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Por superhorrible |

Hello,
I'm researching the line of Juan Joseph de Llanos y Valdes (married to Juana de Avila). I found some information online that mentions that his parents are Juan de LLanos y Valdes and Maria de Comparan from Michoacan. I located some children from this couple and the couple's marriage in 1642 in Morelia Michoacan.
I also know that there is another Juan Joseph llanos y valdes married to Mariana Ramos and Juana Silva who was living in Jerez around 1680's, But I know that he is not my guy.

Dos anyone have any information regarding Juan Joseph de Llanos y Valdes from Michoacan(?) who was living maybe in Colotlan (married to Juana de Avila)? I need a source to link him to the family of Michoacan.

Any information would be greatly appreciated

saludos

sus leniski

Hello Sus,

The family in Michoacan was formed by Juan (not Juan Jose) de Llanos y Valdes, born in Asturias and secretary to the bishop of Valladolid. He married Maria de Comparan (not "de la Concepcion"), and his three known male children (Juan, Jose and Marcos) were priests who left no descendants. So far no family relationship connects these Llanos y Valdes with captain Juan Jose de LLanos y Valdes who was protector of the frontiers of San Luis de Colotlan, lived in Jerez and left numerous descendants there.

Juan Jose de Llanos y Valdes, the captain, is supposed to have been born in Asturias (in certain information provided by one of his grandchildren, he -or she, I don't recall right now- refers that his/her father (son of captain Juan Jose) was born in Asturias. Therefore I assume that his first marriage to Juana de Silva, or Ávila, took place in Asturias. Certainly, no information on Juana de Avila, or Silva, has been found in the Jerez region. His second marriage, to Marcela Ramos de Arreola, took place in Huejucar in 1685.

Regards,
Hector

.
I can't believe I did not put the source record but I have this:
.
marriage dispensation requested from la sagrada mitra 23 Jan 1833 in Tepetongo, Zac
Jose Roman Carlos single from lo de Salas living in la Estancia, Tep. since childhood age 25
parents: Don Jose Gregorio Carlos deceased and Dona Maria Gertrudis Godin
with Dona Maria Gertrudis Gonsales from Juanchorry now living in Estancia age 19
widow of Don Jose Dario Valdes 4 years buried in Tepetongo
parents: Don Jose Laurencio Gonsales and Dona Maria Ricarda Lespro both living
.
marriage dispensation 4th degree igual
Trunk ..Jose Valdes (Juan Jose Llanos y Valdes and both wives
mother Juana de Avila... mother Marcela Ramos
J. Felipe Valdes.........Ma. Antonia Valdes.. half sisters 1st
J. Bonifacio Valdes......Juan Jose Carlos.. 2nd
Ma. Guadalupe Valdes.....J. Gregorio Carlos.. 3rd
J. Dario Valdes..........J. Roman Carlos.. 4th

Thank you for the info:

very important, does the dispensation says JUANA DE AVILA or JUANA DE SILVA??
I know there are 2 different sets of Juan Joseph de Llanos y Valdes

1. Juan Joseph de Llanos y Valdes, married to Marcela Ramos and Juana de Silva.
Juana de silva's mom is Antonia de Silva. The parents of "this" juan Joseph de llanos y Valdes are Felipe de LLanos y Valdes and Angela de Aguilera. He was born in Madrid

2. Juan Joseph de llanos y Valdes married to Juana de Avila Carlos de Godoy. The parents of Juana de Avila are Thomas de Avila Cabral and Catalina Carlos de Godoy. "This" juan joseph, his parents are Juan Joseph de llanos y Valdes and Maria de Comparan (don't have a source for this information), but likely he was born in Morelia Michoacan

For the longest time I thought there was just one Juan Joseph de Llanos y Valdes living in the Jerez area, because both ,after all, were married to "juana". Now I'm trying to organized both lines.

