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Por Jose Humberto Suarez |

Hello:

I´m José Humberto Suárez Villarreal. I´ve been doing some research on my family, for almost 10 years or so I focused mainly in my maternal side (Villarreal De La Fuente Zertuche Rodríguez - from Nuevo León and Coahuila). But a couple of years ago I started with my paternal lines (Orozco, Moreno). Later I found interesting links of this families with the "Familias Alteñas" that were in Nueva Galicia since the times of colonization.

I will be posting the info I´ve got, although its not much because I mainly go just directly to my ancestors without having discovered much about the colateral branches of the family. But of what I have seen in this last week in this website there is tons of information that just need some analysis to be linked.

I recently went to Lagos de Moreno and to La Union de San Antonio to visit for the first time my paternal grandfather´s birthplace. It was a wonderfull trip in which all the time I imagined my ancestors walking the same streets alongside a church or a downtown plaza.

My grandfather José Suárez Orozco who was born in 1918 in La Unión de San Antonio (still living), was one of the 75 grandchildren of José Ignacio Orozco González "Papa Nacho" and of Zenaida Moreno Gómez. The aunts, uncles and cousins or our family has mainly focused in the descendants of this couple, we are a reallly big family, but I have always been curious about the ancestors of earlier centuries. The parents of José Ignacio and Zenaida were: José Ramón Tello de Orozco y González Rubio from San Miguel El Alto and María Josefa González del Castillo y Ortiz de Parada. José Ignacio was born in La Hacienda La Sandía, Adobes (Unión de San Antonio), Jalisco. He married Zenaida in la Parroquia del Señor de la Misericordia, La Unión de San Antonio, Jalisco, México and she was born in Hacienda La Tuna Alta, La Unión de San Antonio, Jalisco, her parents were Juan de Diós Moreno y Maldonado and María Higinia Gómez de Portugal y González.

The grandparents of José Ignacio and Zenaida were:
José Ignacio Tello de Orozco y Gutiérrez de Mendoza and Rita González Rubio y Márquez.
Fermín González del Castillo y González de Rubalcava and Francisca Ortíz de Parada y González de Rubalcava.
José Antonio Melquiades Moreno (de Ortega) y Moreno and María Manuela Maldonado y Moreno.
José María Gómez de Portugal Hermosillo and María Ana González Moreno.

The great grandparents of José Igancio and Zenaida were:
José Luis Tello de Orozco y Jiménez de Castro and María Rosa (Francisca?) Gutiérrez de Mendoza y Gutiérrez.
Juan de Diós González Rubio and Mariana Márques <--- here I haven´t been able to continue because I have to order IGI Films.
Juan José González Díaz del Castillo and María Gertrudis González Villalobos <--- to verify both
Bernabé Manuel Ortíz de Parada y García and María Trinidad González de Rubalcava y Guerra <-- to verify both
Marcos Moreno de Ortega Hurtado and María de la Ascención Moreno Pérez.
Juan Maldonado y Moreno and María de San José Moreno y Velázquez.
José Matías Gómez de Portugal Hurtado de Mendoza and María Luisa de Hemosillo Álvarez.
Francisco Antonio González and María Isidora Moreno.

In some branches I have been able to connect with those families of the 16th and 17th centuries. For other I haven´t but I hope in time I will (years or decades, there´s plenty of time).

