Nuestros Ranchos Site

Carlos Peredo

La pérdida de Don Guillermo ha sido un doloroso golpe para muchos que lo estimamos: por supuesto quienes lo trataron en persona, pero también algunos como yo que solo lo tratamos por vía espistolar y que no obstante eso, no pudimos sino apreciar y valorar sus enormes conocimientos, y agradecer su generosidad al compartir sus hallazgos.

El gusto que me da al enterarme de honores y reconocimientos a Don Guillermo hace más llevadero el pesar por su partida.

Un recuerdo al erudito.....un saludo al amigo.

Javier,

Creo que seamos parientes por el Lopez Portillo, mi tatarabuela era Lorenza Lopez Portillo y Castro nacida en 1883. Interesantemente, encontre un Juan Gonzalez de Hermosillo casandose con una Ignacia Maria de Celis en 6 de abril de 1812 en el Sagrario Metropolitano de Saltillo. Se que no es el estado que te interesa mas siempre es bueno buscar en las regiones alreadores. Recopilar cualquier dato que pueda ayudar. Te sugiero revisar esta acta y ver que encuentras. Como es en el norte, es posible que sea pariente de tu linea. Casi todos nosostros somos descendientes de los Hermosillo, yo lo soy unas 14 veces! Qual era el nombre de la mujer de Juan Bautista Gonzalez de Hermosillo. Es importantisimo que sigues la migracion de esta familia desde los Altos de Jalisco hasta Sinaloa. He vista tantas familias radicar en otras regiones en toda la republica. Amo el estudio genealogico y suma importancia en perservacion de la historia.

Daniel Méndez de Torres Camino

Jose,

According to Lyman Platt's book, census records for Latin America, he shows
that there are several rolls of film for Aguascalientes' census records.
This appears to imply that the Census records may be mixed in with the
parish Baptismal records, however this doesn't define the parishes in
Aguascalientes where the records may be found, only the years.

- Year 1649 - Reference is Archivo del Parral
- Year 1770 - Bpt Manuscript 1770
- Year 1792 - AGN PAD 5:1520345:2
- Year 1760 - ?
- Year 1770 - BPT Manuscript 45
- Year 1780 - BPT Manuscript 45
- Year 1803 - TRI 43

Alicia,

San Jose, Ca

On Sun, Feb 16, 2014 at 12:22 PM, wrote:

> Does anyone have suggestions for finding census records of Indios living
> on the Hacienda de Garabato and Hacienda de Parades in Aguascalientes in
> the 1700s? Do such records exist?
>
> Jose Aguayo Ortega
> joseaguayo601@gmail.com -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- --
> Nuestros Ranchos Research Mailing List
>
> To post, send email to:
> research(at)nuestrosranchos.org
>
> To change your subscription, log on to:
> http://www.nuestrosranchos.org
>

I don't have any idea about what you can legally do with the images on this roll of microfilm, but thanks for the heads-up! This is one of the rolls that I recently ordered for indefinite loan to an LDS Family History Center in Denver. I haven't yet had a chance to look at the film but will do so soon, now armed with your alert about the images following a blank spot on the film. Muchas gracias.

Thank you for sharing this discovery. I'm sure it will help us who do serious Aguascalientes research in the future. As a independent scholar, historian and researcher on the side, you should publish it. Present it as your own contribution to the field of study and also a genealogical society, maybe Nueva Galicia Genealogical Society. I have so much to publish, I have to get around it.

Daniel Méndez de Torres Camino

Stuart

One option would be to create an extracted list of those images with at least date, child, parents. If someone had more time, they could add the location of the birth.

The list could be posted here are NR. I'm some of our colleagues here would appreciate it.

George Fulton
Pleasanton, CA

Can you upload the file to the NR site? Look in the files tab for instructions.

Victor M Gomez

QUE MALO QUE DE UN DIA A OTRO SE PIERDAN LOS ENLACES, LO BUENO QUE YO ANOTABA NUMERO DE IMAGEN, YA FUERA MATRIMONIO, DEFUNCION, BAUTIZO O DISPENSA, ASI COMO NUMERO DE ROLLO Y EN ALGUNOS CAZOS NUMERO DE FOJA Y ACTA, ESTO DESDE QUE YA NO SE PUDO GUARDAR LAS IMAGENES.

I think what you are seeing is a manifestation of what the real citation is for the reference.

