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Por Armando |

Hello,

I am looking for the ancestry of Antonio López de la Cerda, Josepha de Hermosillo, Manuel Delgado and Margarita Macias. They are the parents of Juan Antonio Delgado Macias and María Manuela López Hermosillo who married 15 of February 1730 in Cienega de Mata, Ojuelos, Jalisco.

Hola a todos,

Busco a los ancetros de Antonio López de la Cerda, Josepha de Hermosillo, Manuel Delgado y Margarita Macias. Son los padres de Juan Antonio Delgado Macias y María Manuela López Hermosillo casados el 15 de February 1730 en Cienega de Mata, Ojuelos, Jalisco.

Saludos cordiales,

Armando

Hola Armando,

He estudiado estas líneas, me da lástima decirte que aun desconozco la ascendencia de Antonio López de la Cerda y Josefa de Hermosillo aunque si tengo los sospechos. Seguramente es de la misma familia de Aguascalientes y Teocaltiche había varios Antonio López de la Cerda, es imposible idetificar éste necesitaríamos un acta matrimonial u otro tipo de documento que lo puede comprobar si testó buscaré su testamento aver que encuentro.

Si te puedo ayudar con el lado Delgado, Juan Antonio Delgado casó María Manuela López de la Cerda el 15 de febrero de 1730 en Ciénega de Mata hijos de Manuel Delgado y Margarita Macías Valadez casados el 17 de abril de 1706 en Aguascalientes. Manuel Delgado fue bautizado el 14 de enero de 1685 hijo de Luis Delgado y Teresa López de Elizalde; Margarita el 13 de octubre de 1686 también en Aguascalientes hija Pedro Macías Valadez y Luisa Ruiz de Esparza.

Luis Delgado fue hijo de Joseph Delgado y Francisca de Gabay casó Teresa López de Elizalde el 4 de marzo de 1669 en Aguascalientes ella hija de Nicolás López de Elizalde y Regina de Alvarado, también parece como Ávila.

Pedro Macías Valadez casó Luisa Ruiz de Esparza (también Gómez) el 2 de julio de 1684 en Aguascalientes siendo hijos de Pedro Macías Valadez y Josefa Gutiérrez (quien sospecho ser hija de los Gutiérrez de Bilboa); Luisa hija de Francisco Gómez natural de Sevilla en los Reinos de Castilla casado en Aguascalientes 3 de junio de 1647 con Margarita Ruiz de Esparza ella hija e Jacinto Ruiz de Esparza y Juana López de Elizalde y él hijo de Pedro Gómez y María Gómez.

Daniel Méndez de Torres

Hola Daniel,

Muchas gracias por la aportaciones. Resulta que ya tenia Manuel Delgado como
Manuel Delgado de Gabay en mi base de datos pero sin tu ayuda no hubiera
podido darme cuenta que eran la misma persona. Tienes un error pequeño.
Manuel Delgado y Margarita Macías Valadez se casaron el 18 de abril de 1706
en Aguascalientes. Sale es dato mero abajo de la primera página de la
siguiente imagen
https://www.familysearch.org/s/image/show#uri=http%3A//pilot.familysear…

Saludos,
Armando

2011/1/13 Daniel Méndez de Torres

>
> Hola Armando,
>
> He estudiado estas líneas, me da lástima decirte que aun desconozco la
> ascendencia de Antonio López de la Cerda y Josefa de Hermosillo aunque si
> tengo los sospechos. Seguramente es de la misma familia de Aguascalientes y
> Teocaltiche había varios Antonio López de la Cerda, es imposible idetificar
> éste necesitaríamos un acta matrimonial u otro tipo de documento que lo
> puede comprobar si testó buscaré su testamento aver que encuentro.
>
> Si te puedo ayudar con el lado Delgado, Juan Antonio Delgado casó María
> Manuela López de la Cerda el 15 de febrero de 1730 en Ciénega de Mata hijos
> de Manuel Delgado y Margarita Macías Valadez casados el 17 de abril de 1706
> en Aguascalientes. Manuel Delgado fue bautizado el 14 de enero de 1685 hijo
> de Luis Delgado y Teresa López de Elizalde; Margarita el 13 de octubre de
> 1686 también en Aguascalientes hija Pedro Macías Valadez y Luisa Ruiz de
> Esparza.
>
> Luis Delgado fue hijo de Joseph Delgado y Francisca de Gabay casó Teresa
> López de Elizalde el 4 de marzo de 1669 en Aguascalientes ella hija de
> Nicolás López de Elizalde y Regina de Alvarado, también parece como Ávila.
>
> Pedro Macías Valadez casó Luisa Ruiz de Esparza (también Gómez) el 2 de
> julio de 1684 en Aguascalientes siendo hijos de Pedro Macías Valadez y
> Josefa Gutiérrez (quien sospecho ser hija de los Gutiérrez de Bilboa); Luisa
> hija de Francisco Gómez natural de Sevilla en los Reinos de Castilla casado
> en Aguascalientes 3 de junio de 1647 con Margarita Ruiz de Esparza ella hija
> e Jacinto Ruiz de Esparza y Juana López de Elizalde y él hijo de Pedro Gómez
> y María Gómez.
>
> Daniel Méndez de Torres
>

