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Por nc_coleman |

I have been viewing LDS Film # 0604817 - "Registros Parroquiales - San Juan Bautisita, Sombrerete; Bautismos, 1863-1869". I am searching for children whose father is surnamed CASTRO or DUENAS (~ over N); also 'natural' children born to mothers with either surname. I do this in hopes of finding a connection to link what I know to the unknown.

Some of the records are for a church other than San Juan Bautista. The church is listed as "Iglesia de San Panteleon de la Noria" - and appears to be in the Sombrerete area.
QUESTION: Does anyone research in the Sombrerete area? Can anyone provide background information - historical/geographical for Sombrerete?

QUESTION: On some of the baptismal records the place of birth is listed as follows: "... nacio en la Noria" or "...nacio en este Mineral". Can anyone explain what these terms - en la Noria/ en este Mineral - mean?

QUESTION: On this film, in the first part, though identified as baptismal records, seem to be CIVIL birth records/ civil presentation - the wording is different, just not like the baptismal records. In these records I found a record of a child I believe is a collateral ancestor. However, when I looked for a baptismal record for the corresponding child/date - I didn't find one (I will have to check again to make sure I didn't overlook it). HAS ANYONE else run into this situation?

QUESTION: When/why are the titles of Don and Dona (~ over n) used?

Thanks for any enlightenment you can provide. I know I have asked several questions (In my mind they are related) - if you have an answer/reply to just one question, please cut-and-paste just the question for which you have a comment into the answer. (OK - just so you know - if this doesn't make sense, I apologize - this is how my mind works - logic is not my strong suite).

Natalie in VA

Natalie, your question is one of the reasons I like to work on both civil birth and marriage records and church baptism and church marriage records, sometimes they are years apart for the same person. I know my gr-grandmother was baptized a year before her birth is recorded in the civil record which makes her appear a year younger. I don't think they could have baptized her before she was born and yes, it is the same person. Also the civil and church marriages are sometimes years apart. I noticed when I did the 1930 census for Jerez Zacatecas one of the questions they asked was if they were married both in the church and by the court, not everyone was married in the church much to my surprise. A civil marriage was required by law.

When I was in El Durazno, Jerez Zacatecas in 2003 I went to a family wedding in the church in El Durazno, after the wedding everyone went to the brides home for the reception but the bridal party went to Jerez to get married in a civil ceremony required by law. They arrived at the reception 2 hours later. I was told they were leaving for the states the following day and that's why the civil marriage on the same day.

True to old customs the groom had to prove he could support his bride before her parents allowed the wedding.. He was age 36, working construction in the states and the bride was 18 and living with her parents. The grooms family paid for the wedding, reception and Mariachi's at the church, music at the reception and the band at the plaza for the wedding dance.

Linda in Everett

nc_coleman wrote

QUESTION: On this film, in the first part, though identified as baptismal records, seem to be CIVIL birth records/ civil presentation - the wording is different, just not like the baptismal records. In these records I found a record of a child I believe is a collateral ancestor. However, when I looked for a baptismal record for the corresponding child/date - I didn't find one (I will have to check again to make sure I didn't overlook it). HAS ANYONE else run into this situation?

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Natalie your message seemed pretty logical.

Usually when Don or Doña were used it meant they were people of respect, had money or elders in the community or all of the above.
If you were a peasant and did not have money, even though you were elder they would not use the term "Don" or "Doña".

I hope this helps.
Alicia

I also heard they used Don and Dona to distinguish the Spanish from the "natives".
But it is true that is certainly still in use today as a gesture of respect, regardless of class.
I remember my dad being called Don Ubence in the 40's, even though he was visibly not
"pure" Spanish.

Juanita

Alicia Carrillo wrote:
QUESTION: When/why are the titles of Don and Dona (~ over n) used?

Natalie your message seemed pretty logical.

Usually when Don or Doña were used it meant they were people of respect, had money or elders in the community or all of the above.
If you were a peasant and did not have money, even though you were elder they would not use the term "Don" or "Doña".

I hope this helps.
Alicia

Natalie:

You can find some history on Sombrerete by going to:

http://www.zacatecas.gob.mx/Municipios/SombreHist.html

The link is in the Links section of the site under Municipios de Zacatecas. This was a very important stopover on the Camino Real de Adentro from Mexico City to New Mexico and an important silver mining center.

A Noria is literally a water wheel for a mill. When they say "nacio en la Noria", I am pretty certrain they mean that he was born in the Rancho known as "la Noria" (de San Pantaleon). The priests often abbreviate names of Ranchos like that, e.g. "La Mesa de los Gonzalez" becomes "La Mesa" and "La Labor de San Buenaventura" becomes "La Labor" or "La Laborcita" etc. There is likewise probably a rancho named "El Mineral de ???"

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