As an example, the marriage of Jose Maria Rivera and Maria Trinidad Puga on Jan. 30, 1863, at San Antonio de Padua, Cuale: Family Search gives the citation as

"México, Jalisco, registros parroquiales, 1590-1979," images, FamilySearch (https://familysearch.org/pal:/MM9.3.1/TH-1-18568-39968-25?cc=1874591&wc… : accessed 29 Mar 2014), Cuale > San Antonio Padua > Matrimonios 1826-1912 > image 164 of 437.

This citation is actually composed of two parts:

(1) Where the record is located on the digitized film ... "México, Jalisco, registros parroquiales, 1590-1979," Cuale > San Antonio Padua > Matrimonios 1826-1912 > image 164 of 437.
(2) Where the image was located on the day it was accessed ... FamilySearch (https://familysearch.org/pal:/MM9.3.1/TH-1-18568-39968-25?cc=1874591&wc… : accessed 29 Mar 2014)

What is lacking is the film number.

However, I think a better citation is "San Antonio de Padua, Cuale, Jalisco, Mexico, Matrimonios, Libro 2, folio 64 (verso)." What I have looked at, however, is a digitized copy on FHL film 1156209, which presently resides at the url noted above.

A couple of years ago I created an index of Aguascalientes matrimonial investigations, amounting to a few hundred pages (and posted here at NR), I recorded the image numbers and used the film identification from Family Search. The films were reposted at some point, and all the image numbers are now off by a small number.

What is posted on the internet is not permanent: how often have you tried to follow a link and it is broken?

Ultimately, we need to record enough of the right information to be able to find the record again.

George Fulton
Pleasanton, CA

Ruben Rojas

This happened to me also a while back, hours of research lost. I was not able to use old URL's again. So I started saving the actual image to my computer and cropping it, I also use this image as the ancestor picture on my ancestry.com tree for reference and back up.I know how you feel about loosing hours of research.
Good Luck

Hello,
I had the same problem. Frustrating indeed! However if you delete everything past the "?" on the URLs, then you'll arrive to the original page you had bookmarked. You may have to update all your bookmarks, but at least you won't have to hunt them down all over again. Not sure why they did that, but it makes you wonder if we should be saving the actual documents and not just the links to the documents?
Juan

Very interesting!

It does say his father was "indio cacique" and so was his mother, so it is very possible that they were part of the Indian ruling class of Tonala.

Sergio Salés

Ruben

Worldcat (www.worldcat.org) lists three books by Mario Gomez Mata:

Apuntes históricos de Teocaltitán de Guadalupe, Jalisco
Bautismos, matrimonios y defunciones, en la primer siglo de Santa Maria de Los Lagos
Esclavitud en Lagos y los afrolaguenses, s. XVI-XIX

By entering your location, Worldcat will name the libraries near you that have these books.

George Fulton
Pleasanton, CA

Estimado Armando,

Quisiera saber tu opinión a cuanto la genealogía sobre los Hermosillo. He escuchado varias versiones de su genealogía. Tengo lo siguiente.

González de Hermosillo tiene su nobleza por línea agnada probada donde se encuentra asentados como hijosdalgos en los padrones de Hermosilla. Son hijosdalgo por sangre y linaje.

· Pedro Fernández de Hermosilla
· Alonso de Hermosilla casó a Catalina González hija de Tomás González
· Juan González de Hermosillo c Catalina Ramírez
· Juan González de Hermosillo c Isabel de Escobar hija del Conq. Juan de Burgos
· Juan González de Hermosillo b. 8 de Julio de 1571 en Asunción, Cd. De Méx. Casó a María Muñoz Cabeza de Vaca hija de Francisco Muñoz y de aquí nació la línea alteña.

Déjame saber si hay algún error.