Si parece que tuve la fecha incorrecta gracias. No se como surgio ese dato solo tuve
el mes y dia incorrecto. Debemos probar la linea de Antonio Lopez de la Cerda,
muchas veces ayuda empezar al tronco del arbol o sea hacia los descendientes.
Como dije anteriormente habia unos cuatro del mismo nombre aun no se si era el
mismo hombre casados varias veces una posibilidad.

Daniel Méndez de Torres

Raul Macias Hello, can you help me out here, I'm kinda stuck at a dead end. I am descendant of Andres Masias. Have you come across any information relating Andres Masias and Margarita Masias. I have found Margarita Masias y Manuel Delgado are Padrinos to my ancestor Maria Gertrudis, who was baptized in Cienega de Mata Ojuelos, Jalisco, on 27mar1731. Maria Gertrudis is the daughter of Andres Masias and Maria de los Dolores Pacheco. I seek to trace back Andres Masias as far as possible. Thank you or any one else who may wish to add something.

I hope this helps or leads you in the right direction. The Padrinos should be the same Manuel Delgado and Margarita Macias who married in Aguascalientes on Apr 18, 1706. Since there is a generation gap, they could be aunts and uncles of your ancestor. Without a doubt we're dealing with the Macias Valades, family. I do not have anything on any Andres Macias Valades, the only one I have is the one married to Dolores Hurtado in 1726 in Aguascalientes.

Daniel

Raul Macias. Daniel thank you. I have been in the mire and have been tracing the same genology that you have proposed. I also have an Antonio casimiro masias as padrino to another son of Andres masias. Casimiro is from aguascalientes. I wonder if pedros macias valades' first wife is the spinner here. Again thank you.

I have come to realize that Maria Gertrudis Masias de los Dolores does not have Pacheco as her mothers last name. I don't want anyone to get that wrong, pardon me. I continue to seek information on Andres Masias and Maria de los Dolores Pachecho who were baptizing their children at La Punta en La capilla de Cienega de Mata, at the earliest date of 10 jul 1735.

Raúl,

If you search for children of Andres Macias and Dolores you will see that
Dolores uses the surname Hurtado for Leonarda Crecencia http://goo.gl/6ChYR

I searched for a marriage of Andres Macias and Dolores before those dates
and I found their marriage in Aguas http://goo.gl/SVpPF

Since that marriage entry does not name the parents I searched the
Matrimonial Investigations file made by Robert Fulton and I found the
following:

Volume 1725/26: image 215
23 Dec 1725
Groom: Mazias Valadez, Andres (Espanol; ).......Bride: Hurtado, Maria de
los Dolores (Espanola; )
Father:......................................................................Father:
Pacheco, Xptoval
Mother:
....................................................................Mother:
Lisaldi, Maria
Former spouse: ......................................................Former
spouse:
Notes: married 7 Jan 1726

The IM entry actually states Andrés was the son of Juan Macias and Beatriz
López de Elizalde
https://familysearch.org/pal:/MM9.3.1/TH-266-11610-152321-99?cc=1410092…

Andrés was baptized 29 de diciembre 1691 in Aguas

Juan Macias and Beatriz López were married 19 Mar 1665 in Aguas
https://familysearch.org/pal:/MM9.3.1/TH-266-12446-30455-33?cc=1410092&…

Beatriz uses the surname Alvarado in the baptism of her daughter Ana Macias
meaning this Beatriz could be the daughter of Luis de Alvarado and Beatriz
López de Elizalde who was the daughter of Juan López de Elizalde y Aberruza
and Leonor Becerra y Sánchez de Mendoza

It would be a good idea to get a DNA test to further the investigation of
your paternal line.