But you all know that in researching a surname, you end up with plenty of them because the conections between relatives of earlier times were a common thing. So the surnames in which I do some research (they belong to my direct ancestors) are the following:

Tello de Orozco / Orozco
Carbajal y Ulloa
Figueroa y Temiño de Bañuelos <-- (temiño and treviño are the same family, curious thing, some stayed in Nueva Galicia and some went up north, 4 centuries later my mom and dad married and the lines were unified again).
Maciel y Liebano / Luevano
Zamora y Orozco del Castillo
Maldonado
Gómez de Espejo
Navarro y de la Cerda
Gaytán y de Vargas de Alcocer
Villegas, Altamirano
Lopez de Nava and all variations
González de Hermosillo and all variations
Rubio and all its variations
Hernandez de Arellano y Hurtado de Mendoza
Gutiérrez Rubio
González Florida and again all variations
Muñóz, Ramírez, Torres, de la Barba, Ruvalcaba / Rubalcava, Martín del Campo
Solís, Vázquez and Gil de Lara and variations like Vázques de Lara
Padilla Dávila
de la Mota y Vera
Flores de la Torre and Anda Altamirano
Arias Orozco, Arias Valdéz
and so on....

As you can see I do some research in everything because as you dig more and more, well its more the information you have. And what started like a "I want to know who my great grandparents were", ends up in a big headache for my mom who has been enduring my endless gossip, talks and little stories of the information I have been able to discover by many third party contributions and hundreds of hours spend in front of the computer and books.

Any question you have I´ll be glad to respond and hopefully one day I´ll meet with some of the distant cousins that are in this group.

Best Regards.
José Humberto
Best Regards

thanks for your intro and your participation in the group. I'm at a
disadvantage since I'm not an Alteño, but then again I do have a
Miramontes GGGGG grandmother from the Tlaltenango area (not Los Altos).
I thought that Steven Hernandez said that the Miramontes were originally
Alteños. Well I'm probably mistaken. I wrote to welcome you to the group
and to leave you in the hands of the Strong SIG group within the
Nuestros Ranchos group that are from Los Altos.

joseph

Jose Humberto Suarez wrote:

>Hello:
>
>I´m José Humberto Suárez Villarreal. I´ve been doing some research on my family, for almost 10 years or so I focused mainly in my maternal side (Villarreal De La Fuente Zertuche Rodríguez - from Nuevo León and Coahuila). But a couple of years ago I started with my paternal lines (Orozco, Moreno). Later I found interesting links of this families with the "Familias Alteñas" that were in Nueva Galicia since the times of colonization.
>
>I will be posting the info I´ve got, although its not much because I mainly go just directly to my ancestors without having discovered much about the colateral branches of the family. But of what I have seen in this last week in this website there is tons of information that just need some analysis to be linked.
>
>I recently went to Lagos de Moreno and to La Union de San Antonio to visit for the first time my paternal grandfather´s birthplace. It was a wonderfull trip in which all the time I imagined my ancestors walking the same streets alongside a church or a downtown plaza.
>
>My grandfather José Suárez Orozco who was born in 1918 in La Unión de San Antonio (still living), was one of the 75 grandchildren of José Ignacio Orozco González "Papa Nacho" and of Zenaida Moreno Gómez. The aunts, uncles and cousins or our family has mainly focused in the descendants of this couple, we are a reallly big family, but I have always been curious about the ancestors of earlier centuries. The parents of José Ignacio and Zenaida were: José Ramón Tello de Orozco y González Rubio from San Miguel El Alto and María Josefa González del Castillo y Ortiz de Parada. José Ignacio was born in La Hacienda La Sandía, Adobes (Unión de San Antonio), Jalisco. He married Zenaida in la Parroquia del Señor de la Misericordia, La Unión de San Antonio, Jalisco, México and she was born in Hacienda La Tuna Alta, La Unión de San Antonio, Jalisco, her parents were Juan de Diós Moreno y Maldonado and María Higinia Gómez de Portugal y González.
>
>The grandparents of José Ignacio and Zenaida were:
>José Ignacio Tello de Orozco y Gutiérrez de Mendoza and Rita González Rubio y Márquez.
>Fermín González del Castillo y González de Rubalcava and Francisca Ortíz de Parada y González de Rubalcava.
>José Antonio Melquiades Moreno (de Ortega) y Moreno and María Manuela Maldonado y Moreno.
>José María Gómez de Portugal Hermosillo and María Ana González Moreno.
>
>The great grandparents of José Igancio and Zenaida were:
>José Luis Tello de Orozco y Jiménez de Castro and María Rosa (Francisca?) Gutiérrez de Mendoza y Gutiérrez.
>Juan de Diós González Rubio and Mariana Márques

