Raphael Femat married Juana Raphaela Aguilar after 14 march 1789 (date of informacion matrimonial) in zacatecas (sagrario). They both state coyote as their caste. These are the parents of Manuel Romo (of aguascalientes) who lived in Nadadores and later San Buenaventura. For more info see the image (637): https://familysearch.org/pal:/MM9.3.1/TH-1-15209-14797-6?cc=1804458&wc=…
Bernardo Mechaca, you were right! Raphael Romo was aka Raphael Femat!
Regards
Denise Fastrup
Ps there is a death record indexed for raphaelas mother in aguascalientes..The trail goes on!
22 June 1732
Antonia Rosalia 8 days old, esp. h.l.
Father: Manuel Villalpando
Mother: Maria de los Dolores
Padrino: Nicolas Vicente de Esparza
In later records (Diego's marriage to Ana Valdes and the info mat for his daughter Rafaela to Raphael Femat/Romo) he has the title Don, and Rosalia is Dona. This is not the case is the records from 1759 (legal case involving his brother in law, more info on this in my post dated 4 aug 2018 in the topic "Villalpando families from Asientos") Nor are these titles used for Rosalias parents in her birth record in 1732. And, Rosalia is noted as espanola, but her daughter is listed as coyota in her informacion matrimonial. From going through the baptisms and info matr. of Asientos I can see that there was a good deal of intermarriage going on beween castas, including spanish women who married mulatto men - even a woman with the title dona who married a mulatto (she was 36 and he was 50 years old). I hope I can find Antonia Rosalias grandparents and maybe solve that mystery. I also hope to find more info on Diego de el Aguila and confirm or rule out his relation to the Indian Aguilas of Lagos de Moreno. These records are a fascinating window into colonial society in the 1700's! Some of the court records are dry reading, but the one I found yesterday was a real tear-jerker. The young woman had her reputation ruined, while the young man later married and had kids with someone else. If I had not read it, and gotten names and relationships of this Villalpando family linked to Diego de el Aguila, I would probably never have found Rosalia's birth record.
Anyone have any relevant info on the above, I'd love to hear from you!
It turns out that I had studied your extended family a long time ago. A couple of distant cousins of years had contacted me asking for help in figuring out how their Romo ancestry connected with the Romo family from Aguascalientes and Jalisco. I was unable to prove the connection at that time. Many of those notes were stored away and didn't come to light until ten minutes ago when a light bulb finally turned on and I was able to connect these distant cousins of yours to you as they also descend from Manuel Romo and Maria Ignacia Rodriguez. I will try to contact your distant cousins as I do have old addresses. These Romos spread out through Coahuila and Texas.
You are correct, Emilio is not your second cousin once removed. Emilio Fernandez Romo is your first cousin twice removed. In my immediate family we would just say he is your uncle.
Sorry Denise for answering so late, I hadn't read you post (about finding Rafael Romo and Rafaela de Aguila as padrinos for a baptism in 1791) until today while reviewing the thread.
So Rafaela de Aguila was alive as late as Jan/1791.
Also, by certification by the Zacatecas priest, Rafael Femate's second wife Joaquina de Salas was buried on the the 19/Aug/1796.
So this constrains the dates for Rafaela’s death.
By the way, I have found Manuel Romo's (son of Rafael Femat, aka Romo, and Rafaela de Aguila) burial date: 9/Feb/1857 in San Buenaventura, Coahuila. It is stated he was a widower and was 69 years old.
If his reported age is to be trusted (most of the time it is not), then he probably was born around 1787-1788. This would predate their marriage. I’m guessing his reported age is off and he probably was born 1789-1790.
I have seen something with the names Aguila and Castorena, mentioned in the baptism you refer to above. Will have to go back and find it! Where did Josepha de Aguila - and her parents - come from...?
Dear Denise,
Emilio Fernandez Romo was a close cousin of yours, not a very distant cousin.. The great Grandmother that you descend from is his mother's sister, this would make him your second cousin, once removed. Emilio's mother married twice. Emilio was from the first marriage.
Thanks for providing another Romo line to my book,
Rick A. Ricci
Oh yes, he was my grandfather's cousin, and (my mom has told me) considered scandalous with his Hollywood lifestyle and divorce - norms were different back then! Today, speaking for myself, he was an incredible, multi-talented artist.
There were a number of Romo siblings, and its funny how they chose to be buried next to eachother (as opposed to being being buried with their spouse. This you can check out via Find A Grave, I think. I have been to the cemetary two times and seen this myself. Can't recall if Dona Sara (his mother) is buried there.
My great-grandmother Genoveva married Guiseppe Angelo Sarro, who apparently came with a contingent of Italians to Mexico, invited by the Mexican government to settle and start farms in a few specific places. They were promised paradise and landed in chaotic bureacracy in Veracruz, and their final destination inland was a desert-like area. Lives were lost to cholera and heat, and they gave up the project. Some went north and settled in San Antonio, some went to South America, and some went to other places in Mexico. Among those who went to San Antonio were my great grandfather, one or two of his brothers, and their parents. It looks like (i am not 100% sure) that one brother married a German girl, one married an Italian (from the original group - they married in Mexico) and one (my g-grandfather) married a Mexican girl 15 years old (Genoveva ROMO), who had run away from an arranged marriage.
Thanks for sharing your family line. Did Genoveva marry before she ran away? If she did marry a first time, do you know the first husband's name?