Thank you so much for the information
saludos desde seattle

sus leniski

.
.
marriage 13 June 1685 in Jerez, Zac
Juan Joseph Llanos y Baldes living in Colotlan Huejucar, Jalisco from Madrid Spain
parents: Phelipe Llanos y Baldes and Dona Angela de Agilera
with Marcela Ramos
mother: Juana Silva
.
death 10 May 1716 in Jerez, Zac
Capitan Juan Joseph Llanos y Valdez Espanol
wife: Marcela Ramos
source: 440986 burials
page 92 Familysearch online
.
marriage dispensation 4th degree igual
Trunk.....Juan Jph Llanos y Valdes
Felipe Valdes.......................Catarina Valdes..1st degree
Ysabel Valdes .....................Salvador de la Torre 2nd
George Felix de Arellano.. Ma. Josefa de la Torre ..3rd
Ma. Antonia Felix de Arellano..Juan Nepomuceno Salinas.4th
.
marriage dispensation 4th degree igual
Trunk ...Juan Joseph Llanos y Valdes
D. Catarina Valdes..................D. Felipe Valdes..1st
D. Salvador de la Torre..........D. Rita Valdes..2nd
D. Ma. Josefa de la Torre......D. Magdalena Miranda..3rd
D. Domingo Vicente Salinas. D. Maria Josefa Carrillo. 4th
.
marriage dispensation 4th degree
Trunk..D. Juan Joseph Valdes and D. Juana de Avila
D. Felipe Valdes...............D. Ynes Valdes...1st degree
D.Rita Valdes....................D. Domingo Acevedo...2nd
D. Ana Maria Ramires....D. Juana Rosalia Acevedo..3rd
D. Fran. Xavier Roman....D. Yldefonsa Felix ..4th degree
.
marriage dispensation 3rd degree igual
Trunk..Juan Joseph Baldes and Juana de Avila
Salvador Baldes.....Felipe Baldes.....1st degree
Antonio Baldes.......Juan Jph Baldes..2nd degree
Fernando Baldes....Antonia Baldes....3rd degree
.
Trunk...Juan Joseph Llanos y Valdes
D. Catarina Valdes..................D. Felipe Valdes..1st
D. Salvador de la Torre...........D. Rita Valdes..2nd degree
D. Ma. Josefa de la Torre.......D. Magdalena Miranda..3rd
D. Domingo Vicente Salinas. D. Maria Josefa Carrillo.4
.
marriage dispensation 4th degree igual
Trunk ..Jose Valdes (Juan Jose Llanos y Valdes and both wives
mother Juana de Avila... mother Marcela Ramons
J. Felipe Valdes................Ma. Antonia Valdes.. half sisters 1st
J. Bonifacio Valdes..........Juan Jose Carlos.. 2nd
Ma. Guadalupe Valdes.....J. Gregorio Carlos.. 3rd
J. Dario Valdes..................J. Roman Carlos.. 4th
.
dispensation 3rd degree in 4th degree
Trunk.. Juan (Llanos) Valdes
Felipe Valdes.................Ynes Valdes.. siblings 1s
Ysabel Valdes................Maria Acevedo.. 2nd
George Felix Arellano…Tomas Albares Ron... 3rd
........................................Ma. Jesus Albares Ron.. 4th

marriage dispensation 3rd degree
Trunk.. Don Juan (Llanos) Valdes
Don Felipe Valdes.......Antonia Valdes.. 1st degree
Dona Ysabel Valdes...Juan Carlos... 2nd degree
Don Rafael Felis..........Don Gregorio Carlos... 3rd degree
Gertrudis Codina.. bride.... widower
.
marriage dispensation 4th degree
Trunk.. Don Juan Valdes and Dona Juana de Avila
Don Felipe Valdes.........Don Salvador Valdes.. 1st degree
Don Ysidro Valdes........Don J. Antonio Valdes.. 2nd degree
Don Ygnacio Valdes.....Don Estevan Valdes.. 3rd degree
Dona Barbara Valdes...Don Fermin Valdes.. 4th degree
.

Hello,
Thank you for all the information.
This is what I have. I have 2 Juan Joseph de LLanos y Valdes living around Jerez.