The Miramontes are not Altenos at all. They are from Tlaltenango 100 percent. There are a few of us researching this family and we have all come to the conclusion that Juan de Miramonte was the first (and only) immigrant to Mexico with this name and he married Maria de (Haro y) Saucedo around 1580, who was a descendant of both the Bobadillas and Delgados (encomenderos of Tepechitlan and El Teul, respectively) and settled in Tlaltenango.

The Haros and the Miramontes (and Saucedos) from Tlaltenango are the same family descendant from this couple.

You will find the information on this Juan de Miramonte(s) in the GEDCOM database. I have not yet found the definitive descendancy of Maria de Saucedo, i.e. the names of her parents and grandparents, therefore her parents are not listed in the database. However, we are are sure that she was descendant of Pedro de Bobadilla and Luis Delgado in some manner.

=====================
From: Joseph Puentes
Date: Mon Jun 12 15:04:20 CDT 2006
To: research@nuestrosranchos.org
Subject: Re: [Nuestros Ranchos] Hello, Introduction...

thanks for your intro and your participation in the group. I'm at a
disadvantage since I'm not an Alteño, but then again I do have a
Miramontes GGGGG grandmother from the Tlaltenango area (not Los Altos). I thought that Steven Hernandez said that the Miramontes were originally Alteños. Well I'm probably mistaken. I wrote to welcome you to the group and to leave you in the hands of the Strong SIG group within the Nuestros Ranchos group that are from Los Altos.

joseph

Well that nails it I'm not an Alteno in any shape way or form (I feel so
common now). . .at least at this point in my research.

thanks Arturo. . .you don't happen to have a Maria Melchora Miramontes
in the late 1760-1790 time frame from Tlaltenango do you?

She would have been married to Luis Castaneda (son of Diego Castaneda).
I'm guessing from the area right close to if not in Cuculiten.

thanks,

joseph

Arturo Ramos wrote:

>Joseph:
>
>The Miramontes are not Altenos at all. They are from Tlaltenango 100 percent. There are a few of us researching this family and we have all come to the conclusion that Juan de Miramonte was the first (and only) immigrant to Mexico with this name and he married Maria de (Haro y) Saucedo around 1580, who was a descendant of both the Bobadillas and Delgados (encomenderos of Tepechitlan and El Teul, respectively) and settled in Tlaltenango.
>
>The Haros and the Miramontes (and Saucedos) from Tlaltenango are the same family descendant from this couple.
>
>You will find the information on this Juan de Miramonte(s) in the GEDCOM database. I have not yet found the definitive descendancy of Maria de Saucedo, i.e. the names of her parents and grandparents, therefore her parents are not listed in the database. However, we are are sure that she was descendant of Pedro de Bobadilla and Luis Delgado in some manner.
>
>=====================
>From: Joseph Puentes
>Date: Mon Jun 12 15:04:20 CDT 2006
>To: research@nuestrosranchos.org
>Subject: Re: [Nuestros Ranchos] Hello, Introduction...
>
>thanks for your intro and your participation in the group. I'm at a
>disadvantage since I'm not an Alteño, but then again I do have a
>Miramontes GGGGG grandmother from the Tlaltenango area (not Los Altos). I thought that Steven Hernandez said that the Miramontes were originally Alteños. Well I'm probably mistaken. I wrote to welcome you to the group and to leave you in the hands of the Strong SIG group within the Nuestros Ranchos group that are from Los Altos.
>
>joseph
>
>

Joseph:

As far as Melchora Miramontes... I have been focusing my research on the non-indexed marriage film from Tlaltenango which ends around 1715, therefore she would be too late to be in the database. However, when you mentioned the Diego Castaneda name, it rang a bell and I do have a Diego Castaneda who was having children in Tlaltenango and Atolinga around 1750 in my own family database.