The story of Emilio being the model for the Oscar statue can be seen in the shape of the statue. He was young and unknown when they chose him as the model. He was extremely athletic and his physique was partially shaped from diving off the cliffs in Acapulco. He had very broad shoulders like you see in the statue.
Married Genoveva 3 dec 1893 in SAN ANTONIO TX. She was only about 15, so I would think it was her first marriage. She was supposed to have married the town doctor, much older than herself. But, she didn't want to, so she and her brother left town and ended up in San Antonio. The rest of the family followed soon thereafter. I have seen the graves of Don Jesus Romo and Dona Josefa Romo (Bustamante) in San Fernando Cemetery. https://www.familysearch.org/ark:/61903/3:1:33SQ-GPQM-W4T?i=337&cc=1803… link to marriage record
Information about the Italian project in Mexico in 1882-83: https://gutierrezcolony.wordpress.com/history/
where the disease which killed 34 of the italians was measles, not cholera like i wrote before. They ended up in San Luis Potosi, Ciudad de Maiz.
Giovanni-Giuseppe Sarro
Event Type Immigration
Event Date 27 Feb 1882
Event Place New York, New York, New York, United States
Gender Male
Age 22
Birthplace Italy
Occupation Laborer
Ship Name Caledonia
Birth Year (Estimated) 1860
Departure Port Naples
Literacy Unknown
Destination Place NEW YORK
Transit or Travel Compartment Staying in the USA [Transit]; Steerage [Travel]
Affiliate Manifest ID 00000230
Affiliate ARC Identifier 1746097
Citing this Record
"United States Italians to America Index, 1855-1900," database, FamilySearch(https://familysearch.org/ark:/61903/1:1:KD4T-VF9 : 27 December 2014), Giovanni-Giuseppe Sarro, 27 Feb 1882; citing Italians to America Passenger Data File, 1855-1900, Ship Caledonia, departed from Naples, arrived in New York, New York, New York, United States, NAID identifier 1746097, National Archives at College Park, Maryland.
Thanks for the info! However, Sarro was a common name and more than one Guiseppe Sarro came to the US around turn of the century. My great grandfather landed in Veracruz, my grandfather and my mother have told me. We have a walking cane which was his, which he brought with him from Mexico. My mother told me he came with his parents and brother. He died relatively young - my grandfather was in 9th grade.
My grandfather could still speak a few phrases in Italian when I was teenager. I have tried to find out who his grandparents ( my great-great-grandparents) are, and have finally succeed, thanks to the city directories for San Antonio in the late 1800’s - early 1900s. This information linked Guiseppe to Carmen and Emil, to Angelo (his father), and to Louise (his mother)
Below are the sources I have so far, which document Guiseppe Sarro of San Antonio.
Regards,
Denise
Italian name: Guiseppe Angelo Sarro, stated by my grandfather (his son)
Name in San Antonio directories: Jose, Guiseppe, Joseph Sarro (I have looked at directories between 1883 - 1910)
Name in census 9 june 1900: Joe Sarro (see link below)
Burial Record
Name:
Joseph Sarro
Birth Date:
10 May 1861
Death Date:
24 Jan 1924
Cemetery:
San Fernando Cemetery #1
Burial or Cremation Place:
San Antonio, Bexar County, Texas, United States of America
https://www.familysearch.org/ark:/61903/1:1:QV14-QQVG
"Texas, County Marriage Records, 1837-1965," database with images, FamilySearch(https://familysearch.org/ark:/61903/1:1:QV14-QQVG : accessed 11 October 2017), Guiseppe Saŕro and Antonia Santre, 11 Feb 1888, Marriage; citing Bexar, Texas, United States, various county clerk offices, Texas State Library and Archives Commission, Texas Dept. of State Health Services and Golightly-Payne-Coon Co.; FHL microfilm 24923.
1885 - FIRST RECORD OF GUISEPPE SARRO IN SAN ANTONIO - San Antonio City Directory: “JOSE Sarro” - LIVING WITH ANGELO SARRO
______________________
1883 Mention of Angel Sarro and Maria Luisa Greco, parents of Carmen Sarro (brother of Guiseppe)
Marriage of Carmen Sarro and Angela Bolner, Ciudad de maiz, SLP, Mex. 03 May 1883
-he 25, from Naples, “zapatero” son of Angel Sarro and Maria Luisa Greco
-she 20 yrs old, from Trento, Tyrol, Austria, daughter of Antonio Bolner and Maria Teresa
Marguela
-San Luis Potosi, Civil Registration marriages, 1860-1967, ciudad del maiz 1881-1886
-Gs film 722813 image 255 and 261 http://search.ancestry.com/cgi-bin/sse.dll?_phsrc=hEQ611&_phstart=succe…
Thank you Denise for sharing your SARRO family information. I too found many Giuseeppe Sarros. There are also many Carmen Sarros, Emil Sarro and Angel Sarros. There are also many Maria Louisa Grecos. These names were extremely popular during this time period which makes it difficult to go back further on these lines. However, all these common names may lead to finding connections between all these similarly named people.
The first person to contact me asking for help in connecting the Romo's from Coahuila and Texas to Aguascalientes passed away a few years ago. There was another person that asked for help that also descended from these families but he has not responded to the only address I have for him. If he ever responds I will let you know.
