango. My family surnames from this area are Curiel, 
Diaz, Pena, and Casares, but I have not researched these lines a lot. 
Something interesting that I have noticed is that everytime I know of 
someone researching this area, they all have a Curiel branch on their 
family tree. I bet that you do, too. Once, when I was checking a 
baptism book from Atenguillo, I noticed that "Curiel" was one of the 
most common surnames in the index. Up to this date I have confirmed a 
family tie to only one other Curiel researcher, but I am confident 
that all the Curieles around this area descend from a single

And also, why would only a first name be listed for a mother? I see this
all the time while perusing the IGI.

I too have noticed that at times the mother's surname is not listed
on one christening record and is written on others. However, with the
records I've researched, when the surname is not ever mentioned, she
probably was Indian. The father's surname is often not mentioned either if
he was Indian, especially in the 1700s.

~Deena Ortiz~

Hello. During my research, I once found a record of an illegitimate 
child just by chance. I was checking the baptisms in Atotonilco el 
bajo/santa clara, Jalisco of children with the last name Cervantes. 
Most of them were not related to me, but I found a girl whose last 
name was Cervantes. she was the illegitimate daughter of a woman with 
the last name Hernandez and of my greatgrandfather's brother Bacilio 
Apodaca. However, she was not named neither Apodaca or Hernandez. 
Why? Because in the record it showed that this child was not claimed 
by the father, but by the paternal grandmother, Guadalupe Cervantes. 
So, in this case, the child inherited the paternal's grandmother's 
maiden surname. 

I believe there's not a standard about naming illegitimate children, 
since my second great grandfather Evaristo Ramirez kept the last name 
of his father, even though he was a natural child.

--- In ranchos@yahoogroups.com, "alice_wissing"  
wrote:
> While looking at the

-----Original Message-----
From: alice_wissing
[mailto:alice_wissing@...]
Sent: Wednesday, September 08, 2004
4:56 PM
To: ranchos@yahoogroups.com
Subject: [ranchos]
Names

While looking at the International Genealogical
Index I came across
an ancestor possibly having a child with a woman other
than his wife
during the late 1700's.  The child carried the father's
last name
only (no mother's name attached at the end)and only the mother's

first name was listed.  I was under the impression an illegitimate

child never used his father