Estimados todos:

Un ejemplo que quizá pueda ilustrar la pregunta sobre los apellidos dobles, su permanencia, transferencia o desaparición lo encuentro en el Padrón de Jalostotitlán del año de 1673, 137 años antes del inicio de la Guerra de Independencia.

En el último renglón de la página 7 comienza la lista de los empadronados en la estancia del capitán Francisco Martín del Campo y López de la Cruz, quien era hijo de Lázaro Martín del Campo García (primer Martín del Campo en establecerse en la región de Los Pueblos Llanos que ahora llamamos Los Altos de Jalisco) y de María López de la Cruz (hija del Lic. Juan Bautista Vailly, Vallín o Balli de ascendencia francesa por su abuelo el librero Pierre Balli) María López de la Cruz, como tantos otros por esos tiempos, adoptó los apellidos de su línea materna y no los de su ascendencia paterna, francesa).

Pues bien la lista del padrón mencionado reporta las siguientes personas que enlisto a continuación y que vivían en la estancia del capitán Francisco Martín del Campo. De esta lista quizá sólo Francisco Martín del Campo López de la Cruz, su esposa María de Isasi (o Isassi) y su hijo Francisco Martín del Campo Isasi tenían vínculos de sangre. Los demás eran esclavos o tal vez sirvientes. Sin embargo estas afirmaciones son puramente conjeturales, no he estudiado a fondo esta familia. Pero lo que reporto a continuación puede ilustrarnos mucho sobre la permanencia, transferencia a otras personas (no unidas por vínculo de sangre, como esclavos, sirvientes o ahijados) y la desaparición de apellidos a finales del siglo XVII.

Francisco Martín del Campo (jefe de familia)
Doña María de Isasi (su esposa)
Francisco Martín (quien perdió ya la segunda parte del apellido doble, quizá se trata de un sirviente, no esclavo o del hermano de FMC que llevaba ese nombre)
Francisco Martín del Campo, hijo de FMC y María de Isasi (conserva el apellido doble)
María López (No es María López de la Cruz pues había ya muerto tres años antes).
Josefa del Campo, esclava (La esclava heredó la segunda parte del apellido doble de su amo)
Pascual Martín, esclavo (este esclavo hereda el primer elemento del apellido doble)
Magdalena Isasi, esclava (ahora la esclava hereda el apellido de su ama)
Baltazar de los Reyes, esclavo
Ana Teresa
Juan Gregorio
María del Campo (segundo elemento del apellido doble)
Juan Domingo
Pedro Martín (primer elemento del apellido doble Martín)
María Isasi (apellido de la esposa de FMC)
Andrés Martín (primer elemento del apellido doble)
Pedro del Campo (segundo elemento del apellido doble)
Francisco Martín (primer elemento del apellido doble)
Juan Martín (primer elemento del apellido doble)
Francisco Isasi (apellido de la ama)
María Isasi (apellido de la ama)
(No se menciona en esta lista a Bernabé Martín del Campo Isasi, el otro hijo de FMC y de MI, quien nació 9 años antes pero quien probablemente había ya muerto)

Como vemos, las reglas de transmisión de los apellidos en esa época eran muy diferentes a las que conocemos por nuestra experiencia reciente. Los hijos no necesariamente heredaban los apellidos de sus padres o los heredaban mutilados. Al mismo tiempo se aprecia la transmisión de apellidos o de una parte del apellido doble a los esclavos y sirvientes. Por supuesto que, como muchos de ustedes lo han señalado, hay que tenerlo en cuenta estos hechos en la investigación genealógica.

Un cordial saludo.
