I can go into the website but when I want to open the document, it doesn't open.
http://sigue.aguascalientes.gob.mx/axweb/
to get in username: sigue.publica
password: publica
FamilySearch currently has baptismal records until 1682 for Ayotlan. However, there are some references to there being baptismal records back until 1622.
Rafa,
I Found 20 years records of Pre 1682 bapismal records for Ayotlan exactly of the period March 4, 1662 - April 28, 1683
I'm also interested in found the origin of our ancestors Bartolome de Aguirre who married Michaela Mendoza/Peres/Orosco
The records are in the film: Mexico, Jalisco, Catholic...Church Records, 1590-1979 Ayotlán San Agustín Bautismos de hijos legítimos 1717-1726
Starting on IMAGE 174
https://familysearch.org/ark:/61903/3:1:9392-F4GK-5?cc=1874591&wc=3JHC-…
Saludos!!
Gabriel E. Aguirre
Thank you Gabriel.
When I have a chance I'll make sure to go through those records and look for clues.
Rafael,
I descend from Bartolomé de Aguirre and María de Mendoza thru their daughter María de Aguirre y Mendoza, aka María de Mendoza who married Antonio de Vargas Machuca y Liébana on 15 Feb 1713 in Ayotlán.
For our interest, this is my line who traveled from Ayotlán to el Real y Minas de Guanajuato and then back to la Provincia de Avalos, ending up in Guadalajara.
Bartolomé de Aguirre
María de Mendoza
Andrea de Vargas Machuca
Magdalena Hernández-Gamiño
Hilario Cos y León
Joseph Cos León
Luisa Cos y León
Cor. Francisco Serrano
Gen. Juan Serrano
Luisa Serrano
Martín Méndez de Torres
Gabriel Méndez de Torres (my father)
I have always suspected these Aguirre originated in Guanajuato and are in fact "López de Aguirre" from Irapuato, Gto. However, it is only a theory.
Daniel Méndez de Torres y Camino
Pleasure to meet you, Daniel. Would you mind sharing more about your theory?
Siento que en Jalostotitlan. Ayo el chico al igual que en San Francisco del Rincón faltan partidas matrimoniales y de matrimonio ya que en dispensas Valladolid hay unas transcripción de varias partidas bautismales se cambio de jurisdicción de Guadalajara a Michoacan , y en algunas partidas maatrimoniales de Aguascalientes mencionan que mandaron la fe de bautismo de San Juan de los Lagos o de Jalostotitlan para poder efectuarse el matrimonio antes de 1689 que es cuando comienzan las partidas bautismales en Jalostotitlan _san Juan
Lamentablemente no creo que se encuentren todos esos documentos tan valiosos para la genealogia Altense
Si. Pero lo interesante es la investigacion de Jose Zocimo Orosco en cual uso registros baptismales de Ayo de 1622 a 1682. Estos no estan en FamilySearch y nadamas quiero ver si alguien mas sabe como pudo el obtenerlos y como los podria yo obtener.
E tratado de conectarme con Jose (es maestro en la universidad de Guadalajara) pero no e tenido suerte.
Rafa,
The underlined word in the margin is Cabrito, which is where Bartolomé lived with his wife. This information is also given in the text: "...ambos españoles [del] Cabrito..."
According to Google Maps, el Cabrito is located near Arandas.
I hope this helps.
Maybe this is interesting for your research: FamilySearch catalog has baptismal records since 1682 for Ayotlan / Ayo el Chico.
Hacienda de San Agustín del Vergel (home of the painter Manuel Felguerez who recently died)
https://portalvalparaiso.info/hacienda-de-san-agustin-del-vergel/
Leo con mucho interés lo que nos cuenta sobre estas Haciendas. Tengo un particular interés en algunas, especialmente San Antonio de la Sauceda, San José de Llanetes y la Hacienda de Abrego. Esto es porque mi ancestro José González Cosío hacia el año 1817 realizó el Inventario de Bienes de Don Vicente Joaquín de Miranda, su suegro, quien lo nombró Albacea junto con su viuda, Doña María Xaviera Francisca de Landa. En ese tiempo Don José González Cosío era además el apoderado de la Hacienda de Abrego. Desde luego que he leido todo lo que he podido acerca de dichas Haciendas, pero en particular ahora estoy tratando de establecer la descendencia de Don Vicente Joaquin de Miranda y algo he logrado, pero también hay algunos puntos que no he podido deslindar. Cuando Don José Gonzalez Cosío hace dicho inventario de bienes en su calidad de Albacea, lleva a cabo también algunas diligencias para mejor cumplir con el testamento de Don Vicente Joaquín de Miranda y por la detenida lectura de esos documentos que ahora obran en mi poder, pasando de generación en generación hasta mi padre y finalmente a mi, es claro que Doña Xaviera de Landa fue su segunda esposa y con ella tuvo 4 hijos, dos mujeres y dos hombres. En dichos documentos se menciona a una de sus hijas, Maria Guadalupe Josefa, casada con Don Joaquin de Uribarry y radicados ellos en Sombrerete. Los dos hijos se mencionan tambien con claridad y son Jose María Marcelino y José Ma. Bartolomé (me parece que es José Manuel)y lo curioso es que no se menciona precisamente a la hija casada con Don José González Cosío, y no he podido encontrar aún datos precisos de ella. Es casi seguro que fue la segunda esposa de él y yo desciendo de su primera esposa. También se con certeza que José María Marcelino casó en primeras nupcias con Ramona Ruiz de Chavez y en segundas nupcias, en Aguascalientes en 1823, con Guadalupe Zamora, que era hermana de Remigio Zamora, esposo de una de sus hijas del primer matrimonio. Pero me falta encontrar el nexo entre José María Marcelino Miranda y el nieto de él que fue el último dueño de la Hacienda de San José de Llanetes y que me parece fue José María Miranda Ramirez casado con María del Refugio Zamora. Tal vez el José María Miranda que usted menciona sea el hijo de José María Marcelino, pero no logro aún saber si es hijo de su primer matrimonio o del segundo, es decir si es José María Miranda Chavez o José María Miranda Zamora. Tal vez usted tenga algún dato que me ayude. Saludos cordiales.
Jesus Cabral
Hello everyone. My Name is Robert Sheldon. I am excited to be part of this group. I have read a lot of posts here and it has been very informative.
I'm not sure what info you need.
Maria Dominga Sanchez Castellanos is my 2nd cousin 5x removed.
Maria Francisca Antonia Carlos de Godoy is my 2nd cousin 6x removed.
Most of the info on both of them appear to come from Jalisco, Mexico. Of course some marriages do occur in Zacatecas. I have seen other unrelated Villasenors info in Jalisco.
Joseph De Leon
Joseph,
i am stuck right here
Maria Dominga Sanchez Castellanos is my 4th Great Grandmother
Maria Francisca Antonia Carlos de Godoy is my 5th Great Grandmother
The issue i have is the dates do not add up and it seems that a generation is missing. Felipe Villasenor and Dominga are well documented in Cienega de Romo Monte Escobedo having kids starting in 1793. Most likely they were born around est. 1770
The Marriage of Phelipe Doroteo Villasenor and Maria Francisca Antonia Carlos de Godoy was 1756. He was 29 and i believe if you look real close in the margin you see that Francisca Antonia was 14 which puts his birth around 1727 and hers at 1742. I am trying to trace the Villasenor line back to the arrival in Mexico which most likely is with Conquistador Juan de Villasenor y Orozco Tovar
I don't think both Felipes are the same.