1. Juan Joseph de LLanos y Valdes (son of Felipe de Llanos y Valdes and Angela de Aguilera) Born in 1652. He married Juana de Silva (dau. of Antonia de Silva) and second marriage with Marcela Ramos. This relationship was explain with the marriage between juan joseph and marcela (the second wife)

2. Juan Joseph de LLanos y Valdes (unknown parents) married to Juana de Avila Carlos de Godoy (dau. of Thomas de Avila and Catalina Carlos de Godoy)

According with the information that I have Juana de Avila and Juana de Silva are not the same person. And now we can eliminate the llanos y valdes family from michoacan with the 3 priest sons (thank you for the info).
I agreed this is quite confusing...

saludos

sus

Please can you give me the source for this dispensa???:

marriage dispensation 4th degree igual
Trunk ..Jose Valdes (Juan Jose Llanos y Valdes and both wives
mother Juana de Avila... mother Marcela Ramons
J. Felipe Valdes................Ma. Antonia Valdes.. half sisters 1st
J. Bonifacio Valdes..........Juan Jose Carlos.. 2nd
Ma. Guadalupe Valdes.....J. Gregorio Carlos.. 3rd
J. Dario Valdes..................J. Roman Carlos.. 4th

Who do you have the parents for Juana de Avila and Juana de Silva??

sus

I just read again that you don't have the source for the dispensa, sorry. I'm going to try to find it. I think maybe something was reported wrong in the dispensa. Don't know.

Who do you have for parents for the 2 Juana's ??

saludos again

sus

Hi,
Here is the link to Erlinda's dispensa from Dario Valdes and gertrudis gonzalez.

https://www.familysearch.org/ark:/61903/3:1:9392-65SD-MR?i=564&cc=18745…

Then I think the answer is, (1 Juan Joseph with 3 wives):
Juan joseph de Llanos y Valdes (son of Felipe de Llanos and Angela de Aguilera)
married:
1. Juana de Silva (dau of antonia de Silva). Unknown children
2. Marcela Ramos (dau Estefania Ramos and unknown father): Children: Juan joseph and Antonia
3. Juana de Avila (dau thomas de avila and catalina Carlos de Godoy) children: catharina, Phelipe, Ynes, Salvador and Antonia

Am I right?? Comments??

thank you again

sus

.
can you share the source for the parents of Juana de Avila? I have not found them. In my file I have Juana de Avila daughter of Tomas and Catalina Carlos de Godoy married to Fernando Llamas. .
.
baptism 18 April 1688 in Jerez, Zac
Salvador Espanol born in Jerez
parents: Fernando de Lamas and Juana de Avila
godparents: Pedro Carlos de Godoy and Dona Juana de la Torre his wife
from Jerez
source: 439844 Film
page 95 Familysearch online
.
Salvador took his maternal grandmothers surname Catalina Carlos de Godoy married to Tomas de Avila who's daughter Juana de Avila married to Fernando Lamas was Salvador's Mother.
.

Hi,
The source is the
6. Mariana de la Cruz Carlos de Godoy. Escritura de la fundacion de la capellania de la Hacienda de la Sauceda. Jerez, Zacatecas. Mexico. 18 oct 1681. (transcripcion). No se ha encontrado el original de este documento, y se desconoce el origen de la transcripcion.

I just have the transcription of the document. I need to search where is the actual document. Here is the section that makes reference to Juana de avila