Alfonso Reynoso

> From: research-request@lists.nuestrosranchos.org
> Subject: Research Digest, Vol 66, Issue 17
> To: research@lists.nuestrosranchos.org
> Date: Mon, 18 Jul 2011 15:06:49 -0700
>
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> DAILY DIGEST
> ****************************************
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>
> Today's Topics:
>
> 1. Re: Research Digest, Vol 66, Issue 16 (DEEDRA CORONA)
> 2. Some Videos of Hacienda San Mateo of Valparaiso, Zacatecas,
> Mexico (zacatecano020@hotmail.com)
>
>
> ----------------------------------------------------------------------
>
> Message: 1
> Date: Sun, 17 Jul 2011 15:48:27 -0700
> From: DEEDRA CORONA
> To: nuestros ranchos
> Subject: Re: [Nuestros Ranchos] Research Digest, Vol 66, Issue 16
> Message-ID:
> Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1"
>
>
> In response to Topic 1Hello Valente;I had a similar issue when I was using the Cocula Films (The worst are Autlan). I remember seeing some marriages listed in the "Confirmations" and also they are mixed up throughout the marriage films. Good luck!Deedra Corona
> > From: research-request@lists.nuestrosranchos.org
> > Subject: Research Digest, Vol 66, Issue 16
> > To: research@lists.nuestrosranchos.org
> > Date: Sun, 17 Jul 2011 15:06:16 -0700
> >
> > Send Research mailing list submissions to
> > research@lists.nuestrosranchos.org
> >
> > To subscribe or unsubscribe via the World Wide Web, visit
> > http://lists.nuestrosranchos.org/listinfo.cgi/research-nuestrosranchos…
> >
> > or, via email, send a message with subject or body 'help' to
> > research-request@lists.nuestrosranchos.org
> >
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> >
> > When replying, please edit your Subject line so it is more specific
> > than "Re: Contents of Research digest..."
> >
> >
> > Nuestros Ranchos Research Mailing List
> > DAILY DIGEST
> > ****************************************
> >
> >
> > Today's Topics:
> >
> > 1. Marriage between Santiago Barbosa and Lorensa de Aguilar
> > (sanjeronimolosbarbosa@yahoo.com)
> > 2. T?rmino "mulato" y "con voz de espa?ol"
> > (enrique_agraz94@hotmail.com)
> > 3. The Barbosa of Cocula (enrique_agraz94@hotmail.com)
> > 4. Re: Dispensas (Alice Blake)
> > 5. Re: T?rmino "con voz de (alejandrogg@gmail.com)
> > 6. Re: Matrimonio Sanchez de (glorianoemi9@yahoo.com)
> >
> >
> > ----------------------------------------------------------------------
> >
> > Message: 1
> > Date: Sat, 16 Jul 2011 17:09:37 -0700 (PDT)
> > From: sanjeronimolosbarbosa@yahoo.com
> > To: research@lists.nuestrosranchos.org
> > Subject: [Nuestros Ranchos] Marriage between Santiago Barbosa and
> > Lorensa de Aguilar
> > Message-ID:
> >
> >
> > Content-Type: text/plain; charset=UTF-8; format=flowed
> >
> > Hi, I was looking at the Cocula, Jalisco Marriages from 1740-1758, and I can't seem to find the marriage act of my ancestors Santiago Barbosa (stylized as Sntiago.) and Lorensa de Aguilar, who married on February 27, 1757 in Cocula. The records are in bad shape, and some are not clear to read. The records that I was looking at were originally recorded with the month of January (Enero) but the "E" was overwritten by an "F" which looks like "Febrero", and there is March (Marzo) is overwritten with Febrero. If someone could help me find this, I'd be very grateful.
> >
> > Thanks in advance,
> > Valente.
> >
> > This is the link to the indexed record:
> > https://www.familysearch.org/search/recordDetails/show?uri=https://api…
> >
> > And here is the link to the images:
> > https://www.familysearch.org/search/image/show#uri=https%3A//api.family…
> >
> >
> > ------------------------------
> >
> > Message: 2
> > Date: Sat, 16 Jul 2011 19:23:25 -0700 (PDT)
> > From: enrique_agraz94@hotmail.com
> > To: research@lists.nuestrosranchos.org
> > Subject: [Nuestros Ranchos] T?rmino "mulato" y "con voz de espa?ol"
> > Message-ID:
> >
> >
> > Content-Type: text/plain; charset=UTF-8; format=flowed
> >
> > Hola a todos:
> >
> > Muchas gracias por sus comentarios, aprecio su opini?n acerca del tema. En el caso de mulato, como dicen algunos de ustedes, la manera de clasificar a la poblaci?n en castas no era muy precisa, por lo que cuando ya pasaban m?s de 2 generaciones de mestizaje, sol?an basarse mas bien en el f?sico de la persona que en el de su verdadero origen.