Maria Dominga Sanchez Castellanos parents are Esteban Sanchez Castellanos b. abt 1727 d.bef 1808 Monte Escobedo. and Juana de San Pablo del Real b. Apr 1741 in Colotlan, Jalisco
and died 3 JUN 1785 in Monte Escobedo.
I hope this helps you.
Joseph
Yes you are correct. my guess would be
1. Felipe Villasenor b. abt 1770 Monte Escobedo
Maria Dominga Sanchez Castellanos b. art 1770 Monte Escobedo
4. Unknown
5. Unknown
6. Phelipe Doroteo Villasenor b. 1727 Real Hostotipac, Bolanos Jalisco
7. Maria Francisca Antonia Carlos de Godoy . abt 1742 La Troje Tepetongo Zac.
8. Juan Antonio Morales Villasenor b. abt. 1705 Bolanos Jalisco
9. Ma. Gertrudis de los Rios b. 1710 Mesquitec, Jalisco
10. Ildefonso Carlos de Godoy b. 1710 Jerez, Zac.
11. Antonia Fuastina Delgado b. unk. unk.
Would you have a lead on the parents of Juan Antonio Morales Villasenor?
Thanks
In searching posts on Villaseñor that may help to go further beyond a dead end I got, your mention of 6. Phelipe Doroteo Villaseñor b. 1727 Real Hostotipac, Bolaños, Jal. call my atention because the dead end I found is Nicolás Villaseñor and Teresa Ramirez whose marriage was in Bolaños in 1778. Unfortunately the marriage record doesn't say a word about their parents and the Información Matrimonial record is in a book not available in familySearch. This Nicolas is my ancestor and the lineage is clear from him to present day, but now I need to see if your 6. Phelipe Doroteo Villasenor b. 1727 Real Hostotipac, Bolanos Jalisco could be related to him.
Saludos
J. Cabral
Hello everyone. I am trying to find more information about a potential marriage of a Juan de Villaseñor and Maria Vallejo who appear as padrinos in a marriage in 1690 in Celaya, Guanajuato.
Hola Isaac:
La familia Villaseñor ha sido más investigada que otras, así que resulta más probable dar con tus antepasados que buscando en la familia Vallejo.
Sobre los Villaseñor hay en línea un PDF que se llama "Los de Villaseñor" y allí viene las ramas principales, no encontré directamente a un Juan Villaseñor en Celaya, sin embargo hubo una rama con el apellido "Del Castillo- Villaseñor" y un Juan que suprimía la parte "Del Castillo" en el XVII. Fueron dueños de la Hacienda de Puroagua, en Apaseo el Alto muy cerca de Celaya y Querétaro. Podrías intentar en Geneanet donde hay varios estudios de los Villaseñor.
Respecto de María Vallejo encontré a una María bautizada en Querétaro el 14 de abril de 1665, hija de Juan Vallejo y Margarita Isabel, ésta niña tuvo un padrino muy poderoso: Don Bernardo de Suasnabar.
Saludos
Marcelina
Marcelina:
Mil gracias por la información. Creo que me has ayudado a abrir nuevas rutas de investigación sobre la familia Vallejo con tu mención de Querétaro. Tendré que investigar más en este estado.
Saludos ,
Isaac
I am also investigating my Villaseñor ancestry, that is why I found your post. But while I have no knowledge of this Villaseñor in Celaya I have roots in Celaya and some Vallejo in my lineage and maybe or very likely the Vallejo family you are researching comes from Valle de Santiago, which is the case in my Vallejo family and I was surprised to see so many Vallejo in Valle de Santiago. I think most Vallejo in Celaya, Querétaro and around have they roots in Valle de Santiago and sometimes in a particular location, not far from Valle de Santiago: Hacienda de Pantoja, in the parish of San José de Parangueo. I wish this may help you out.
In my Villaseñor I am on a dead end apparently, but I want to post about this in the next few days to see if I can have some help here.
Hi,
Can you provide us with estimate dates?
Yes Antonio Arteaga and Ma. Ygnacia Oseguera married approximately in 1815.
Petronilo Arteaga and Ma. del Carmen Oseguera married approximately in 1831.
Sorry, My information from the inhabitants of Cotija is from 1736 to 1770 approximately.
Cotija was such a small town that almost everyone there were related to one another
I suggest you keep your eye open for the names you are researching here:
https://www.valladoliddispensas.com/
As they may have descendants that intermarried
Best of luck
Hola a todos,
Hace un tiempo, un miembro del grupo menciono unos Padrones de Jerez, Zacatecas
Gracias por la respuesta. Si, ya trate de comunicarme con este miembro hace unos diez dias
pero no he tenido respuesta.
Quizá tengas que intentarlo de nuevo, yo ya tengo esos padrones, son tres colecciones, unas más completas que otras, con diferentes grados de legibiidad. En mi caso me ayudaron mucho para establecer dos datos que necesitaba confirmar y descubrir dos datos nuevos que sin estos padrones no creo que lo hubiera logrado.
Padrones de Jerez, Zacatecas 1733 > NO MICROFILMADOS
http://www.nuestrosranchos.org/node/24695
Hello, I'm a new active member of Nuestros Ranchos, although and old visitor to this great site.
Buenos días a todos,
Nuevamente necesito su opinión sobre un reciente misterio.
Buenos días.
Buenas noches Erik,
Joseph Bravo de Mendoza y Morón y su mujer, Ana de Ulibarri bautizaron a otro hijo también llamado Francisco el 12 de marzo de 1681 en Valladolid. ¿Supongo pudiera ser el tuyo?
¿Has podido trazar la rama de este Antonio de Alexandre? Sería interesante si lo vinculáramos con mis Alexandre Villaroel en Pátzcuaro. También tengo un rompecabezas con los Bravo de Mendoza. Pues, mi tío Jacinto Rodríguez Torrero casó en Pátzcuaro con María Bravo de Mendoza, quien creo que pudiera ser la misma bautizada el 19 de marzo de 1635, hija de Gonzalo Bravo de Mendoza y Catalina Morón. Aquí te paso el matrimonio de Jacinto y María:
https://www.familysearch.org/ark:/61903/3:1:9392-5R9L-5R?i=115&cc=18833…
A cuanto los Pérez de Garfias, ¿será tu Nicolás el mismo que casó a María de Acosta, también Almanza, el 28 de febrero de 1650 en Zamora? Este fue hijo legítimo de Antonio Pérez de Garfias y Jerónima de Ochoa y Garibay, también Castañeda.
Un saludo afectuoso,
Daniel
Buenos días Daniel,
Muchas gracias por tu amable respuesta y el enlace. Francisco Bravo de Mendoza y Nicolasa bautizan a su hijo Gregorio el 2 de Diciembre de 1685 https://www.familysearch.org/ark:/61903/3:1:9392-RH99-D?i=108&cc=1883388 siendo padrinos del niño Nicolás Pérez de Garfias y Ángela de Alvarado y Sotomayor a quienes tengo como padres de Nicolasa.