Do you think this is the same person?

http://www.ramosfamily.org/nextgen/getperson.php?personID=I980

Arturo I finally did a smart thing and looked at the date. I was only
wrong by about 50 years is the good news. Luis Castaneda and ?
Miramontes were married in 1730 his parents were Diego Castaneda and
Ynnot. but some of the Testigos were Gonzales. so I'm wondering if this
still might be some of the same family. Here is that record if you or
anyone would like to help figure it out. Kind of difficult:

http://www.nuestrosranchos.org/node/14541

if they were married in 1730 they must have been born around 1710 or so.
Still out of the range of the 1715 time period you mention.

thanks,

joseph

arturoramos wrote:

>Joseph:
>
>As far as Melchora Miramontes... I have been focusing my research on the non-indexed marriage film from Tlaltenango which ends around 1715, therefore she would be too late to be in the database. However, when you mentioned the Diego Castaneda name, it rang a bell and I do have a Diego Castaneda who was having children in Tlaltenango and Atolinga around 1750 in my own family database.
>
>Do you think this is the same person?
>
>http://www.ramosfamily.org/nextgen/getperson.php?personID=I980
>
>
>

Looks like the priest forgot to mention the name of the bride...

As best as I can paleograph it...

En la yglesia parroquial de Tlaltenango en primero de junio de mil setecientos treinta yo... case y vele... en tiempo debido a Luis de Castaneda coyote originario de la villa de Aguascalientes y vecino de esta feligresia a mas tiempo de seis anos, hijo de Diego de Castaneda y de Refugio??? Ynnoz??? fueron testigos de su libertad y solteria Luis de Raigoza, Diego Mojarro y Francisca Ana de Miramontes su...

thanks for the Castanedas from Aguas. . .I'll have to dig in there one
day for a good long search. . .one day.

Well could it be that there are testigos associated with the groom and
testigos associated with the bride.

with the groom: Luis de Raigoza and Diego Mojarro then there is a ";"
then the bride is listed Francisca Ana Miramontes and her testigos: Ju
Visente Gonzales, Ju Jose Gonzales, Dn Xabier Sesati . . .actually no
thats not true or hard to beleive.

Well maybe not associated with the bride and groom but with "Fueron
Testigos de su libertad y solteria" for the first batch of testigos and
then for the second batch of testigos: "Fueron Testigos de la selebrasion."

interesting document though. . .I want to believe that the bride is
Francisca, but maybe she was a testigo in the midst of 5 male testigos.

joseph

ps: I bet you this would be a great record for Professor George Ryskamp
to sort out. He's probably seen it before.

arturoramos wrote:

>Looks like the priest forgot to mention the name of the bride...
>
>As best as I can paleograph it...
>
>En la yglesia parroquial de Tlaltenango en primero de junio de mil setecientos treinta yo... case y vele... en tiempo debido a Luis de Castaneda coyote originario de la villa de Aguascalientes y vecino de esta feligresia a mas tiempo de seis anos, hijo de Diego de Castaneda y de Refugio??? Ynnoz??? fueron testigos de su libertad y solteria Luis de Raigoza, Diego Mojarro y Francisca Ana de Miramontes su...

Lots of children of Diego Castaneda around that time in Aguascalientes Joseph... potential siblings of Luis...