> > Mi ascendencia mulata me viene por mi tatarabuela Mar?a del Rosario Aranda, a?n siendo una se?ora de tez blanca y ojos claros, gracias al estudio geneal?gico pude darme cuenta de sus origenes raciales. Una de sus bisabuelas Mar?a Antonia Benita Villegas Rodr?guez, est? asentada como espa?ola en su acta de bautismo.Si bien, por la rama paterna desciende completamente de espa?oles, pero su madre Juana Mar?a Sixta Rodr?guez Ruelas, est? como asentada como mestiza, en su acta de matrimonio. Pero resulta ser que cuando se casan los padres de Juana Mar?a, su pap? est? asentado como coyote y su mam? como tresalva. Los abuelos paternos cuando se casan, uno viene asentado como mulato libre y la abuela como loba. Los abuelos maternos Jos? Mar?a Ruelas Garc?a, viene asentado como mestizo, pero en realidad ser?a el perfecto mulato ya que su pap? Domingo Ruelas Arreola, era espa?ol y su mam? Juana Mar?a Garc?a Gonz?lez, era una mulata libre.
> > ?Alguien de ustedes sabe como se ganaba la condici?n de ser libre para un mulato?
> >
> > Por lo de "voz de espa?ol", concuerdo con la idea que debi? haber sido que la gente criolla o espa?ola debi? haber tenido en aquel tiempo a?n la pronunciaci?n de la pen?nsula ib?rica, pero en el caso en que se inclu?a ese t?rmino en una acta eclesi?stica era quiz? por el hecho de que tal persona "parec?a" o ten?a apariencia de espa?ol pero no hab?a manera de comprobarlo.
> >
> > Saludos
> > Enrique Salvador Agraz.
> >
> >
> > ------------------------------
> >
> > Message: 3
> > Date: Sat, 16 Jul 2011 19:43:58 -0700 (PDT)
> > From: enrique_agraz94@hotmail.com
> > To: research@lists.nuestrosranchos.org
> > Subject: [Nuestros Ranchos] The Barbosa of Cocula
> > Message-ID:
> >
> >
> > Content-Type: text/plain; charset=UTF-8; format=flowed
> >
> > Hi Valente:
> >
> > I also descend from the Barbosa family of Cocula. I don't know if all Barbosa of Cocula were relatives but my farthest ancestors I've found is Clemente Barbosa, married with Br?gida N??ez, they might have married before May 1743, when the oldest child that I've found from them was baptized in Cocula. I searched in a good range of years before that date, the information of their marriage, but I couldn't find it. I have the custom of writing down possible relatives with the same family name registered in the same church but I don't have your ancestors' names in my notes but continue searching, maybe I missed that couple marriage or possibly they were married after the date I began my search that was May 1743.
> >
> > Regards
> > Salvador Agraz
> >
> >
> > ------------------------------
> >
> > Message: 4
> > Date: Sat, 16 Jul 2011 21:12:26 -0700 (PDT)
> > From: Alice Blake
> > To: research@nuestrosranchos.org
> > Subject: Re: [Nuestros Ranchos] Dispensas
> > Message-ID:
> > <1310875946.48855.YahooMailClassic@web180601.mail.sp1.yahoo.com>
> > Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1
> >
> > Armando,? Thanks so much for the explanation.? I can see where knowing what cities and towns were under Guadalajara's?diocese at different points in time makes all the difference in the usefulness of this resource.
> > Unless I missed it.? I didn't see a map illustrating the geographical area the diocese emcompassed?throughout its history.??I thought that one point?even Monterrey, NL was under the Guadalajara diocese, but I could be wrong.? Again thank you for your help.?? Alice?
> >
> > --- On Thu, 7/14/11, Armando wrote:
> >
> >
> > From: Armando
> > Subject: Re: [Nuestros Ranchos] Dispensas
> > To: research@nuestrosranchos.org
> > Date: Thursday, July 14, 2011, 3:17 PM
> >
> >
> > Alice,
> >
> > Capellan?as are the payments people would make so masses would be said for
> > them after their death to ensure the salvation of their soul. Wikipedia has
> > a good explanation in Spanish at
> > http://es.wikipedia.org/wiki/Capellan%C3%ADa
> > Ordenes is the investigation of a person to see if they are worthy of
> > becoming a priest.
> > A chronological history of the breakdown of the Guadalajara diocese can be
> > found at http://www.gcatholic.com/dioceses/diocese/guad0.htm and at
> > http://www.catholic-hierarchy.org/diocese/dguad.html#former I never thought
> > I would find this info.