Por las fechas Francisco Bravo de Mendoza y Ulibarri debe ser sobrino. Francisco Bravo de Mendoza podría ser él mismo un tardío Bravo de Mendoza y Morón o en su defecto un hijo de alguno de ellos, por vía paterna o materna. Curiosamente, Eugenia Morón, madrina de mi antepasada Antonia Bravo de Mendoza, resulta hija de padres no conocidos por lo que tampoco descarto que Francisco Bravo lo sea.
Por cierto, antes de que se me pase: sobre los Morón existe un pasaje a Indias. Catalina, esposa de Gonzalo Bravo de Mendoza, es hija de Juan Morón y de María Guajardo. (Está en PARES: Expediente de información y licencia de pasajero a indias de Juan de Morón, natural de Bordalba (Palafox), hijo de Juan de Morón y Juana del Royal, con su mujer María Guajardo, hija de Juan Guajardo y Catalina de Cardos, y sus hijos Juan, Inés y Clara de Morón, naturales de Bordalba (Palabox), a Nueva España).
En el acta de matrimonio de Gonzalo y de Catalina ella aparece como hija de Juan Morón y María Guajardo (20 de Febrero de 1634)
Sobre Nicolás Pérez de Garfias, sí, debe ser el mismo. No tenía noticias del matrimonio que mencionas con María de Acosta.
Sobre los Alexandre, el acta de matrimonio dice que Antonio es hijo de Bernabé de Alexandre y de Mariana de Morales. La partida de matrimonio desafortunadamente no arroja datos sobre los padres de Bernabé: https://www.familysearch.org/ark:/61903/3:1:9392-RHHP?i=154&cc=1883388, de Mariana solo dice que era viuda de Juan de Contreras.
Quizás Bernabé nació hacia 1620/1630? Qué opinas?
Buen Dia a Todos,
Desafortunadamente, tengo un solo dato para compartir sobre la posible ascendencia de Francisco Bravo de Mendoza... Existe un registro (Lista de cofrades de Morelia, Michoacan, Mexico 1589-1653) en donde se presentaron como cofrades un tal Manuel Bravo y su esposa Francisca de Mendoza, juntos con un hijo - Francisco Bravo:
Morelia, Michoacan, Mexico - 6 de Febrero 1587
Por los nombres, quizas podria ser un antepasado de Francisco Bravo de Mendoza (Esposo de Nicolasa de Chavez)?
Tambien les comparto lo siguiente sobre los padres de Nicolasa de Chaves y Alvarado Sotomayor. No hay duda sobre la madre de Nicolasa quien fue Angela de Alvarado y Sotomayor. Segun los datos que tengo, Angela fue casada dos veces. La primera con Andres Ruiz de Chavez y despues con Nicolas Perez de Garfias.
Aqui esta el enlace de la informacion matrimonial entre Nicolas Perez de Garfias y Angela de Alvarado y Sotomayor:
Morelia, Michoacan, Mexico - 12 de Diciembre de 1669
La informacion menciona de que ambos fueron viudos, Angela de Andres Ruiz de Chavez.
Nicolas fue viudo de Maria de Almanza y Acosta, aqui les comparto la partida de su matrimonio en Zamora:
Zamora, Michoacan, Mexico - 2 de Febrero de 1650
Volviendo al matrimonio de Andres y Angela, tuvieron varios hijos. Pienso que, por los apellidos que usaba, Nicolasa (Chavez y Alvarado Sotomayor) fue hija de Andres Ruiz de Chavez y no Nicolas Perez de Garfias.
Andres y Angela bautizaron por lo menos a los siguientes hijos:
Tengo a otra hija de Andres y Angela, Antonia, quien se caso con Antonio Ortiz de Zarate/Gamboa:
Morelia, Michoacan, Mexico - 21 de Julio de 1667
Espero les sirvan estos datos.
Saludos,
Daniel Serna Valencia
Justo despues de escribir el mensaje anterior, encontre la informacion matrimonial de Nicolasa y Francisco! Desafortunadamente no hay mencion de los padres de Francisco:
Morelia, Michoacan, Mexico - 21 de Enero de 1681
Sobre Nicolasa y sus padres (aumenta el misterio!), existe la siguiente nota:
No se si los testigos no conocian muy bien a Nicolasa, etc. ya que otros testigos no vuelven a mencionar la ilegitimidad de Nicolasa.
Saludos,
Daniel Serna Valencia
Estimado Daniel,
De corazón mil gracias, la información es fantástica y efectivamente el misterio aumenta. Tu hallazgo es una muestra más del gran valor de los informes matrimoniales y los tesoros que ellos esconden. Si Nicolasa es hija adoptiva de dicho matrimonio o no, es difícil ya establecerlo. Su partida de bautismo y matrimonio efectivamente la hacen hija legítima pero el hecho que un testigo diga que es "criada y tenida por hija de" es motivo de duda.
También te agradezco mucho los importantes datos sobre los Bravo de Mendoza, me llama mucho la atención ese Manuel Bravo. Algo que quizás no tenga importancia pero que vale la pena mencionar es que a Francisco y a algunos de su linaje se les nombra "Bravo y Mendoza" en vez de "Bravo de Mendoza" como los del linaje del líder comunero Juan Bravo de Mendoza, por ello veo muy posible que el apellido sea la unión en Indias de un Bravo y una Mendoza como acabas de apuntar.
Por último mil gracias por los datos y corrección sobre los matrimonios de Ángela de Alvarado y Sotomayor, añadí ya su matrimonio con Andrés Ruiz de Chávez.
Saludos,
Erik
Here is a list of all the fleets by year that sailed from Spain to Nueva Espana (Mexico). It has complete list of ship names, captains, Admiral and by year that they sailed:
By accident I ran across a documnent in pars website where in 1798 the governor or Yucatan was "Arturo O'Niel."
While not quite as old as 1798, I think people in Mexico who find they have Irish ancestry would be interested in researching "Los Patricios" or St. Patrick's Battalion. During the Mexican-American war, the Patricios were an artillery division which proved very effective.
As fellow Catholics, the Patricios fought on the Mexican side. With the eventual defeat of Mexico, many of the Patricios remained in Mexico and most were granted land.
Can some of you more experienced in viewing/interpreting death records list
the most common causes of death:
Fibre: Fever
Dolor de Costado: I think that means Heart Attack what is your underst
I've come across "agotamiento" which is exhaustion... in babies, "inflamación del ombligo", swollen belly button, "cianosis", blue coloration of the skin, "alferecía", which presents seizures... The thing is, as they have stated before, they list symptoms rather than illnesses cause they didn't know what the cause was. There is a particular case in my family where every baby they had died either from cianosis, swollen belly button or alferecía... these symptoms can be linked to neonatal tetanus, so I think maybe the person who was attending the deliveries didn't have much hygiene.
I recall coming across this post a while back and came back to see if "tristeza" was listed anywhere. I did not find it and wanted to know if this perhaps meant depression. Maybe from the recent passing of a loved one? I've never come across this being listed as cause of death before. This is a relative, Rosalio Lopez 5th GGF passing in 1844 in Etzatlán, Jalisco during a time when "Viruelas" was hitting hard.
Thanks for any input,
Ruben R.