Dijo a la primera pregunta tener pleno conocimiento del Bachiller don Bartolome de la Torre, como oriundo de esta referida villa, y su sobrino en segundo con cuarto grado de sanguinidad, y así mismo sabe que del legítimo matrimonio que hubieron contraido don Isidro de la Torre, difunto y doña Casilda Salcedo, procrearon entre diversos hijos al dicho Bachiller don Bartolome de la Torre, reconociendole, criandole, alimentandole y educandole como a tal su legítimo hijo, y le consta que el expresado don Isidro de la Torre, es legítimo hijo de don Jacinto de la Torre, Regidor Fiel Ejecutor que fue en esta dicha villa y de doña Catarina Valdés, primeros abuelos de dicho Bachiller. A la segunda responde, que la dicha doña Catalina Valdés fue hija legítima de don Juan José de Llanos y Valdés y de doña Juana de Avila, bisabuelos de dicho Bachiller. Responde a la tercera, que por instrumentos testamentarios, que se hayan en su poder, esta constante, que don Tomás de Avila fue casado con doña Catarina Carlos de Godoy, en donde consta haber sido su legítima hija doña juana de Avila y hermana la dicha Catarina de doña Mariana de la Cruz, que en cuanto a los padres, que se dice haber sido de doña Mariana de la Cruz, y de la dicha su hermana Catarina, no tiene noticia individual, para su certeza plena estan solamente de la dicha Catarina Carlos de Godoy, que lo fueron don Juan Carlos de Godoy y doña María Rosales. Responde a la cuarta, que lo relacionado es publico y notario, y la verdad, y lo que sabe, bajo de su juramento, en que se afirmó, y leido ratifico, diciendo tener de edad 56 años, y aunque le tocan las generales de la ley, como tiene expresado, no falta a la religión del juramento, y lo firmo con su merced, de que doy fe. Bernardo Román. José Tomás Colón de Larreategui. Ante mí Francisco Javier Zesati Notario Público. (foto No. 8)

.
could this be Mariana de la Cruz daughter of Tomas de Avila and second wife Felipa Carrillo?
.

marriage 7 Feb 1714 in Jerez, Zac
Nicolas de Trexo Espanol
parents: Nicolas de Trexo and Antonia Araces? both deceased
with Maria de Abila Espanola from district of Jerez
parents: Thomas de Abila and Phelipa Carillo
godparents: Joseph de Acuna and Michaela Carrillo
witness: Juan Manuel de la Cueba, Clemente de Acuna and Bartolome de Luna
source: 440059 film
page 25 Family search online
.

.
Marriage dispensation recorded 21 April 1680 in Jerez, Zac
Tomas de Avila from Jerez
Parents: hijo natural de Favian Davila and Juana Cabral
Widower of Catolina Carlos
With Felipa Carrillo Espanola from Jerez age 17
Parents: Diego Carrillo and Francisca Orosco
.
Marriage dispensation 3rd in 4th degree
Trunk.. Fernando Gonsales and Maria Sid
Maria Sid…….....…Cathalina Caldera.. sisters 1st degree
Favian Davila.…..Pedro Carrillo…2nd degree
Thomas Davila…...Diego Carrillo….3rd degree
…………………….........Felipa Carrillo.. 4th degree
Source sagrada mitra film 1068604
Page 97 Familysearch online
.
marriage dispensation 3rd degree in 4th degree
Trunk..........Tomas De Avila
Onofre de Avila..............Antonia de Avila..1st degree
Antonio Trinidad de Avila....Maria Carrillo....2nd degree
Jose Lino de Avila...........Tomas de Casas......3rd degree
.............................Maria Tiburcia de Casas 4th degree
source: 1068604 sagrada mitra marriage 1638-1699
page 97 Familysearch online
.
marriage dispensation 4th degree igual
Trunk..Tomas de Avila and Catharina Carlos
Antonia de Avila..........Onofre de Acuna..1st degree
Maria Carrillo............Micaela de Acuna..2nd
Marcelo de Casas..........Christobal de Acuna..3rd
Vicente Ferrer de Casas.. Josefa Acuna..4th
.