> >
> > For some reason the earlier link for the Di?cesis de Guadalajara link had
> > added on a word from another sentence. Here it is again for everyone else
> > https://www.familysearch.org/search/image/show#uri=https%3A//api.family…
> >
> > Armando
> >
> > On Wed, Jul 13, 2011 at 11:35 PM, Alice Blake wrote:
> >
> > > Wow Armando.? This is all new information for me.? I went to the Diocesis
> > > of Guadalajara and saw the categories of capellanias (dictionary translation
> > > says chaplain), matrimonios, and ordenes.? Not sure what capellanias refer
> > > to in this context because I never got an image to open, and does ordenes
> > > refer to holy orders or ordination?
> > > Where can I access a chronological history of the breakdown of the
> > > Guadalajara diocesis?? In other words, when other diocesis were carved out
> > > of there.? That would be really useful.? Thanks so much.???Alice
> > >
> > > --- On Thu, 7/14/11, Armando wrote:
> > >
> > >
> > > From: Armando
> > > Subject: Re: [Nuestros Ranchos] Dispensas
> > > To: research@nuestrosranchos.org
> > > Date: Thursday, July 14, 2011, 1:54 AM
> > >
> > >
> > > Alice, the informaci?n matrimonial normally would only mention that there
> > > was a dispensa, with some exceptions. The dispensas are very valuable
> > > because a majority of the time they contain genealogical info past the
> > > parents unlike the matrimonios and the informaci?n matrimonial. A majority
> > > of the dispensas are located in the matrimonio records from Guadalajara
> > > under Di?cesis de Guadalajara because the bishop would have to give the
> > > permission and the bishop for the majority of our area was located in
> > > Guadalajara.
> > >
> > > https://www.familysearch.org/search/image/show#uri=https%3A//api.family…
> > >
> >
> >
> > >
> > > There is also a list of dispensas for San Juan de los Lagos. I haven't
> > > reviewed these at all so I don't know what they contain.
> > >
> > > https://www.familysearch.org/search/image/show#uri=https%3A//api.family…
> > >
> > > Armando
> > >
> > > On Wed, Jul 13, 2011 at 4:35 PM, Alice Blake wrote:
> > >
> > > > Thanks Patty.? So if I understand it correctly, if a dispensa was
> > > required
> > > > it would be found within the couple's informacion matrimonial.? So when I
> > > > research the Mexico church records in familysearch and I'm at the place
> > > > and date I need, the parish records listings would not have a separate
> > > > dispensas category, I simply go to the informacion matrimonial, and if a
> > > > dispensa was necessary, I would find it there.? All this time, I thought
> > > > dispensas had to be found in a different, more difficult manner.? Thanks
> > > so
> > > > much,? Alice
> > > >
> > > > --- On Wed, 7/13/11, patty haro wrote:
> > > >
> > > >
> > > > From: patty haro
> > > > Subject: Re: [Nuestros Ranchos] Dispensas
> > > > To: research@nuestrosranchos.org
> > > > Date: Wednesday, July 13, 2011, 9:16 PM
> > > >
> > > >
> > > > Alice, las dispensas were documents made in special cases in order lo
> > > allow
> > > > the forbiden marriages, like if they were cousins or relatives and
> > > normally
> > > > the marriage were not allow, they ask for a dispensa "perdon" and if the
> > > > church allow it (normally with some kind of "limosna").
> > > >
> > > > And the informacion matrimonial is the common info that were require to
> > > the
> > > > groom and bride and their witnesses, it there were any problem, they ask
> > > > for
> > > > the dispensa to the bishop and incluide it in the informacion
> > > matrimonial.
> > > >
> > > > I hope this help you
> > > >
> > > > Las dispensas eran los procesos que se realizaban en casos especiales
> > > > cuando
> > > > los matrimonios estuvieran prohibidos, por ejemplo si eran primos o
> > > > parientes, el matrimonio no era permitido y tenian que solicitar una
> > > > dispensa o perdon al obispo, este normalmente era otorgado con una
> > > limosna
> > > > de por medio.
> > > >
> > > > Las informaciones matrimoniales era la informacion que comunmente se
> > > > solicitaba a los contrayentes y a sus testigos, en caso de haber algunn
> > > > impedimento, y habia que solicitar una dispensa, esta, se anexaba a la
> > > info
> > > > matrimonial, o cuando menos la carta otorgando el permiso.