Here is the link: Right Page/Very Top
https://www.familysearch.org/ark:/61903/3:1:9392-VTFB-W?i=369&wc=3JZF-T…
I have seen on several cases of: Mal de Orina. Since all the cases I've seen are men I assume they had prostate problems. I've also seen: cayo de in caballo (fell from a horse), Machetazos (Cut with machete), Un Insulto (?), patata de un burro (kick of a donkey), Evacuaciones (Diarrhea or cholera). Deedra Corona
“Murio de parto” is when the mother dies giving birth.
“Ahogado dentro de una mina” Child of one of my ancestors drowned in a mine, he was an Achichinque (drained water out of the mines).
Others I've seen:
“Justiciado” y “ahorcado”= condemned to death and hung
“Hacer cuartos” = quartered (corpse cut into pieces and usually “gibbeted” - hung in a public place)
During la Guerra de la Independencia:
“lo mato de un lansaso un insurgente”
“asesinados por rebeldes”
“Murio a la crueldad de los rebeldes”
I've seen kick of a horse but the word used was not patata. That's a word from Soth America for a potato-like tuber. You probably mean patada. Marge V.
Sent from my iPad
> On Aug 12, 2017, at 10:46, zapvive1@msn.com wrote:
>
> I have seen on several cases of: Mal de Orina. Since all the cases I've seen
> are men I assume they had prostate problems. I've also seen: cayo de in
> caballo (fell from a horse), Machetazos (Cut with machete), Un Insulto (?),
> patata de un burro (kick of a donkey), Evacuaciones (Diarrhea or cholera).
> Deedra Corona
>
I've seen kick of a horse but the word used was not patata. That's a word from Soth America for a potato-like tuber. You probably mean patada. Marge V.
Sent from my iPad
> On Aug 12, 2017, at 10:46, zapvive1@msn.com wrote:
>
> I have seen on several cases of: Mal de Orina. Since all the cases I've seen
> are men I assume they had prostate problems. I've also seen: cayo de in
> caballo (fell from a horse), Machetazos (Cut with machete), Un Insulto (?),
> patata de un burro (kick of a donkey), Evacuaciones (Diarrhea or cholera).
> Deedra Corona
>
Dolor de costado muerte por obstrucción de la vesícula biliar.
Cólico miserere: apendicitis o peritonitis.
"Murió de su muerte": Muerte natural
Marcelina
Dolor de costado muerte por obstrucción de la vesícula biliar.
Cólico miserere: apendicitis o peritonitis.
"Murió de su muerte": Muerte natural
Marcelina
I've always assumed that a woman who died soon after the birth of a child
(or right after the death of a baby), to have died due to childbirth, but
have not seen the cause of death identified as such. Has anyone?
On Thu, Aug 10, 2017 at 5:52 PM, wrote:
> Childbirth for women
>
Yes murio de parto
Sent from my Sprint Samsung Galaxy S7.
-------- Original message --------
From: Raquel Ruiz
Date: 8/12/17 10:30 AM (GMT-06:00)
To: research@nuestrosranchos.org
Subject: Re: [Nuestros Ranchos] Causes
I've always assumed that a woman who died soon after the birth of a child
(or right after the death of a baby), to have died due to childbirth, but
have not seen the cause of death identified as such. Has anyone?
On Thu, Aug 10, 2017 at 5:52 PM, wrote:
> Childbirth for women
>
Thanks.
On Sat, Aug 12, 2017 at 1:45 PM, sar rod wrote:
> Yes murio de parto
>
>
>
> Sent from my Sprint Samsung Galaxy S7.
>
>
> -------- Original message --------
> From: Raquel Ruiz
> Date: 8/12/17 10:30 AM (GMT-06:00)
> To: research@nuestrosranchos.org
> Subject: Re: [Nuestros Ranchos] Causes
>
> I've always assumed that a woman who died soon after the birth of a child
> (or right after the death of a baby), to have died due to childbirth, but
> have not seen the cause of death identified as such. Has anyone?
>
> On Thu, Aug 10, 2017 at 5:52 PM, wrote:
>
> > Childbirth for women
> >
> > -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- --
> > Nuestros Ranchos Research Mailing List
> >
> > To post, send email to:
> > research(at)nuestrosranchos.org
> >
> > To change your subscription, log on to:
> > http://www.nuestrosranchos.org
I’ve seen the following causes of death given in records for Zacoalco de Torres circa 1820:
Tos = Coughing, especially for infant deaths. I guess it was possibly whooping cough or the flu.
Muerto por un rayo en el campo = Lighting strike
Muerto por arma de fuego = Death by firearm
Muerto por heridas recibidas en campo de batalla = Battlefield wounds
Muerto por un balaso = Gunshot
Dolor de costado was a symptom of a disease, not necessarily the cause of
death. They were usually describing the symptom because they did not know
what the disease was. Dolor de costado was a pain in the side, could have
been appendicitis, cancer, sepsis or many other diseases.
On Wed, Aug 9, 2017 at 4:19 PM, Joseph Puentes wrote:
>
>
> Can some of you more experienced in viewing/interpreting death records list
> the most common causes of death:
>
>
>
> Fibre: Fever
>
> Dolor de Costado: I think that means Heart Attack what is your
> understanding
>
> Colora: Cholera
>
>
>
> What are others that you've come across?
>
>
>
> Thanks,
>
>
>
> Joseph
>
>
>
>
>
> Joseph Puentes
>
> Clean@h2opodcast.com
>
> http://h2opodcast.com/vsse.html
>
>
>
>
>
I've also come across :
de vejes (old age)
ahogado en el rio... (drowned in River...)
viruelas (small pox)
asma (asthma)
calor encerrada (heat stroke, I think)
On Wed, Aug 9, 2017 at 4:22 PM, Alicia Carrillo
wrote:
> Dolor de costado was a symptom of a disease, not necessarily the cause of
> death. They were usually describing the symptom because they did not know
> what the disease was. Dolor de costado was a pain in the side, could have
> been appendicitis, cancer, sepsis or many other diseases.
>
> On Wed, Aug 9, 2017 at 4:19 PM, Joseph Puentes wrote:
>
> >
> >
> > Can some of you more experienced in viewing/interpreting death records
> list
> > the most common causes of death:
> >
> >
> >
> > Fibre: Fever
> >
> > Dolor de Costado: I think that means Heart Attack what is your
> > understanding
> >
> > Colora: Cholera
> >
> >
> >
> > What are others that you've come across?
> >
> >
> >
> > Thanks,
> >
> >
> >
> > Joseph
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> > Joseph Puentes
> >
> > Clean@h2opodcast.com
> >
> > http://h2opodcast.com/vsse.html
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> > -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- --
> > Nuestros Ranchos Research Mailing List
> >
> > To post, send email to:
> > research(at)nuestrosranchos.org
> >
> > To change your subscription, log on to:
> > http://www.nuestrosranchos.org
I also saw:
Inflamacion
Inchazon
Both mean swollen
On Aug 9, 2017 8:21 PM, "Raquel Ruiz" wrote:
> I've also come across :
>
> de vejes (old age)
> ahogado en el rio... (drowned in River...)
> viruelas (small pox)
> asma (asthma)
> calor encerrada (heat stroke, I think)
>
>
> On Wed, Aug 9, 2017 at 4:22 PM, Alicia Carrillo
> wrote:
>
> > Dolor de costado was a symptom of a disease, not necessarily the cause of
> > death. They were usually describing the symptom because they did not know
> > what the disease was. Dolor de costado was a pain in the side, could have
> > been appendicitis, cancer, sepsis or many other diseases.