Saludos
Armando

On Tue, Dec 20, 2011 at 10:10 PM, wrote:

> I have come to realize that Maria Gertrudis Masias de los Dolores does not
> have Pacheco as her mothers last name. I don't want anyone to get that
> wrong, pardon me. I continue to seek information on Andres Masias and Maria
> de los Dolores Pachecho who were baptizing their children at La Punta en La
> capilla de Cienega de Mata, at the earliest date of 10 jul 1735.

Armando

Thanks for catching the omission of the parents of Andres Macias Valades in the matrimonial investigation index. I'll update the posting of this file in the near future.

George Fulton
Pleasanton, CA

George,

You're welcome and I apologize for mistating your first name in that post.
As far as these files of the IM they have been extremely helpful to me. One
improvement I can think of is if the names were provided in their current
standardized form or at least to have everyone listed with the same
spelling for the same name. For instance Macias, Masias, Massias, and
Mazias can all be listed as Macias, or if you prefer Masias. Villalobos,
Villalovos, and Billalobos should be Villalobos since it contains the words
villa (village) and lobos (wolves). This would make searching the documents
much easier and less time consuming.

Regards
Armando

On Wed, Dec 21, 2011 at 9:50 PM, wrote:

> Armando
>
> Thanks for catching the omission of the parents of Andres Macias Valades
> in the matrimonial investigation index. I'll update the posting of this
> file in the near future.
>
> George Fulton
> Pleasanton, CA

Wow! Thank you. All the info before Juan Masias and Beatriz Lopez Matrimonial fit. The exception I Question is that here Juan is listed as Mestizo, I wonder if such a prominate Name as Masias Valadez would have stood for such slight. All other info state Masias as Espanole and originale. Any Suggestions? Merry Christmas!

Originales or originarios means they were born in the location describes in
the entry, which isn't always accurate either. It has nothing to do with
their calidad or caste. Andrés really should have been mentioned as a
castizo since his father was mestizo and his mother española. A few members
of the prominent families married with members of Indian and mestizo
families and in rare cases, mulatas. Some members couldn't marry with
igualdad and sometimes to marry with igualdad they had to marry relatives
which can be seen in many of the dispensas. Some members of the Macias
Valadez family were poor as stated in the death of one of them from that
era. Also we don't know if Juan was from a legitimate marriage or a hijo
expuesto or de padres no conocidos. Something else to consider is there
were times when the calidad would be mistated or made without regard to who
the parents were. This is why I recommend getting a Y-DNA test. Hopefully
you will find a match with someone that has their line well documented.

Saludos
Armando

On Sat, Dec 24, 2011 at 2:13 PM, wrote:

> Wow! Thank you. All the info before Juan Masias and Beatriz Lopez
> Matrimonial fit. The exception I Question is that here Juan is listed as
> Mestizo, I wonder if such a prominate Name as Masias Valadez would have
> stood for such slight. All other info state Masias as Espanole and
> originale. Any Suggestions? Merry Christmas! -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- --

Raul Macias Greetings Armando, I have ordered thefamilytreedna kit. Where does one go to compare test results to look for a match?, Saludos!

Greetings to all,
My family has finally agreed to have our DNA analyzed.  I would appreciate and need input as to which and whose DNA testing is the initial one to go with.   Thank you so much for all your help.   Alice  

--- On Wed, 9/12/12, maciasraul@ymail.com wrote:

From: maciasraul@ymail.com
Subject: [Nuestros Ranchos] Y-DNA
To: research@lists.nuestrosranchos.org
Date: Wednesday, September 12, 2012, 3:54 PM

Raul Macias Greetings Armando, I have ordered thefamilytreedna kit. Where does one go to compare test results to look for a match?, Saludos!