I am very interested in the information that you provided that:
" the Somos Primos web site, el Teniente Coronel Palmerin and his wife have published information that proves that Emilio "El Indio" Fernandez was a descendant of Manuel Romo, Rafael Femat´s son"
Please send me a link or the date of the issue in somisprimos so that I can review and investigate the ancestral lines of Emilio Fernandez
I should have seen the record for joaquina de salas, as i went through the zac zac sag record going back from 1798 to 1789. I did not see her name, but i did hop over about 50 images at the start of one of the films because they were not info matrimonial records ( i checked about every 5th one) when i get back to my regular computer tonight i can write back and tell you the precise range of images.
Raphael Femat/Romo had at least 4 siblings. You will find them if you do a search with Femat, aguascalientes 1760 1790, mothers last name Velasco. The marriages of these siblings are indexed. Raphael got married first so he was probably the oldest. Last marriage was In 1808. Gloria Delgado in a reply to one of your previous posts mention two of these marriages.
The abovementioned search lists a marriage of a femat and a romo de vivar in rincon de romos in 1788. There might be a dispensa for that, i'll be checking that out later.
At last I found the christening record for the Rafael Romo of Nadadores and San Buenaventura, Coahuila.
His full name was originally Joseph Eucebio Raphael Femat, son of Ignacio Antonio Femat and Victoria Antonia Velasco. He was christened on the 21/Nov/1763 in Asientos (present day Aguascalientes).
The marriage record of Ignacio Antonio Femat and Victoria Antonia Velasco states that he was the son of Antonio Fermin Femat and Monica Romo. This links with the information that Armando was so kind in providing me, with the ancestry of Monica Lorenza Romo de Vivar (daughter of Nicolas Romo de Vivar and Maria de Villalobos)
I also found two other siblings of Raphael Femat:
Maria Rosalia Femat, christened the 18/Nov/1765
Maria Gertrudis Diega Femat, christened the 22/Nov/1767
Also, I finally looked at the información matrimonial record of Rafael
Femat and Justa Rafaela. The surname of Justa Rafaela is actually del
Aguila which is a surname some of the Tlaxcalteca chieftans used.
At last I found the christening record for the Rafael Romo of Nadadores and
San Buenaventura, Coahuila.
His full name was originally Joseph Eucebio Raphael Femat, son of Ignacio
Antonio Femat and Victoria Antonia Velasco. He was christened on the
21/Nov/1763 in Asientos (present day Aguascalientes).
The marriage record of Ignacio Antonio Femat and Victoria Antonia Velasco
states that he was the son of Antonio Fermin Femat and Monica Romo. This
links with the information that Armando was so kind in providing me, with
the ancestry of Monica Lorenza Romo de Vivar (daughter of Nicolas Romo de
Vivar and Maria de Villalobos)
I also found two other siblings of Raphael Femat:
Maria Rosalia Femat, christened the 18/Nov/1765
Maria Gertrudis Diega Femat, christened the 22/Nov/1767
Very exciting news Armando and Bernardo!
I can hardly wait to get back from work to check out the marriage and baptism links.
Quick question for Armando - where did you get your information about Aguila being a Tlaxcala surname? (i thought the missing "r" in the surname was a mistake - good to get that corrected!) I'd like to read more on this, and add the source to my list for my geneaology. It would explain why coyote was listed as her caste...
Indeed, it will be very interesting to explore this Aguila line.
On the other hand, on the Somos Primos web site, el Teniente Coronel Palmerin and his wife have published information that proves that Emilio "El Indio" Fernandez was a descendant of Manuel Romo, Rafael Femat´s son, as Denise had mentioned.
I got the information about the Aguila surname when I purchased and read the book Bautismos, Matrimonios Y Defunciones, En El Primer Siglo De Santa Maria De Los Lagos by Mario Gómez Mata. It talks about Sebastián Hernández del Águila being a Tlaxcaltecan ally of Cortés and that his descendants founded a Republica de Indios in Lagos de Moreno and later Pueblo de Moya.
He is mentioned in the footnotes on pages 48, 56, and 252.
I have seen the surname Aguila multiple times in records of Información Matrimonial in Lagos de Moreno and in Aguascalientes. They are always recorded as indios.
You probably already know that a coyote was a child of an indio and a mestiza or a mestizo and an india and the Aguila surname would likley have come from an Indian ancestor, maybe related to the Aguila family of Lagos de Moreno.
This line has gotten interesting. In trying to find out more about the Aguila name I started looking for others with it, plus looking for Justa Rafaela Aguila's parents. (I even made a post wondering if it was an alternative to Avila). Then yesterday I found this:
Its the marriage record for her father's (Don Diego de el Aguila) second marriage with Anna Maria Valdez, where his first wife Rosalia Villalpando is mentioned. Diego's father was named Don Sebastian de el Aguila and his mother Dona Maria Theresa Lopez de Nava. THis fits with other here at NR which I am sure you have seen, an email by Jaime Alvarado, linking the name Aguila (specifically the names Diego and Sebastian)with Tlaxcalans. Maybe the names Diego and Sebastian were passed down into the 1700's in that family, if it's the same family...thats what I will working on in the coming weeks...
Regards, and thanks for your response and links which I will check later today after Work!
This book gives some insight into life and society in Zacatecas in the Spanish colonial period. Kind of dry reading in some sections, but i like the historical perspective it gives to the names and dates i chase...raphael femat/romo spent some time here, albeit in a later period.