> >
> > On Wed, Aug 9, 2017 at 4:19 PM, Joseph Puentes wrote:
> >
> > >
> > >
> > > Can some of you more experienced in viewing/interpreting death records
> > list
> > > the most common causes of death:
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > > Fibre: Fever
> > >
> > > Dolor de Costado: I think that means Heart Attack what is your
> > > understanding
> > >
> > > Colora: Cholera
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > > What are others that you've come across?
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > > Thanks,
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > > Joseph
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > > Joseph Puentes
> > >
> > > Clean@h2opodcast.com
> > >
> > > http://h2opodcast.com/vsse.html
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > > -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- --
> > > Nuestros Ranchos Research Mailing List
> > >
> > > To post, send email to:
> > > research(at)nuestrosranchos.org
> > >
> > > To change your subscription, log on to:
> > > http://www.nuestrosranchos.org
> > -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- --
> > Nuestros Ranchos Research Mailing List
> >
> > To post, send email to:
> > research(at)nuestrosranchos.org
> >
> > To change your subscription, log on to:
> > http://www.nuestrosranchos.org
> >
Hidropesia (water retention?)
Tabardillo (Typhus - very common amongst vaqueros)
Apuñalado, cuchillada (stabbed)
I need some opinions about wording in marriage information. I am looking for the parents of Pedro de la Torre.
“Expuesto en las puertas De Diego Soria” means that He was “left at the doorsteps of Diego Soria’s House”. What this means is that there is no record of who his biological parents are and that Diego Soria took him in and raised him.
In another case like this, at the wedding of his adopted daughter that he raised, he admitted that he was the biological father.
Rick A. Ricci
Thank you, Rick. That makes perfect sense. Doesn't really tell me who his parents were, but it makes sense.
Hello everyone,
I would like to bring some attention to a new book:
Familias paterna y materna de sor Juana Inés de la Cruz: hallazgos documentales
I had previously posted these names but I have corrected and added dates:
1) Damián de Azuaje el Viejo [Damian Soaggi] arrived in the Canary Islands from Genoa; m. Jeronima Lezcano. {Damian de Azuaje had a previous relationship with Benedicina Rapallo, which produced Magdalena Azuaje who left many descendants in Venezuela}
2) "Pedro de Azuaje el Viejo" baptized 8/Oct/1538, m. Ana Portes. [Pedro Azuaje hijo de "Damian Azuaje el Viejo" y de Jeronima Lezcano.]
3) "Damian de Azuaje el Joven" [aka Damian Zoaggi de Genoa](bap. 18//Sep/1564, d. soon after17/Sept./1592) m. Antonia Laura Ramirez (aka Antonia Laura Mayuelo). {Damian de Azuaje el Joven" worked in commerce and made many trips to the Americas. He was not the first family member to travel to the Americas as Antonia Laura Ramirez had many family members in the Americas}
4) Pedro Azvuaje Ramirez was born between 1588 and early 1592, and his brother Francisco Azuaje was born late 1592. {Francisco was born soon after his father passed away}
This means that Pedro Azuaje Ramirez was at least 56 years old when Sor Juana Ines De La Cruz was born. There was also a big age difference between Isabel's "First significant other", Cristoval Vargas, the father of Josepha Maria Ramirez.
Rick A. Ricci
Book: Mygenes2000
Genealogist David Erhlicher advised me that I had made a mistake.by naming Pedro a captain. He does not know of any primary sources that show that Pedro Asuaje Ramirez is a captain. He only knows of him being referred to as a captain in a secondary source. I myself have never seen a primary source with this information so I will drop the title in my records.
But in my records there is a family member with a similar sounding name that was a captain. Capitán Pedro Fernández y Saavedra de Azuaje was related to him.
Pedro Azuaje Ramirez's descent from Damian el Viejo Zoaggi (Azuaje))
1) Damián de Azuaje el Viejo [Damian Soaggi] arrived in the Canary Islands in 1522 from Genoa; m. Jeronima Lezcano
2) Pedro de Azuaje el Viejo m. Ana Portes
3) Damian de Azuaje [aka Damian Zoaggi de Genoa](bap.1564, d. soon after17/Sept./1592) m. Antonia Laura Ramirez (aka Antonia Laura Mayuelo)
4) Pedro Azvaje Ramirez b. abt.1583
/////////////////////////////
Capitán Pedro Fernández y Saavedra de Azuaje's descent from Damian el Viejo Zoaggi (Azuaje)
1) Damián de Azuaje el Viejo [Damian Soaggi] arrived in the Canary Islands in 1522 from Genoa; before marrying Jeronima, he had at least one child out of wedlock with Benedictina Rapallo
2) Magdalena Azuaje m. Alonso Fernández de Saavedra
3) Capitán Pedro Fernández y Saavedra de Azuaje
This line left many descendants in Venezuela. This family knew that they were related to Sor Juana Ines De La Cruz. They have a hospital in Venezuela named after her.
/////////////////////////////////////
Probable Sosa ancestry of Sor Juana Ines de la Cruz (work in progress)
1) Martin Alonso de Sosa
2) Vasco Alfonso de Sosa m. Maria Diaz Castillo (daughter of Gomez Fernández sr. de Santofimia)
3)
4) Juan Alfonso de Sosa m. Isabel Fernández de Mesa (daughter of Alonso Fernández de Mesa)
5) Lope de Sosa m. Ines Cabrera (daughter of Pedro Cabrera and Ynes Alfonso)
6)
////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////
7) Laura de Cabrera y Sosa m. Zoilo Ramirez
8) Maria Laura Ramirez m. Fernando Nuñez de la Peña
9) Antonia Laura Ramirez (Mayuelo) m. Damián Azuaje (Zoaggi)
10) Pedro Azuaje Ramirez unm. Isabel Ramirez
11) Sor Juana Ines de la Cruz
R.A. Ricci
Book: Mygenes2000
Italian ancestry of Pedro Azuaje Ramirez through the Genoese Soaggi and Moagglio families
1) Damián de Azuaje el Viejo [Damian Soaggi] arrived in the Canary Islands from Genoa; m. Jeronima Lezcano
2) Pedro de Azuaje el Viejo m. Ana Portes
3) Damian de Azuaje [aka Damian Zoaggi de Genoa](bap.1564, d. soon after17/Sept./1592) m. Antonia Laura Ramirez (aka Antonia Laura Mayuelo/aka Moaggolio)
4) Pedro Azuaje Ramirez b. abt.1583
//////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////
Jewish ancestry of Pedro Azuaje Ramirez
His maternal line is filled with conversos.
Sor Juana Ines De La Cruz was not the first family member to suffer because of the heavy hand of the Catholic Church. From Ana Diaz De La Garcia who was burned in a bonfire, to her daughters that were subject to abuse, to Pedro's brother who had much trouble with the inquisition when he tried to return to the Americas.
Gonzalo Lepe alcalde de Olid (from Lepe provincia Andalcia, Huelva) and Ana Diaz De La Garza (Garce, Garcia) (from Lepe provincia Andaluza de Huelva) had three daughters named Beatriz, Isabel, and Elvira. Beatriz Gonzalez de Lepe married Rodrigo Nunez de la Peña.