.
I also have this:

~
8th Great Grandfather of Chet Castanon
.
marriage dispensation 2nd degree in 3rd degree
Trunk... Juan Carlos and Maria Rosales
Antonio Carlos... Catharina Carlos..1st degree
Juana Rosales....Catharina dabila..2nd degree
Antonia Caldera.............3rd degree
note: it appears Joseph had a relationship with Catharina Dabila a married woman.
source: Sagrada Mitra 168605
.
marriage dispensation 4th degree
Trunk.. Juan Carlos de Godoy and Maria Rosales
Joseph Carlos.............Antonio Carlos..1st degree
Antonio Carlos............ Juana Rosales..2nd degree
Theresa Carlos............Ysabel Sid Calera..3rd degree
Gertrudis Fernandes...Francisco Acuna..4th degree
.
I also have this:

marriage 13 May 1713 in Jerez, Zac
Ygnacio Carlos de Godoi Espanol from district of Jerez
widower of Maria de Miranda Espanola
with Maria Nicolasa de Balensuela Espanola from district of Jerez
parents: Antonio Balensuela deceased and Ysabel de Ledesma
godparents: Francisco de Asevedo and Dona Ynes Llanos y Valdes
witness: Capitan Don Francisco Balensuela, Alcalde Maior Don Pedro Gomes de la Ganseda? Don Ba. Gomes de la Madris and many others
source: 0440059 Jerez marriage
page 9 Family search online
.
marriage dispensation requested Octubre 22 de 1686 in Xerez, Zac
Dispensa de tercero con cuarto grado de consanguinidad -
Ignacio Carlos de Godoy, narural y vecino de esu jurisdicción.
parents: Sebastián Carlos de Godoy y de Doña Agustina de Velasco.
with Maria de Miranda natural y vecina de dicha jurisdiccion
legítima de Juan de Miranda y de Beatriz Rosales, difuntos. Declaración delparentesco:
Que Antonia Rosales y Agustina Rosales, fueron hermanas legítimas, yde la dicha Antonia Rosales, nació Beatriz Rosales, madre de la pretensa, y de la dicha Agustina Rosales, nació María Rosales, madre del dicho Sebastián Carlos de Godoy, padre del pretenso, por lo que Antonia Rosales es abuela de la contrayente y Agustina Rosales es bisabuela del pretenso. 10 fojas.
.

marriage dispensation 3rd degree in 4th degree
Trunk......Agustina Rosales
Maria Rosales................Mateo Rodarte. siblings.1st degree
Catalina Carlos d Godoy......Juan Rodarte...2nd degree
Onofre de Avila..............Margarita Rodarte..3rd degree
Tomas de Avila...............4th degree
Declaración del pretenso:
source: sagrada mitra 167984 film
page 511Familysearch online
.
Trunk Unknown Rosales
Antonia Rosales......Agustina Rosales..sisters 1st degree
Beatris Rosales……....Maria Rosales...2nd degree
Maria Miranda….….....Sebastian Carlos de Godoy..3rd degree
.....................Ygnacio Carlos de Godoy..4th degree
.
.

.
I also have this:

~
8th Great Grandfather of Chet Castanon
.
marriage dispensation 2nd degree in 3rd degree
Trunk... Juan Carlos and Maria Rosales
Antonio Carlos... Catharina Carlos..1st degree
Juana Rosales....Catharina dabila..2nd degree
Antonia Caldera.............3rd degree
note: it appears Joseph had a relationship with Catharina Dabila a married woman.
source: Sagrada Mitra 168605
.
marriage dispensation 4th degree
Trunk.. Juan Carlos de Godoy and Maria Rosales
Joseph Carlos.............Antonio Carlos..1st degree
Antonio Carlos............ Juana Rosales..2nd degree
Theresa Carlos............Ysabel Sid Calera..3rd degree
Gertrudis Fernandes...Francisco Acuna..4th degree
.
I also have this:

marriage 13 May 1713 in Jerez, Zac
Ygnacio Carlos de Godoi Espanol from district of Jerez
widower of Maria de Miranda Espanola
with Maria Nicolasa de Balensuela Espanola from district of Jerez
parents: Antonio Balensuela deceased and Ysabel de Ledesma
godparents: Francisco de Asevedo and Dona Ynes Llanos y Valdes
witness: Capitan Don Francisco Balensuela, Alcalde Maior Don Pedro Gomes de la Ganseda? Don Ba. Gomes de la Madris and many others
source: 0440059 Jerez marriage
page 9 Family search online
.
marriage dispensation requested Octubre 22 de 1686 in Xerez, Zac
Dispensa de tercero con cuarto grado de consanguinidad -
Ignacio Carlos de Godoy, narural y vecino de esu jurisdicción.
parents: Sebastián Carlos de Godoy y de Doña Agustina de Velasco.
with Maria de Miranda natural y vecina de dicha jurisdiccion
legítima de Juan de Miranda y de Beatriz Rosales, difuntos. Declaración delparentesco:
Que Antonia Rosales y Agustina Rosales, fueron hermanas legítimas, yde la dicha Antonia Rosales, nació Beatriz Rosales, madre de la pretensa, y de la dicha Agustina Rosales, nació María Rosales, madre del dicho Sebastián Carlos de Godoy, padre del pretenso, por lo que Antonia Rosales es abuela de la contrayente y Agustina Rosales es bisabuela del pretenso. 10 fojas.
.

marriage dispensation 3rd degree in 4th degree
Trunk......Agustina Rosales
Maria Rosales................Mateo Rodarte. siblings.1st degree
Catalina Carlos d Godoy......Juan Rodarte...2nd degree
Onofre de Avila..............Margarita Rodarte..3rd degree
Tomas de Avila...............4th degree
Declaración del pretenso:
source: sagrada mitra 167984 film
page 511Familysearch online
.
Trunk Unknown Rosales
Antonia Rosales......Agustina Rosales..sisters 1st degree
Beatris Rosales……....Maria Rosales...2nd degree
Maria Miranda….….....Sebastian Carlos de Godoy..3rd degree
.....................Ygnacio Carlos de Godoy..4th degree
.
.

Hi Erlinda,
Here is the link to the whole document. (the transcription is at the bottom, too bad it doesn't include a source for this document)
https://gw.geneanet.org/salvadorcabral?lang=es&n=carlos+de+godoy&oc=0&p…

This Mariana de la cruz has to be another daughter of Juan Carlos de Godoy and Maria Rosales. (sister of Catalina Carlos de Godoy mother of Juana de Avila)

Now regarding Juana de Avila, I was thinking that maybe you are right. Maybe her marriage with Juan Joseph de llanos y valdes was her second marriage (Lamas is death). It was after all HIS third marriage. Maybe something to keep in mind.
What do think??
saludos

sus

Again me Erlinda,
I was looking at the family tree from Salvador Cabral Valdes (link that I sent you)
https://gw.geneanet.org/salvadorcabral?lang=es&n=carlos+de+godoy&oc=0&p…

He has some mistakes, for example writes Juana de Silva y de Avila, now we know that they are 2 different people.
Also he has 3 Juana's (i think she is the same person) . One of them married to Juan Joseph de llanos, another one married to Hernando de Llamas (that you already have). Now my question, the tree has another marriage with Andres Garcia de la Fuente.
Do you have anything about this Andres??
He is news to me, no idea.

saludos

sus

.
I can't believe I did not put the source record but I have this:
.
marriage dispensation requested from la sagrada mitra 23 Jan 1833 in Tepetongo, Zac
Jose Roman Carlos single from lo de Salas living in la Estancia, Tep. since childhood age 25
parents: Don Jose Gregorio Carlos deceased and Dona Maria Gertrudis Godin
with Dona Maria Gertrudis Gonsales from Juanchorry now living in Estancia age 19
widow of Don Jose Dario Valdes 4 years buried in Tepetongo
parents: Don Jose Laurencio Gonsales and Dona Maria Ricarda Lespro both living
.
marriage dispensation 4th degree igual
Trunk ..Jose Valdes (Juan Jose Llanos y Valdes and both wives
mother Juana de Avila... mother Marcela Ramons
J. Felipe Valdes.........Ma. Antonia Valdes.. half sisters 1st
J. Bonifacio Valdes......Juan Jose Carlos.. 2nd
Ma. Guadalupe Valdes.....J. Gregorio Carlos.. 3rd
J. Dario Valdes..................J. Roman Carlos.. 4th

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