Silver Mining and Society in Colonial Mexico: Zacatecas, 1546-1700 by Peter John Bakewell
Hi Bernardo
Yes, exciting! But i could not get beyond Sebastian and Diego, so now i am looking for Joaquina Salas wife #2 of raphael Femat/romo. I want to know why raphael and rafaela called themselves coyote in their info matrimonial. With juana lopez he is espanol and his bapt says espanol. Yet there is no doubt this is the same person, so now i want to see the. Info mat with joaquina...digging through the info mat of zacatecas, sagrario 1782-83. Turns out the records are from 1781 then skip up to 1788 at image 93, but have to keep paging through just in case the 82-83 years are there in later images. Once the year of the info mat is pinned down, it will make it easier to look for manuel romos baptism. It would be good to get that nailed down.
Antonia Rosalia Villalpando and Diego Xavier de el Aguila
Hi
The parents of Justa Rafaela Aguila are Dn Diego Xavier de el AGUILA and Dna Rosalia VILLALPANDO.
Earlier in this thread, I reported documentation of her death.
Now I have found her baptism record!
This is the link (Aguascalientes, Baptisms, Asientos, Nuestro Senora de Belen 1705-1736):
https://www.familysearch.org/ark:/61903/3:1:S3HT-DCXQ-GY1?i=739&wc=M6Q6…
Image 740
22 June 1732
Antonia Rosalia 8 days old, esp. h.l.
Father: Manuel Villalpando
Mother: Maria de los Dolores
Padrino: Nicolas Vicente de Esparza
In later records (Diego's marriage to Ana Valdes and the info mat for his daughter Rafaela to Raphael Femat/Romo) he has the title Don, and Rosalia is Dona. This is not the case is the records from 1759 (legal case involving his brother in law, more info on this in my post dated 4 aug 2018 in the topic "Villalpando families from Asientos") Nor are these titles used for Rosalias parents in her birth record in 1732. And, Rosalia is noted as espanola, but her daughter is listed as coyota in her informacion matrimonial. From going through the baptisms and info matr. of Asientos I can see that there was a good deal of intermarriage going on beween castas, including spanish women who married mulatto men - even a woman with the title dona who married a mulatto (she was 36 and he was 50 years old). I hope I can find Antonia Rosalias grandparents and maybe solve that mystery. I also hope to find more info on Diego de el Aguila and confirm or rule out his relation to the Indian Aguilas of Lagos de Moreno. These records are a fascinating window into colonial society in the 1700's! Some of the court records are dry reading, but the one I found yesterday was a real tear-jerker. The young woman had her reputation ruined, while the young man later married and had kids with someone else. If I had not read it, and gotten names and relationships of this Villalpando family linked to Diego de el Aguila, I would probably never have found Rosalia's birth record.
Anyone have any relevant info on the above, I'd love to hear from you!
Regards
Denise
Old notes on Romos from Coahulia and Texas
Dear Denise,
It turns out that I had studied your extended family a long time ago. A couple of distant cousins of years had contacted me asking for help in figuring out how their Romo ancestry connected with the Romo family from Aguascalientes and Jalisco. I was unable to prove the connection at that time. Many of those notes were stored away and didn't come to light until ten minutes ago when a light bulb finally turned on and I was able to connect these distant cousins of yours to you as they also descend from Manuel Romo and Maria Ignacia Rodriguez. I will try to contact your distant cousins as I do have old addresses. These Romos spread out through Coahuila and Texas.
Regards,
Rick A. Ricci
RAFAEL FEMAT AND RAFAELA DE AGUILA IN A DOCUMENT
Hi Bernardo
I found Rafael Femat and Rafaela de Aguila mentioned as padrinos:
GS film # 1156077 IMAGE 576
Baptisms 1775-91, Nuestra Senora de Belen, ASIENTOS, Aguascalientes
Child: Juan Antonio Chrisostomo
christened: 30 Jan 1791
parents:Esteban Castorena and MARIA JOSEFA DE LA AGUILA
https://www.familysearch.org/ark:/61903/3:1:S3HY-6XWW-SKV?i=575&wc=M6Q6…
IT SAYS ABOUT RAFAEL AND RAFAELA, "VECINOS DE ESTE REAL" - DOES THAT MEAN THEY WERE LIVING IN ASIENTOS?
IT INDICATES RAFAELA WAS ALIVE IN EARLY 1791.
Regards
Denise
First cousin twice removed.
Dear Denise ,
You are correct, Emilio is not your second cousin once removed. Emilio Fernandez Romo is your first cousin twice removed. In my immediate family we would just say he is your uncle.
Regards,
Rick
Rafaela de Aguila
Sorry Denise for answering so late, I hadn't read you post (about finding Rafael Romo and Rafaela de Aguila as padrinos for a baptism in 1791) until today while reviewing the thread.
So Rafaela de Aguila was alive as late as Jan/1791.
Also, by certification by the Zacatecas priest, Rafael Femate's second wife Joaquina de Salas was buried on the the 19/Aug/1796.
So this constrains the dates for Rafaela’s death.
By the way, I have found Manuel Romo's (son of Rafael Femat, aka Romo, and Rafaela de Aguila) burial date: 9/Feb/1857 in San Buenaventura, Coahuila. It is stated he was a widower and was 69 years old.
If his reported age is to be trusted (most of the time it is not), then he probably was born around 1787-1788. This would predate their marriage. I’m guessing his reported age is off and he probably was born 1789-1790.
Bernardo Menchaca
castorena and aguila
Hi Bernardo
I have seen something with the names Aguila and Castorena, mentioned in the baptism you refer to above. Will have to go back and find it! Where did Josepha de Aguila - and her parents - come from...?
Thanks for bringing it to my attention again!