Ana Diaz de Garza was denounced by the inquisition in Andaluza. She was accused of secretly continuing to practice the Jewish religion. She was burned at the stake. All three sisters suffered greatly because of the actions against their mother.
Gonzalez de Lepe was also subject to investigation by the office of the inquisition.
Gonzalo de Lepe, alcalde de olid (converso) m. Ana Diaz De La Garcia (Garza, Garces)
Beatriz Gonzalez de Lepe m. Rodrigo Nuñez de la Peña
Francisco Nuñez de la Peña m. Maria Laura Ramirez
Antonia Laura Ramirez (aka Antonia Laura Mayuelo) m. Damian de Azuaje [aka Damian Zoaggi de Genoa](bap.1564)
Pedro Azvaje Ramirez
Rick A. Ricci
Book: Mygenes2000
Beside the issue of Josepha Maria Ramirez naming Cristoval Vargas as her father, there was also the issue of the Azvauje family in the Canary Islands receiving money from Sor Juana Ines De la Cruz's maternal side of the family, and that they were called relatives. The issue was resolved when It turned out that they are related through the Ramirez branches of the families.
Besides being related to her because I descend from Gonzalo Ramirez Santillan, Pedro's brother, I also descend from Isabel Ramirez's sister, Ines Ramirez that married into the Cornejo family.
Rick A. Ricci
Book: Mygenes2000
Latest:
I found another piece of the puzzle that finally convinces me that Pedro Azuaje Ramirez is the father of Sor Juana Ines De la Cruz and that Cristoval Vargas is the father of Josepha Maria Ramirez. The document clearly convinces me that they were half sisters. So Isabel Ramirez had children by three men, and not two like everyone writes in books about the family. Juana Ines did have one full sister.
The two authors that most people quote are Jose Diego de Torres and Guillermo Ramirez de España as to who is the father of Josepha Maria Ramirez. Both of these gentleman are wrong, and I have solid evidence, the first being her marriage record, and the second a record where Isabel mentions the fathers of her children. She does not include Josepha as a daughter of Pedro, and she definitely, specifically names him as the father to Sor Juana Ines de la Cruz.
Rick A. Ricci
Book Mygenes2000
Jewish converso ancestral line of Pedro Azuaje Ramirez
1) Gonzalo de Lepe, alcalde de olid (converso)
2) Beatriz Gonzalez de Lepe m. Rodrigo Nuñez de la Peña
3) Francisco Nuñez de la Peña m. Maria Laura Ramirez
4) Antonia Laura Ramirez (aka Antonia Laura Mayuelo) m. Damian de Azuaje [aka Damian Zoaggi de Genoa](bap.1564)
5) Capitan Pedro Azvaje Ramirez
Rick A. Ricci
Book Mygenes2000
There is a correction to the family tree. The reason for the mistake is that Laura is a stepdaughter and not a biological member of the Cabrera Sosa family.
I had originally posted A probable biological Sosa ancestry of Sor Juana Ines De la Cruz, but it turns out that Laura used her stepfathers surname of de Cabrera Sosa. Laura’s biological father’s surname is Moagglio (Mayuelo).
The reason that I have not been able to complete the Cabrera Sosa family line is because Laura does not descend from this line. Laura de Cabrera Sosa Was listed in the record using her stepfather’s surname. Her Stepfather’s father was the Governor. Laura’s biological father was of italian ancestry and the surname is Moagglio. The surname evolved in Andalucia to Mayuelo
7) Laura de Cabrera y Sosa (stepfathers surname) m. Zoilo Ramirez
8) Maria Laura Ramirez m. Fernando Nuñez de la Peña
9) Antonia Laura Ramirez (Mayuelo) m. Damián Azuaje (Zoaggi)
10) Pedro Azuaje Ramirez unm. Isabel Ramirez
11) Sor Juana Ines de la Cruz
I have continued researching Juana Ines’s ancestry and have been able to discover new information on one of her Ramirez lines and have extended an Italian ancestral line to the 1100s.
Rick A. Ricci
Source: Mygenes2000
This is wonderful information and super helpful. I did want just one bit of clarification. Is the correct name Francisco Nuñez de la Peña or is the first name Fernando? It appears as both in your various posts above. Thanks.
Sorry about that, the correct name is Francisco.That isn’t the only mistake, there is no Lescano in her ancestry. The surname is Lercaro/Lercari. The original Genoese surname is Lercari. I have found much more information regarding her ancestry. I have traced the the Ramirez to Andalucia and have extended one of her Italian lines to before 1100. Juana Ines De la Cruz was not the first family member to be one of the smartest of their generation, nor was she the last.
7) Laura de Cabrera y Sosa (stepfathers surname) (Aka Laura Mayuelo (Moagglio))
8) Maria Ramirez m. Francisco Nuñez De la Peña
9) Antonia Laura Ramirez (Mayuelo) m. Damián Azuaje (Zoaggi)
10) Pedro Azuaje Ramirez (aka Pedro Azuaje ) unm. Isabel Ramirez
11) Sor Juana Ines de la Cruz
Thanks,
Rick A. Ricci
Sor Juana ines de la Cruz poetry:
What Interest Have You, World, in Persecuting Me?
What interest have you, World, in persecuting me?
Wherein do I offend you, when all I want
Is to give beauty to my mind
And not my mind to beautiful things?
I do not care for goods or treasures;
and so am always more content
To endow my thoughts with riches
Rather than riches with my thoughts.
And I esteem not looks, which age
Takes away in civil stealth,
Nor am I impressed by wealth,
Holding that in truth 'tis better
To expend the vanities of life
Than to expend one's life in vanities.
Here are some of the fruits of my research on Sor Juana Ines de la Cruz's family:
Juan Morales and his wife Ana Vargas are the parents of Cristoval Vargas.
Cristoval Vargas marries twice. The first marriage takes place only after Baltasar Ybanes, his future father in law, files a complaint with the office of the inquisition stating that Cristoval has promised marriage but has made no attempt to do so while living in sin with his daughter, Ana Ybañez.
It is believed that he is the same Cristoval Vargas that marries a second time, to Maria de Los Santos. He has an affair with Isabel Ramirez,( Sor Juana Ynes' mother).
Cristoval Vargas passes away in 1666
Here is the marriage record of Josepha Maria, the sister that named her father as Cristoval Vargas.
"Joseph Sánchez de Paredes, natural desta ciudad, hijo de Juan Sánchez de Paredes y de Inés Domínguez de las Ribas, con doña Josepha Ramírez, natural del pueblo de Amecameca, hija de Cristóbal de Vargas y de Isabel Ramírez"
Here are more records that pertain to Cristoval Vargas:
Name Juan De Morales
Spouse's Name Ana De Bargas
Event Date 24/Dec/1599
Event Place Santa Catarina Martir,Santa Catarina-Mexico Ciudad,Distrito Federal,Mexico
Citing this Record
"Mexico Marriages, 1570-1950," database, FamilySearch(https://familysearch.org/ark:/61903/1:1:JHYL-6RX : 15 July 2015), Juan De Morales and Ana De Bargas, 13 Dec 1599; citing Santa Catarina Martir,Santa Catarina-Mexico Ciudad,Distrito Federal,Mexico, reference ; FHL microfilm 36,027 image 77 out of 548
Cristoval De Bargas
Spouse's Name Ana Ybanes
Event Date 06 Aug 1629
Event Place Santa Catarina Martir,Santa Catarina-Mexico Ciudad,Distrito Federal,Mexico
Father's Name Juan De Morales
Mother's Name Ana De Bargas
Spouse's Father's Name Baltasar Ybanes
Spouse's Mother's Name Ana Maria De Burgos
Citing this Record
"Mexico Marriages, 1570-1950," database, FamilySearch(https://familysearch.org/ark:/61903/1:1:JZJ8-K8K : 16 July 2015), Juan De Morales in entry for Cristoval De Bargas and Ana Ybanes, 06 Aug 1629; citing Santa Catarina Martir,Santa Catarina-Mexico Ciudad,Distrito Federal,Mexico, reference ; FHL microfilm 36,027.