1. MARIA ANTTONIA CASTANEDA VILLALOBOS - International Genealogical Index
Gender: Female Christening: 26 JAN 1706 El Sagrario, Aguascalientes, Aguascalientes, Mexico

2. MARIA MARGATA. CASTANEDA MENDOSA - International Genealogical Index
Gender: Female Christening: 25 JUL 1710 El Sagrario, Aguascalientes, Aguascalientes, Mexico

3. THOMAS CASTANEDA RUIZ - International Genealogical Index
Gender: Male Christening: 22 MAR 1684 Aguascalientes, Aguascalientes, Mexico

4. VISENTE JOSEPH CASTANEDA MENDOSA - International Genealogical Index
Gender: Male Christening: 05 MAY 1708 El Sagrario, Aguascalientes, Aguascalientes, Mexico

5. MIGL. NARSISO CASTANEDA MENDOSA - International Genealogical Index
Gender: Male Christening: 11 NOV 1702 El Sagrario, Aguascalientes, Aguascalientes, Mexico

6. MIGUEL FELICIANO CASTANEDA MENDOSA - International Genealogical Index
Gender: Male Christening: 26 OCT 1704 El Sagrario, Aguascalientes, Aguascalientes, Mexico

7. GABRIEL CASTANEDA RUIZ - International Genealogical Index
Gender: Male Christening: 01 JAN 1683 Aguascalientes, Aguascalientes, Mexico

8. FRANCA. XETRUDIS CASTANEDA MENDOSA - International Genealogical Index
Gender: Female Christening: 20 MAR 1707 El Sagrario, Aguascalientes, Aguascalientes, Mexico

Recently, while reading a marriage record, believe it was 1700's, I came upon "Morisco Libre". I did not find the term in my "Handy-dandy guide". Could this possibly be the name of the local "Indos"?
Enlightenment's appreciated. Helyn

__________________________________________________
Do You Yahoo!?
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Doesn't that mean Free Moor????

joseph

Santos Luna wrote:

>Recently, while reading a marriage record, believe it was 1700's, I came upon "Morisco Libre". I did not find the term in my "Handy-dandy guide". Could this possibly be the name of the local "Indos"?
> Enlightenment's appreciated. Helyn
>
> __________________________________________________
>Do You Yahoo!?
>Tired of spam? Yahoo! Mail has the best spam protection around
>http://mail.yahoo.com

My FHC guide for Latin America has Morisco = Indian, African and Caucasian. In Spain: baptized Moor.

Santos Luna wrote:
Recently, while reading a marriage record, believe it was 1700's, I came upon "Morisco Libre". I did not find the term in my "Handy-dandy guide". Could this possibly be the name of the local "Indos"?
Enlightenment's appreciated. Helyn

__________________________________________________
Do You Yahoo!?
Tired of spam? Yahoo! Mail has the best spam protection around
http://mail.yahoo.com

Patricia and Helyn,

Additionaly "libre" would be free, not a slave.

Alicia

My FHC guide for Latin America has Morisco = Indian, African and Caucasian. In Spain: baptized Moor.

Santos Luna wrote:
Recently, while reading a marriage record, believe it was 1700's, I came upon "Morisco Libre". I did not find the term in my "Handy-dandy guide". Could this possibly be the name of the local "Indos"?
Enlightenment's appreciated. Helyn

As usual....very late in my response!

The following is a short description from Omniglot.com
of what a Morisco is. Of course with "Libre" added
on, I would assume that they were referring to Muslims
freely practice Islam.

"The Moriscos (Spanish for "Moor-like") were Muslims
in Spain and Portugal how were forced to convert to
Christianity at the beginning of the 16th century.
Many Moriscos continued to practice Islam, most in
secret, but some did so openly. A decree issued by
King Felipe II in 1566 obliged the Moriscos to adopt
Spanish language, dress and customs. A number of
unsuccessful rebellions of the Moriscos led to them
being relocated from Granada to other parts of Spain,
particularly Castile. At the beginning of the 17th
century the Moriscos were expelled from Spain to
Algeria, Tunisia, and Morocco."

Hope this helps Helyn!

-Esther

For "morisco libre" I found two possible meanings: someone who is a child of
a mulatto father and a Spanish mother or a "freed Moor" in contrast to a
slave Moor.

Maybe someone can confirm or correct me on this?