Regards
Denise
Second cousin once removed
Dear Denise,
Emilio Fernandez Romo was a close cousin of yours, not a very distant cousin.. The great Grandmother that you descend from is his mother's sister, this would make him your second cousin, once removed. Emilio's mother married twice. Emilio was from the first marriage.
Thanks for providing another Romo line to my book,
Rick A. Ricci
Emilio Romo and Sara Romo and Italians in Mexico
Hi Rick
Oh yes, he was my grandfather's cousin, and (my mom has told me) considered scandalous with his Hollywood lifestyle and divorce - norms were different back then! Today, speaking for myself, he was an incredible, multi-talented artist.
There were a number of Romo siblings, and its funny how they chose to be buried next to eachother (as opposed to being being buried with their spouse. This you can check out via Find A Grave, I think. I have been to the cemetary two times and seen this myself. Can't recall if Dona Sara (his mother) is buried there.
My great-grandmother Genoveva married Guiseppe Angelo Sarro, who apparently came with a contingent of Italians to Mexico, invited by the Mexican government to settle and start farms in a few specific places. They were promised paradise and landed in chaotic bureacracy in Veracruz, and their final destination inland was a desert-like area. Lives were lost to cholera and heat, and they gave up the project. Some went north and settled in San Antonio, some went to South America, and some went to other places in Mexico. Among those who went to San Antonio were my great grandfather, one or two of his brothers, and their parents. It looks like (i am not 100% sure) that one brother married a German girl, one married an Italian (from the original group - they married in Mexico) and one (my g-grandfather) married a Mexican girl 15 years old (Genoveva ROMO), who had run away from an arranged marriage.
Regards
Denise
Genoveva's arranged marriage has me curious.
Hi Denise,
Thanks for sharing your family line. Did Genoveva marry before she ran away? If she did marry a first time, do you know the first husband's name?
The story of Emilio being the model for the Oscar statue can be seen in the shape of the statue. He was young and unknown when they chose him as the model. He was extremely athletic and his physique was partially shaped from diving off the cliffs in Acapulco. He had very broad shoulders like you see in the statue.
Saludos,
Rick
Genoveva Romo and Guiseppe Angelo Sarro
Hi Rick
Here is what I have on Guiseppe and Genoveva:
Joe sarro immigrated 1883 21 years old, b. May 1862, 17 years in US, according to info from 1900 census
Genoveva b. Jan 1876 also according to census.
https://www.familysearch.org/ark:/61903/3:1:S3HY-DKRQ-3JY?i=24&cc=13252… CENSUS link
Married Antonia Santre 11 feb 1888 - I have not found her in any other records from the US, Mexico or Italy
https://www.familysearch.org/ark:/61903/3:1:33S7-9P3B-G18?i=57&cc=18039… link to marriage record
Married Genoveva 3 dec 1893 in SAN ANTONIO TX. She was only about 15, so I would think it was her first marriage. She was supposed to have married the town doctor, much older than herself. But, she didn't want to, so she and her brother left town and ended up in San Antonio. The rest of the family followed soon thereafter. I have seen the graves of Don Jesus Romo and Dona Josefa Romo (Bustamante) in San Fernando Cemetery.
https://www.familysearch.org/ark:/61903/3:1:33SQ-GPQM-W4T?i=337&cc=1803… link to marriage record
Information about the Italian project in Mexico in 1882-83:
https://gutierrezcolony.wordpress.com/history/
where the disease which killed 34 of the italians was measles, not cholera like i wrote before. They ended up in San Luis Potosi, Ciudad de Maiz.
Regards
Denise
Joseph Giovanni-Giuseppe SARRO
Joseph SARRO
Giovanni-Giuseppe Sarro
Event Type Immigration
Event Date 27 Feb 1882
Event Place New York, New York, New York, United States
Gender Male
Age 22
Birthplace Italy
Occupation Laborer
Ship Name Caledonia
Birth Year (Estimated) 1860
Departure Port Naples
Literacy Unknown
Destination Place NEW YORK
Transit or Travel Compartment Staying in the USA [Transit]; Steerage [Travel]
Affiliate Manifest ID 00000230
Affiliate ARC Identifier 1746097
Citing this Record
"United States Italians to America Index, 1855-1900," database, FamilySearch(https://familysearch.org/ark:/61903/1:1:KD4T-VF9 : 27 December 2014), Giovanni-Giuseppe Sarro, 27 Feb 1882; citing Italians to America Passenger Data File, 1855-1900, Ship Caledonia, departed from Naples, arrived in New York, New York, New York, United States, NAID identifier 1746097, National Archives at College Park, Maryland.
Saludos,
Rick A. Ricci
Giuseppe Angelo Sarro and Italian colony of San Luis Potosi
Hi Rick
Thanks for the info! However, Sarro was a common name and more than one Guiseppe Sarro came to the US around turn of the century. My great grandfather landed in Veracruz, my grandfather and my mother have told me. We have a walking cane which was his, which he brought with him from Mexico. My mother told me he came with his parents and brother. He died relatively young - my grandfather was in 9th grade.
My grandfather could still speak a few phrases in Italian when I was teenager. I have tried to find out who his grandparents ( my great-great-grandparents) are, and have finally succeed, thanks to the city directories for San Antonio in the late 1800’s - early 1900s. This information linked Guiseppe to Carmen and Emil, to Angelo (his father), and to Louise (his mother)
Below are the sources I have so far, which document Guiseppe Sarro of San Antonio.