Christoval De Vargas
Spouse's Name Maria De Los Santos
Event Date 30 Nov 1647
Event Place Santa Veracruz, Santa Veracruz, Distrito Federal, Mexico
Citing this Record
"México matrimonios, 1570-1950," database, FamilySearch(https://familysearch.org/ark:/61903/1:1:JHPP-X2X : 14 July 2015), Christoval De Vargas and Maria De Los Santos, 30 Nov 1647; citing Santa Veracruz, Santa Veracruz, Distrito Federal, Mexico, reference 2:147QZN6; FHL microfilm 35,848.
Rick A. Ricci,
Book: mygenes2000
The Asuaje (Soaggi) (Zoaggi) (Zoagli) family came from a town of this same name (Zoaggi) in the Liguria region that was a part of Genoa when it was a republic.
I have done some research on the genealogy of sor Juana Inés de la Cruz. My wife and I both descend from a second cousin of hers.
Pedro Asuaje Ramirez is the son of Damian de Azuaje and Antonia Laura Ramirez. Pedro is of Genoese ancestry. His ancestry is an interesting one. This is the father that most books identify as her father.
The problem is that the sister identifies a different father, and the sister is said to be a full sister. There are other pieces of the puzzle from primary sources that are not addressed in most books. I am looking forward to reading this book.
Thanks,
Rick A. Ricci
QUIEN TIENE INFORMACION DE QUE MANUEL GOMEZ SEA HIJO DE DIEGO RAMIREZ DE CANTILLANA E INES BRENES, YA QUE EN UN GRUPO DE FACEBOOK LO SEÑALAN COMO HERMANO DE GONZALO RAMIREZ DE CANTILLANA.
Very helpful information. I'll have to re-update the family tree on the geni website.
Hola Víctor,
Manuel Gomez y Gonzalo Ramirez De Cantillana (Santillana) si son hermanos. Aquí está la prueba:
https://www.familysearch.org/ark:/61903/3:1:9392-6GSH-S7?i=397&wc=12512…
Aunque las dos familias, los Ramirez y los GOMEZ De Portugal, tienen antepasados judios,(conversos al catolicismo), no son parientes cercanos.
Manuel GOMEZ no es hijo de Diego Gomez De Portugal y Catarina De Arrona. Hay un genealogo que escribió que Diego desciende de la casa (de un hijo del rey) de Portugal por una mujer judía con el apellido Gómez.
Ricardo A. Ricci
Libro: Mygenes2000
Gracias por compartir esta dispensa Ricardo. ¿Se sabe si se ha localizado otro documento contemporáneo de Manuel Gómez, padre? Pregunto por lo siguiente. Aunque no tengo duda que los Mendoza supiesen quienes fueran sus antepasados, he visto múltiples de dispensas, las cuales contienen nombres y vínculos erróneos. Por ejemplo, esta dispensa se realizo en 1707, más de 120 años después de haber nacido aproximadamente el primer Manuel Gómez. Me gustaría localizar un testamento, partida matrimonial, aun un registro notarial, en fin, algún documento en que Manuel Gómez mismo confirma su afiliación.
Lo siguiente lo comparto con la esperanza que alguien podrá resolver este cabo suelto.
Unos años antes que Guillermo Tovar de Teresa falleciera, QEPD, compartió lo siguiente conmigo:
"Manuel es hijo de Esteban Gómez y nieto de otro Esteban, natural de Orgaz, hijo de otro Esteban y de Catalina López, que llegó a la Nueva Galicia con el Oidor Francisco de Pareja en 1578."
Nunca pude localizar un documento que afirmaban esto, y desconozco la fuente que Guillermo consultó para afirmarlo. ¿Cuál será, si existe, el vínculo entre los Ramírez de Cantillana y los Gómez? ¿De dónde saldría el Gómez?
Daniel Méndez de Torres y Camino
Dear Daniel,
Guillermo Tovar de Teresa never provided me with the evidence for his claimed ancestry of Manuel Gomez. This document clearly states that he and Gonzalo Ramirez are brothers. From other documents we know the names of the parents of Gonzalo. It was a common occurrence during this age tor brothers to have different surnames. My research in Spain during the 1500’s, 1400’s and 1300 shows that surnames during this time were fluid in many families. My research shows that Gonzalo Ramirez was related to sor Inés de la Cruz’s maternal grandfather, and that all of them were not to distant cousins of Inés de la Cruz’s paternal side through their Jewish-conversos Ramirez ancestry. They were all in contact with each other, doing business, and sending money to each other.
Genealogy is a science. When a genealogist is faced with new facts and circumstances, it is important to take in the new information and not discard it. Until we receive new information to the contrary, I accept the dispensa’s declaration that Manuel Gomez and Gonzalo Ramirez Santillana (Cantillana) are brothers. Until I see otherwise, they are full brothers in my eyes.
Thanks,
Rick A. Ricci
Hi,
There's no doubt about the fact that Gonzalo Ramirez and Manuel Gomez were brothers (although the document for the dispensa included in
https://www.familysearch.org/ark:/61903/3:1:9392-6GSH-S7?i=397&wc=12512…
doesn't mention whether they were half brothers or full brothers). However, there is no reason to believe that Gonzalo was a "Ramirez Cantillana". The Ramirez Cantillana who arrived to New Spain at the beginning of the 17th century was Pedro (his parents were another Pedro and Ines de Brenes, who remained in Spain), married to Beatriz Ramirez, and among the 11 children they had none was named Gonzalo nor Manuel.
By the way, the last name is Cantillana, no Santillana, as some want to convert to, and the Ramirez Cantillana family rarely used the preposition "de" they regularly used "Ramirez Cantillana".
Best regards,
H
Hi Hector,
Gonzalo Ramírez and Pedro Ramirez are brothers and their parents are identified as the trunk in a dispensation for a marriage. This is shown in a primary source document In Jalostotitlan, Jalisco.
Juana Ynes de la Santa Cruz's parents were related through their Ramirez lines. Juana's family mentioned that they were related when they sent some money back to Europe. The Ramirez family had an early presence in the new world and traveled back and forth as they were merchants.
I descend from both Manuel Gomez and Gonzalo Ramirez. I also descend from Pedro Ramirez through a maternal aunt of Juana Ines de la Cruz.
Rick A. Ricci
Hector pointed out that the surname was written Ramirez Cantillana, and not Santillana. He stated that he had only seen it with a “C”. The spelling that I have seen most often is Ramirez Çantillana. “ Ç “ . Sor Juana Inés De la Cruz descended from Ramirez from both her paternal and maternal sides. These two Ramirez branches were closely related. Her maternal grandfather’s name was Pedro Ramirez Çantillana.