On 7/6/06, Esther Valencia wrote:
>
> As usual....very late in my response!
>
> The following is a short description from Omniglot.com
> of what a Morisco is. Of course with "Libre" added
> on, I would assume that they were referring to Muslims
> freely practice Islam.
>
> "The Moriscos (Spanish for "Moor-like") were Muslims
> in Spain and Portugal how were forced to convert to
> Christianity at the beginning of the 16th century.
> Many Moriscos continued to practice Islam, most in
> secret, but some did so openly. A decree issued by
> King Felipe II in 1566 obliged the Moriscos to adopt
> Spanish language, dress and customs.
>

I believe you are correct, Victor. Marge:)
On Jul 6, 2006, at 10:32 PM, victor villarreal wrote:

> For "morisco libre" I found two possible meanings: someone who is a
> child of
> a mulatto father and a Spanish mother or a "freed Moor" in contrast to
> a
> slave Moor.
>
> Maybe someone can confirm or correct me on this?
>
>
> On 7/6/06, Esther Valencia wrote:
>>
>> As usual....very late in my response!
>>
>> The following is a short description from Omniglot.com
>> of what a Morisco is. Of course with "Libre" added
>> on, I would assume that they were referring to Muslims
>> freely practice Islam.
>>
>> "The Moriscos (Spanish for "Moor-like") were Muslims
>> in Spain and Portugal how were forced to convert to
>> Christianity at the beginning of the 16th century.
>> Many Moriscos continued to practice Islam, most in
>> secret, but some did so openly. A decree issued by
>> King Felipe II in 1566 obliged the Moriscos to adopt
>> Spanish language, dress and customs.
>>

Quizá el documento adjunto les de un poco más de claridad para aclarar el punto. Saludos.

"M. Vallazza" escribió:
I believe you are correct, Victor. Marge:)
On Jul 6, 2006, at 10:32 PM, victor villarreal wrote:

> For "morisco libre" I found two possible meanings: someone who is a
> child of
> a mulatto father and a Spanish mother or a "freed Moor" in contrast to
> a
> slave Moor.
>
> Maybe someone can confirm or correct me on this?
>
>
> On 7/6/06, Esther Valencia wrote:
>>
>> As usual....very late in my response!
>>
>> The following is a short description from Omniglot.com
>> of what a Morisco is. Of course with "Libre" added
>> on, I would assume that they were referring to Muslims
>> freely practice Islam.
>>
>> "The Moriscos (Spanish for "Moor-like") were Muslims
>> in Spain and Portugal how were forced to convert to
>> Christianity at the beginning of the 16th century.
>> Many Moriscos continued to practice Islam, most in
>> secret, but some did so openly. A decree issued by
>> King Felipe II in 1566 obliged the Moriscos to adopt
>> Spanish language, dress and customs.
>>

A ver si ahora te llega, son un par de páginas. Saludos.

Esther Valencia escribió: Hola Salvador,

No encontre ningun documento. Creo que se tendra que
incluir el texto en el e-mail. Es un documento muy
largo? Gracias!

-Esther

Hello everyone!

I have recently begun working on my family tree for both my grandmother and
grandfather's side. They were both originally from Jalisco, Mexico. They
lived the majority of their lives in Tonaya. My grandmother Maria Inez
Bautista Diaz was born in Cuatlancillo on April 20, 1903 to Marcos Bautista
and Gabriela Dias - she was 1 of 7 children born to Marcos and Gabriela. My
grandfather Antonio Michel Flores was born in or near El Limon/La Cienega on
January 17, 1900 to Leandro Michel (born 1868) and Maria Flores (born
1874) - he is 1 of 9 children born to Leandro and Maria.

I have spent countless hours at the family history library as well as on my
computer at home but I seem to have reached a road block - If anyone has any
information it would be greatly appreciated.

Thanks,
Julie Fernandez (Michel)

Genealogy Research