Regards,
Denise
Italian name: Guiseppe Angelo Sarro, stated by my grandfather (his son)
Name in San Antonio directories: Jose, Guiseppe, Joseph Sarro (I have looked at directories between 1883 - 1910)
Name in census 9 june 1900: Joe Sarro (see link below)
Burial Record
Name:
Joseph Sarro
Birth Date:
10 May 1861
Death Date:
24 Jan 1924
Cemetery:
San Fernando Cemetery #1
Burial or Cremation Place:
San Antonio, Bexar County, Texas, United States of America
Death of Joe Sarro Sr., 1924 - death certificate
Image 312 of 510
https://www.familysearch.org/ark:/61903/3:1:33S7-9Y14-WC3G?i=311&cc=198…
Citation:
Texas Deaths, 1890-1976," database with images, FamilySearch (https://familysearch.org/ark:/61903/3:1:33S7-9Y14-WC3G?cc=1983324&wc=9T… : 22 July 2014), Death certificates > 1924 > Vol 001, certificates 000001-000500, Jan, Anderson-Brazos counties > image 312 of 510; State Registrar Office, Austin
______________________
Census 1900
https://www.familysearch.org/ark:/61903/3:1:S3HY-DKRQ-3JY?i=24&cc=13252… (wife mistakenly named as Henrietta instead of Genoveva)
_______________________
Marriage 1893 - Jenoveva Roma (Romo)
https://www.familysearch.org/ark:/61903/1:1:QV14-3BRQ
GS Film number 24924
"Texas Marriages, 1837-1973," database, FamilySearch(https://familysearch.org/ark:/61903/1:1:FX36-M21 : 5 December 2014), Joesepi Sarro and Jenoveva Roma, 03 Dec 1893; citing , Bexar, Texas, , reference 2:TM8SVR; FHL microfilm 24,924
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1892- Joseph Sarro and Louise Sarro (wid Anton) living on Cassiano st. near RR track
https://www.ancestry.com/interactive/2469/4792306?backurl=http%3a%2f%2f… I think this Louise is Maria Luisa Greco (Sarro), widow of Angelo (not Anton, unless his name was Antonio Angelo Sarro)
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Marriage 1888 - Antonia Santre
https://www.familysearch.org/ark:/61903/1:1:QV14-QQVG
"Texas, County Marriage Records, 1837-1965," database with images, FamilySearch(https://familysearch.org/ark:/61903/1:1:QV14-QQVG : accessed 11 October 2017), Guiseppe Saŕro and Antonia Santre, 11 Feb 1888, Marriage; citing Bexar, Texas, United States, various county clerk offices, Texas State Library and Archives Commission, Texas Dept. of State Health Services and Golightly-Payne-Coon Co.; FHL microfilm 24923.
GS FILM 24923
IMAGE 58
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San Antonio City Directory:
1887- Carmen, Emil, and Guiseppe Sarro all living at 217 Losoya
https://www.ancestry.com/interactive/2469/4809056?backurl=http%3a%2f%2f…
____________________
1885 - FIRST RECORD OF GUISEPPE SARRO IN SAN ANTONIO - San Antonio City Directory: “JOSE Sarro” - LIVING WITH ANGELO SARRO
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1883 Mention of Angel Sarro and Maria Luisa Greco, parents of Carmen Sarro (brother of Guiseppe)
Marriage of Carmen Sarro and Angela Bolner, Ciudad de maiz, SLP, Mex. 03 May 1883
-he 25, from Naples, “zapatero” son of Angel Sarro and Maria Luisa Greco
-she 20 yrs old, from Trento, Tyrol, Austria, daughter of Antonio Bolner and Maria Teresa
Marguela
-San Luis Potosi, Civil Registration marriages, 1860-1967, ciudad del maiz 1881-1886
-Gs film 722813 image 255 and 261
http://search.ancestry.com/cgi-bin/sse.dll?_phsrc=hEQ611&_phstart=succe…
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Story of the Italian colony in San Luis Potosi:
https://gutierrezcolony.wordpress.com/history/
THe Bolner Family History (Antonio Bolner’s daughter married Carmen Sarro in Ciudad de Maiz)
http://bolnersmeatcompany.com/family-history/
SARRO family
Thank you Denise for sharing your SARRO family information. I too found many Giuseeppe Sarros. There are also many Carmen Sarros, Emil Sarro and Angel Sarros. There are also many Maria Louisa Grecos. These names were extremely popular during this time period which makes it difficult to go back further on these lines. However, all these common names may lead to finding connections between all these similarly named people.
The first person to contact me asking for help in connecting the Romo's from Coahuila and Texas to Aguascalientes passed away a few years ago. There was another person that asked for help that also descended from these families but he has not responded to the only address I have for him. If he ever responds I will let you know.
Thanks again for sharing,
Rick A. Ricci
Emilio Fernandez's Romo links
Dear Bernardo,
I am very interested in the information that you provided that:
" the Somos Primos web site, el Teniente Coronel Palmerin and his wife have published information that proves that Emilio "El Indio" Fernandez was a descendant of Manuel Romo, Rafael Femat´s son"
Please send me a link or the date of the issue in somisprimos so that I can review and investigate the ancestral lines of Emilio Fernandez
Thank you,
Rick A. Ricci
Links to Romo and Femat documents
Armando,
I'm working on getting the links. It is only recently that I started doing so, being content at first to just obtain copy of the documents.
I'll be posting the info as soon as I have it ready.
Saludos,
BERNARDO MENCHACA
Justa or Juana
Denise,
After reading the info matrimonial, it seems that the name of the pretensa was Justa Rafaela, not Juana Rafaela.