Hector says that Gonzalo Ramirez is not the brother Pedro Ramirez Çantillana and he also throws another curve ball saying that the father of Pedro Ramirez was named Pedro Ramirez and not Diego Ramirez. We need to go back and check since in my records I have him down as Diego Ramirez. I believe that Hector is mistaken. The records of my Cornejo Ramirez ancestors show Diego Ramirez.
I have much more information on this family but won’t post it right now since I was just made aware of a book that I should read to compare it to my research findings.
There is a Diego Ramirez in the family that had a child with another woman. The question that I am grappling with is whether the two Diego Ramirez’s are the same person. At this time i believe that the two Diego Ramirez’s are the same person but that part isn’t proven.
Rick A. Ricci
Is there any relation between this Diego Ramirez and the Diego Ramirez mentioned by the cronista of Encarnacion Rodolfo Hernandez Chavez here: Don Diego Ramírez, como ha quedado dicho, originario de San Luis Potosí, fue hijo de Diego Hernández y de doña María Ramírez. Contrajo matrimonio el 18 de agosto de 1651 en Aguascalientes con Catalina Macías-Valadez y Álvarez, conocida como Catalina Vázquez de Retamosa. Don Diego fue vecino del "Puesto de los Macías", donde adquirió 1/7 parte de este sitio al comprarla el 10 de Octubre de 1689 a su cuñado Nicolás Macías Valadez. Su esposa Doña Catalina también compró a su hermano Don Baltasar Macías Álvarez 1/6 del sitio de Ganado Mayor y 4 caballerias que llaman "El Sauz de los Macías".
Manuel Gomez and Gonzalo Ramirez Are brothers according to the dispensation that I provided. It was common, especially when the people were from the area that this family was from, for brothers to have different surnames.
Pedro Ramirez, (maternal grandfather of sor Juana Ines De la Cruz) and Gonzalo Ramirez are full brothers according to a primary source dispensation that identifies their parents as the trunk for the dispensation.
The Cornejo Ramírez family from Jalostotitlan, Jalisco descends from Pedro Ramirez, (maternal grandfather of sor Juana Ines De la Cruz). They also have some very illustrious ancestors from the Cornejo Osorio side of the family. Hernando Cortes could not have been successful if he hadn’t had major help from an ancestor of the Cornejo Osorio family. This Cornejo Osorio family descends from the noble Alvarez Osorio family in Castilla.
This Ramirez Family descended from “nuevo christianos” that had many priests. Many of these priests were our ancestors as they had families on the side. The Jewish roots of the family is repeated often in documents referring to this family
Rick
Can someone look up a surname for me in their Retonos book?
My mother in law has a Campos line from San Juan de Los Lagos. I traced this Line back to the original surname of Martin del Campo.
Rick A. Ricci
To learn about the history of Martin del Campo, is there a website or a book or two that you can recommend about the Martin del Campo line? Viceroy? Conquistador?
Gracias.
marty
Hola a todos, me costo mucho encontrar un documento que me orientara para obtener los padres de Maria de los Dolores Dias, casada con Antonio Joaquin agundis, lo publicare aqui porque se que a mi prim
Just enter the reference no. (example- CONTRATACION, 2899 into the website):
Thank you for this link, I have never seen these. I know they existed but I have searched in the past but the website is not user friendly. :-)
Thank you
Esther
Hello everyone , I have returned to the site after many years of not being active here but researching in many corners of Mexico and the United States over almost 10 years .
Hello Lorenzo. I hope this list of questions may be of help.
https://www.wikitree.com/blog/50-questions-for-interviewing-living-family-members/
There is no time like The present to interview your family. Gather as much information as you can. I have collected many stories yet I find myself rushing to interview as much as I can. Interview the same person over and over again. You will get different stories and memories. Remember to ask about siblings of grandparents and greatgrandparents. Ask for dates and locations.
A few years ago I stopped between errands to say a quick hello to my mother. To my surprise, two aunts that I hadn’t seen in years arrived at the same time that i did. I gathered much new information from them. One of my aunts talked about going into to the hospital the next day for a minor procedure. A few days later, as she was prepared to be discharged, she had a heart attack. So don’t put off interviews. Make time for your relatives and their stories. And if you are the story collector like I am, record the stories so they can be passed on.
Rick A. Ricci
Can someone help me with the translation of this death certificate? It is the certificate on the right for a Sabas Campos...page 59. Image 2187 of 2303.
I don't know but do have a great, great uncle named Sabas Cortez Garcia de
Leon, b. 12 Apr 1885, Amatitan, Guadalajara, Jalisco.
On Fri, Aug 14, 2020 at 1:00 PM wrote:
> Side note, Sabas is a name I run into infrequently doing my genealogy. It
> certainly is no longer au courant among Spanish first names. Anyone have
> any
> further information on the origin and meaning of Sabas as a name?
>
So I have a civil birth record for a “April” Campos, according to family search. The year and month of birth are very close to the “Sabas” Campos I am researching...and have deduced based on his civil death record. I can’t find the birth record. I believe the “April” Campos birth record is actually “Abad”. My question is, are the names Sabas and Abad synonymous?
Yes they are synonymous, like Doroteo and Teodoro.
Sabas, Abad, Sabad, Abas, I don’t know if they were scribe mistakes or they are truly synonymous but I have found records of people showing these variations.
Hello Marty.
Sabas Campos' parents got married 28 Oct 1872 in Lagos de Moreno, Jalisco (click here to see the document. Page at the RH side, image is very fuzzy).
Sabas had a sister named Tomasa. Tomasa got married 22 Aug 1912 in Ciudad de México.
Tomasa was born 3 Sep 1887, her birth was recorded 7 Sep 1887 in "la comisaría" or "la congregación" named "El Cuarenta", Lagos de Moreno, Jalisco (click here to see the document).
The paternal grandfather of Sabas and Tomasa is listed "Sabas Campos" in their parents' marriage record, but he is listed "Abad Campos" in Tomasa's birth certificate. I think "Abad" was written by mistake. He was christened "Jose Sabas", see the 2 records below:
1.- Christening record of his son J. Clemente (25 Nov 1859. Sabas' parents are listed).
2.- Jose Sabas was christened 10 Dec 1823.
On a different note, Venancio Campos' wife was born 15 May 1856 in "La Quebrada", San Isidro, Guanajuato. She was christened 18 May 1856 (next to last record, in the page at the LH side).
I hope the information above may be of help in your research.
So the more I explore this Campos family the more questions I have.
While researching the Nacimientos/matrimonios of 1877-1893, I ran across a section, images
539-589, that are signed off by one Venancio Campos.
https://www.familysearch.org/ark:/61903/3:1:33S7-9P26-DKL?i=549&wc=MGX3…
I know it might be a long shot but could this be the same Venancio Campos mentioned above in the records in this chain?
What did one have to do to become a "civil" registrar? And how can I explore this lead more?
As for the excerpts that are almost always at the beginning of these books, I rarely ever bothered to read them (on account of no hablo espano...not very well that is.) I saw no mention of a Venancio Campos at the beginning of this record, only his signature at the end on image 589.
PS. thank you for the additional leads that were mentioned above.
Aguascalientes Archives documents