Greetings to all,
My family has finally agreed to have our DNA analyzed.  I would appreciate and need input as to which and whose DNA testing is the initial one to go with.   Thank you so much for all your help.   Alice  

--- On Wed, 9/12/12, maciasraul@ymail.com wrote:

From: maciasraul@ymail.com
Subject: [Nuestros Ranchos] Y-DNA
To: research@lists.nuestrosranchos.org
Date: Wednesday, September 12, 2012, 3:54 PM

Raul Macias Greetings Armando, I have ordered thefamilytreedna kit. Where does one go to compare test results to look for a match?, Saludos!

Hello Raúl. Once you receive your results you will be given a list of
matches and you will also be given a ysearch.org link to upload your
results and your gedcom to. Have you received your results? How many
markers did you test for?

Saludos,
Armando

On Wed, Sep 12, 2012 at 10:54 AM, wrote:

> Raul Macias Greetings Armando, I have ordered thefamilytreedna kit. Where
> does one go to compare test results to look for a match?, Saludos!
>

Hello Armondo,I trust you're well. I took the 12 mark test, whose results are:ydna- R1B1a2; shorthand- R-M269.
I also found in informacion Matromonial 1725-1726 image 215 and 216, aguascalientes, sagrario, marriage date 06jan1726. https://familysearch.org/pal:/MM9.1.1/JHPY-JJB,for Andres macias valadez con maria dolores urtado. I noticed that Andres was baptized and listed as masias lopes by the church records and later he writes his name as masias valadez in the informacion matrimomial. Have you an opinion on this. Gracias.

Hello Raúl,

I am well, thank you. You should upgrade your 12 marker test to a 37 marker
test then upload the results to ysearch.org. The upgrade is on sale right
now for $69. You should also get a deep clade test and let us know the
results.

The difference in surnames is not significant. The person recording and the
people giving the names weren't always precise and sometimes would decide
to change the use of the surnames.

Saludos
Armando

On Mon, Nov 12, 2012 at 3:54 PM, wrote:

> Hello Armondo,I trust you're well. I took the 12 mark test, whose results
> are:ydna- R1B1a2; shorthand- R-M269. I also found in informacion
> Matromonial 1725-1726 image 215 and 216, aguascalientes, sagrario, marriage
> date 06jan1726. https://familysearch.org/pal:/**MM9.1.1/JHPY-JJB,forAndres macias valadez con maria dolores urtado. I noticed that Andres was
> baptized and listed as masias lopes by the church records and later he
> writes his name as masias valadez in the informacion matrimomial. Have you
> an opinion on this. Gracias.
>

Armando..I do have 37marker test done a couple of years ago..it can be found in the FTMDNA..Raul

--- On Mon, 11/12/12, Armando wrote:

From: Armando
Subject: Re: [Nuestros Ranchos] Y-DNA
To: research@nuestrosranchos.org
Date: Monday, November 12, 2012, 8:04 PM

Hello Raúl,

I am well, thank you. You should upgrade your 12 marker test to a 37 marker
test then upload the results to ysearch.org. The upgrade is on sale right
now for $69. You should also get a deep clade test and let us know the
results.

The difference in surnames is not significant. The person recording and the
people giving the names weren't always precise and sometimes would decide
to change the use of the surnames.

Saludos
Armando

On Mon, Nov 12, 2012 at 3:54 PM, wrote:

> Hello Armondo,I trust you're well. I took the 12 mark test, whose results
> are:ydna- R1B1a2; shorthand- R-M269. I also found in informacion
> Matromonial 1725-1726 image 215 and 216, aguascalientes, sagrario, marriage
> date 06jan1726. https://familysearch.org/pal:/**MM9.1.1/JHPY-JJB,forAndres macias valadez con maria dolores urtado. I noticed that Andres was
> baptized and listed as masias lopes by the church records and later he
> writes his name as masias valadez in the informacion matrimomial. Have you
> an opinion on this.  Gracias.
>

Armando, again many thanks for said info. It turns out that my dna matches an unknown Guerra. Have you anything further? Raul Macias

I have an idea which Guerra family you are referring to but I would need
you to email me directly to discuss that further.

I strongly advise that you also join the Los Altos de Jalisco DNA project
by going to the following page and using option A.

http://www.familytreedna.com/group-join-request.aspx?group=losaltosdeja…

On Sat, Jul 6, 2013 at 4:13 PM, wrote:

> Armando, again many thanks for said info. It turns out that my dna matches
> an unknown Guerra. Have you anything further? Raul Macias

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