Saludos,
BERNARDO MENCHACA
Another marriage for Rafael Femate
Dennise:
Great! what a find!
It would be great to find Manuel's baptism.
It seems Rafael was very unlucky, having burried many wives.
After Rafaela de Aguilar he married Joaquina de Salas (I'm looking for this info) and later Juana Maria Lopez (https://familysearch.org/pal:/MM9.3.1/TH-1-15240-13052-7?cc=1804458&wc=…) and later Maria Urvana Lira.
Best regards,
BERNARDO MENCHACA
Joaquina de salas and Raphael femat siblings
I should have seen the record for joaquina de salas, as i went through the zac zac sag record going back from 1798 to 1789. I did not see her name, but i did hop over about 50 images at the start of one of the films because they were not info matrimonial records ( i checked about every 5th one) when i get back to my regular computer tonight i can write back and tell you the precise range of images.
Raphael Femat/Romo had at least 4 siblings. You will find them if you do a search with Femat, aguascalientes 1760 1790, mothers last name Velasco. The marriages of these siblings are indexed. Raphael got married first so he was probably the oldest. Last marriage was In 1808. Gloria Delgado in a reply to one of your previous posts mention two of these marriages.
The abovementioned search lists a marriage of a femat and a romo de vivar in rincon de romos in 1788. There might be a dispensa for that, i'll be checking that out later.
Regards
Denise
Found christening record for Rafael Femat
At last I found the christening record for the Rafael Romo of Nadadores and San Buenaventura, Coahuila.
His full name was originally Joseph Eucebio Raphael Femat, son of Ignacio Antonio Femat and Victoria Antonia Velasco. He was christened on the 21/Nov/1763 in Asientos (present day Aguascalientes).
The record is here:
Asientos, Bautismos 1750-1774, Image 410
https://familysearch.org/pal:/MM9.3.1/TH-266-11754-185615-77?cc=1502404…
He was the first child of his parents.
The marriage record of Ignacio Antonio Femat and Victoria Antonia Velasco states that he was the son of Antonio Fermin Femat and Monica Romo. This links with the information that Armando was so kind in providing me, with the ancestry of Monica Lorenza Romo de Vivar (daughter of Nicolas Romo de Vivar and Maria de Villalobos)
Thie marriage record of Ignacio Antonio Femat can be found here:
Asientos, Matrimonios, 1729-1791, Image 340
https://familysearch.org/pal:/MM9.3.1/TH-266-11605-18024-53?cc=1502404&…
I also found two other siblings of Raphael Femat:
Maria Rosalia Femat, christened the 18/Nov/1765
Maria Gertrudis Diega Femat, christened the 22/Nov/1767
Saludos,
BERNARDO MENCHACA
Found christening record for Rafael Femat
Hola Bernardo,
The message was not sent out in an email so I am resending it.
Ignacio Antonio Femat and Victoria Antonia Velasco also had a son named
Tiburcio
http://gw.geneanet.org/sanchiz?lang=es;p=tiburcio;n=femat+velasco
Also, I finally looked at the información matrimonial record of Rafael
Femat and Justa Rafaela. The surname of Justa Rafaela is actually del
Aguila which is a surname some of the Tlaxcalteca chieftans used.
Will you provide links to the information that you provided at
http://www.nuestrosranchos.org/node/20592
They might end up helping others.
Saludos,
Armando
Enviado por bmentxaka el Mar, 2013-08-13 01:58.
At last I found the christening record for the Rafael Romo of Nadadores and
San Buenaventura, Coahuila.
His full name was originally Joseph Eucebio Raphael Femat, son of Ignacio
Antonio Femat and Victoria Antonia Velasco. He was christened on the
21/Nov/1763 in Asientos (present day Aguascalientes).
The record is here:
Asientos, Bautismos 1750-1774, Image 410
https://familysearch.org/pal:/MM9.3.1/TH-266-11754-185615-77?cc=1502404…
He was the first child of his parents.
The marriage record of Ignacio Antonio Femat and Victoria Antonia Velasco
states that he was the son of Antonio Fermin Femat and Monica Romo. This
links with the information that Armando was so kind in providing me, with
the ancestry of Monica Lorenza Romo de Vivar (daughter of Nicolas Romo de
Vivar and Maria de Villalobos)
Thie marriage record of Ignacio Antonio Femat can be found here:
Asientos, Matrimonios, 1729-1791, Image 340
https://familysearch.org/pal:/MM9.3.1/TH-266-11605-18024-53?cc=1502404&…
I also found two other siblings of Raphael Femat:
Maria Rosalia Femat, christened the 18/Nov/1765
Maria Gertrudis Diega Femat, christened the 22/Nov/1767
Saludos,
BERNARDO MENCHACA
surname Aguila and Tlaxcala surnames
Very exciting news Armando and Bernardo!
I can hardly wait to get back from work to check out the marriage and baptism links.
Quick question for Armando - where did you get your information about Aguila being a Tlaxcala surname? (i thought the missing "r" in the surname was a mistake - good to get that corrected!) I'd like to read more on this, and add the source to my list for my geneaology. It would explain why coyote was listed as her caste...
Regards
Denise
Aguila surname and El Indio
Indeed, it will be very interesting to explore this Aguila line.
On the other hand, on the Somos Primos web site, el Teniente Coronel Palmerin and his wife have published information that proves that Emilio "El Indio" Fernandez was a descendant of Manuel Romo, Rafael Femat´s son, as Denise had mentioned.