> > > >
> > > >
> > > >
> > > >
> > > > On Wed, Jul 13, 2011 at 3:50 PM, Alice Blake wrote:
> > > >
> > > > > Since I'm relatively new at genealogy, I'm willing to take the risk of
> > > > > sounding totally ignorant...Are dispensas the same as informacion
> > > > > matrimonial?? With the group's help, the knowledge I gain will be
> > > totally
> > > > > worth it.? Thanks so much.
> > > > > Alice
> > > > > -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- --
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> >
> > ------------------------------
> >
> > Message: 5
> > Date: Sun, 17 Jul 2011 12:02:15 -0700 (PDT)
> > From: alejandrogg@gmail.com
> > To: research@lists.nuestrosranchos.org
> > Subject: Re: [Nuestros Ranchos] T?rmino "con voz de
> > Message-ID:
> >
> >
> > Content-Type: text/plain; charset=UTF-8; format=flowed
> >
> > Qu? tal,
> >
> > La condici?n de la madre era heredada por sus hijos; es decir, si una mulata esclava procreaba un hijo, aunque fuera con un espa?ol, ?ste ser?a esclavo del mismo amo de la madre, ya que ella era considerada su "propiedad". Incluso, para el matrimonio necesitaba de la autorizaci?n del amo.
> >
> > La ?nica forma de conseguir la libertad era por la voluntad del amo; encontrar?s en testamentos de la ?poca que muchas personas inclu?an en su ?ltima voluntad, otorgarle la libertad a alg?n esclavo que estuvo en su servicio por mucho tiempo, o al cual tienen alg?n tipo de aprecio. La libertad de la madre no daba la libertad a los hijos, cuando ?stos tambi?n nacieron esclavos; era necesario otorgarla por cada uno.
> >
> > Saludos!
> > Alejandro
> >
> >
> > ------------------------------
> >
> > Message: 6
> > Date: Sun, 17 Jul 2011 12:04:21 -0700 (PDT)
> > From: glorianoemi9@yahoo.com
> > To: research@lists.nuestrosranchos.org
> > Subject: Re: [Nuestros Ranchos] Matrimonio Sanchez de
> > Message-ID:
> >
> >
> > Content-Type: text/plain; charset=UTF-8; format=flowed
> >
> > Gloria Casillas
> > aaah,Maria Cortez,entonces es casi probable que seamos parientes lejanas, aun busco el matrimonio de Santiago de Porras y Michaela Martin del Campo, con la pista que me dio Armando, pero en las dispensas es mas dificil la busqueda, porque la letra esta muy fea, pero espero poco a poco dar con ellos. Pero es casi seguro que descienden de esta linea =)
> >
> >
> > ------------------------------
> >
> > -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- --
> > Nuestros Ranchos Research Mailing List
> >
> > To post, send email to:
> > research(at)nuestrosranchos.org
> >
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> >
> >
> >
> > End of Research Digest, Vol 66, Issue 16
> > ****************************************
>
>
> ------------------------------
>
> Message: 2
> Date: Sun, 17 Jul 2011 16:14:19 -0700 (PDT)
> From: zacatecano020@hotmail.com
> To: research@lists.nuestrosranchos.org
> Subject: [Nuestros Ranchos] Some Videos of Hacienda San Mateo of
> Valparaiso, Zacatecas, Mexico
> Message-ID:
>
>
> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=UTF-8; format=flowed
>
> I fell in love with our colonial past of our area. And I want to post videos of Hacienda San Mateo of Valparaiso, Zacatecas, Mexico.
>
> http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=isbEs8cZBrE&feature=related
> http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=uh_B6TzHZJQ&feature=related
> http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=oeaRSe0Z5zM&feature=related
>
> I want to note that when I was browsing through archives as far back as 1621 of Huejuquilla and saw many references towards Valparaiso. Valparaiso was spelled with a "B" back then as Balparaiso." How did it change to a "V" Valparaiso?
>
> Some parts of the Hacienda are in ruins, but I would like to see a Restoration project to restore La Hacienda San Mateo to the way it was back in the days of El Conde.
>
> That would attract tourists.
>
>
>
>
> ------------------------------
>