Saludos from Monclovita "La Bella",
BERNARDO MENCHACA
Aguila surname and El Indio
Thanks for the tip! My maternal grandfather had long ago told my mom, who told me, that Emilio was a distant cousin. I'll have to read that article!
Regards
Denise
surname Aguila and Tlaxcala surnames
Denise,
I got the information about the Aguila surname when I purchased and read the book Bautismos, Matrimonios Y Defunciones, En El Primer Siglo De Santa Maria De Los Lagos by Mario Gómez Mata. It talks about Sebastián Hernández del Águila being a Tlaxcaltecan ally of Cortés and that his descendants founded a Republica de Indios in Lagos de Moreno and later Pueblo de Moya.
He is mentioned in the footnotes on pages 48, 56, and 252.
See also the posts at http://www.nuestrosranchos.org/node/20079
I have seen the surname Aguila multiple times in records of Información Matrimonial in Lagos de Moreno and in Aguascalientes. They are always recorded as indios.
You probably already know that a coyote was a child of an indio and a mestiza or a mestizo and an india and the Aguila surname would likley have come from an Indian ancestor, maybe related to the Aguila family of Lagos de Moreno.
See also the following sites -
http://www.inspirateenlagos.com/2012/02/fundacion-del-pueblo-indigena-d…
Notice the author's surname on the following story -
http://www.oem.com.mx/eloccidental/notas/n1531380.htm
By the way, it was very interesting to learn that Emilio Fernández was the model for the Oscar statuette given away at every Academy Awards ceremony.
Saludos,
Armando
Villalpando, el Aguila, Lopez de Nava, Tlaxcala
Hi Armando
This line has gotten interesting. In trying to find out more about the Aguila name I started looking for others with it, plus looking for Justa Rafaela Aguila's parents. (I even made a post wondering if it was an alternative to Avila). Then yesterday I found this:
https://familysearch.org/pal:/MM9.3.1/TH-267-11782-163795-37?cc=1502404…
Its the marriage record for her father's (Don Diego de el Aguila) second marriage with Anna Maria Valdez, where his first wife Rosalia Villalpando is mentioned. Diego's father was named Don Sebastian de el Aguila and his mother Dona Maria Theresa Lopez de Nava. THis fits with other here at NR which I am sure you have seen, an email by Jaime Alvarado, linking the name Aguila (specifically the names Diego and Sebastian)with Tlaxcalans. Maybe the names Diego and Sebastian were passed down into the 1700's in that family, if it's the same family...thats what I will working on in the coming weeks...
Regards, and thanks for your response and links which I will check later today after Work!
Denise
Step by step
Denise,
Another good find!
We are advancing, little by little.
Saludos,
BERNARDO MENCHACA
Zacaecas history
This book gives some insight into life and society in Zacatecas in the Spanish colonial period. Kind of dry reading in some sections, but i like the historical perspective it gives to the names and dates i chase...raphael femat/romo spent some time here, albeit in a later period.
Silver Mining and Society in Colonial Mexico: Zacatecas, 1546-1700 by Peter John Bakewell
Regards
Denise
Joaquina de salas
Hi Bernardo
Yes, exciting! But i could not get beyond Sebastian and Diego, so now i am looking for Joaquina Salas wife #2 of raphael Femat/romo. I want to know why raphael and rafaela called themselves coyote in their info matrimonial. With juana lopez he is espanol and his bapt says espanol. Yet there is no doubt this is the same person, so now i want to see the. Info mat with joaquina...digging through the info mat of zacatecas, sagrario 1782-83. Turns out the records are from 1781 then skip up to 1788 at image 93, but have to keep paging through just in case the 82-83 years are there in later images. Once the year of the info mat is pinned down, it will make it easier to look for manuel romos baptism. It would be good to get that nailed down.
Regards,
Denise
Villalpando, el Aguila, Lopez de Nava, Tlaxcala
Three years later I discover I pasted in the wrong link in my message of 2017-09-17 07:07. .....
Here is the correct link to image of the marriage of Don Diego Xavier de el Aguila and Anna Maria Valdez:
https://www.familysearch.org/ark:/61903/3:1:S3HY-6SGW-94B?i=161&wc=M6QF…
-Denise
Thiburcio Femat and Rosalia Villalpando
Hi
Here is a link to the image of the baptism of Thiburcio Jose Ramon Femat, son of Ygnacio Antonio Femat and Victoria Antonio Velasco
https://familysearch.org/pal:/MM9.3.1/TH-267-12126-164202-86?cc=1502404…
link to the image of death record for Rosalia Villalpando, mother of Justa Rafaela Aguila (first wife of Raphael Femat/Romo:
https://familysearch.org/pal:/MM9.3.1/TH-266-13194-179195-55?cc=1502404…
Regards
Denise
Maria Rafaela Femat sister of Raphael Femat aka Raphael Romo
Hi Bernardo
By chance I found a sibling of Raphael Femat, this is the digital marriage record:
https://www.familysearch.org/ark:/61903/1:1:NX3L-LMG
Maria Raphaela Femat, b. Ojo de Aguas, dau of Ygnacio Femat and Antonia de Velazco
married Jose Luciano Ocampo, son of Jose Maria de Ocampo and Guadalupe de Medina
date: 18 May 1805
Regards
Denise
Maria Rapaela Femat
Denise,
You are right. She married a few months after the death of her father, Ygnacio Antonio Femat. He was buried on the 9/nov/1804 in Asientos.
Regards,
Bernardo