Daniel

You might want to look in the 1930 Censo de Mexico in those Towns where
your ancestors are from to try to find your grandparents and siblings with
your GGrandparents. The Censo will tell you the ages of all the family
members so you can narrow down your search in finding marriage, birth,
christening, death records, etc... You might even get lucky and find your
GGGrandparents living in the same household or within the same town with
another family member
On Sep 20, 2013 12:25 AM, wrote:

> My name is Joe Lucio and i have been researching my father history for
> many months now. i have pin pointed the area of Michoacanejo, Tepusco,
> teochaltiche, villa hildago, los pocitos as well as rancho santo, Los
> Garcia. my great grandfathers are Florencio Lucio & Feliciano Reyes my
> great grandmothers M. Santos Calvillo & Clara Calvillo i am assuming their
> births were around the mid 1800's my grandparents are Felipe Lucio & Maria
> Jesus Reyes births cold be Late 1800's My Father is Victoriano Lucio Reyes
> born in los pocitos 1921 also have uncles Irineo 1917 Luis 1913 Sanots 1923
> antonio 1910 silverio unknown and aunt lucia unknown.
>
> I'd appreciate any and all feed back you may have encountered in your
> journey's of researching family history i have been focusing more on my
> great grandparents and grandparent for siblings, birth location, location
> lived in ect.....
>
> I thank you all for taking the time to read my intro to Nuestros Ranchos
> and i look forward in hearing from you.
>

Hi and welcome!

I have some Lucios in my family, but from Tepetongo. This is all I really have:

Manuel Lucio
b. abt 1804 Tepetongo, Zac.
m. Maria de Jesus Jaramillo

daughter: Maria de San Pablo Lucio
b. abt 1834
m. Prudencio Salinas
m. Jose Fabian Sebastian Sanchez

Laura Gonzalez

Much of this insight was given by Primo Arturo Ramos, our Nuestros Ranchos moderator. At a Nueva Galicia Genealogical Society Conference about 3 years in San Jose, Ca, he spoke on:

Matrilineal Naming Practices:
why and how family surnames were used.

There will be some or all of the family children who will use only the mother's surname. This is a common practice when the mother's pedigree comes from a wealthy or influential family. There are also some instances where a child's different surname is chosen from another generation. i.e. a grandfather or grandmother of either the father's or mother's pedigree. It was customary to name some of their children after their grandparents; except that they also included their grandparent’s surnames.

So one family's children's surnames could be 2, 3, or more different surnames. And then those children's grandchildren could revert back to their original surname.

Thanks, Arturo! 　

Jose Carlos de Leon

I can't say if it is accurate or not. Almost all genealogists have made mistakes, not necessarily the one that made the page you are talking about. His name is Salvador Cabral and he used to post here also. He has placed the genealogy on many websites including my favorite - www.geneanet.org

The geneanet page he created on Pedro Caldera and his indian wife is at http://gw5.geneanet.org/salvadorcabral?lang=es;p=pedro;n=caldera+de+vel…

In the pages on the Calderas he cites books by Thomas Hillerkuss as his source of info the following is also found "Otra de estas ventas la efectuó el capitán Miguel Caldera a don Diego de los Ríos Proaño el 31 de agosto de 1586 de las tierras que habí a entre Trujillo y el puesto de Momax, desde Huejuquilla a la Cienega Grande y desde el Tesorero a Tlaltenango, comprendiéndose el sitio d el Llano , Estancia Vieja o Coyotes, dos sitios arriba de la Cienega , otro al pie de la Sierra de Jomulco , Los Charcos; otro en el ataj o que del Fuerte va a Atitanac: Huejuquilla, Juanes, bajo del pueblo de Susticacán, esta venta la ejecuto como heredo de Pedro Caldera y a nombre de Hernán González y de su hermana María Cid Caldera, mujer del dicho Hernán. El capitán Caldera también vendió los hierros de herrar, con su respectiva concesión y titulo dado a principios de 1536 en la ciudad de Guadalajara, en efigie de dos ese en viceversa apuntala das, es decir punto al final. El registro de este hierro tuvo un costo de 6 pesos."

In Mexico there is no such thing as a maiden name. A woman's surname doesn't change with marriage and especially not before the 20th century.

In old Mexico and in old Spain a person with a different surname than a sibling doesn't mean that they aren't full siblings. One could be using a surname of a maternal grandmother or great grandmother. Therefore, Pedro Caldera and Maria Cid having a different surname has no significance whatsoever until more evidence can be found.

edit: In this case it could, or could not be, a maternal grandmother or great grandmother of Pedro Caldera.

Armando

too bad most of the 1500 and 1600 ones available there aren't from the regions my ancestors were from.

Un momento de silencio con el público de pie en memoria de Guillermo Tovar de Teresa (1956-2013) precedió ayer el concierto de Sor Marie Keyrouz en la Catedral Metropolitana.

La excepcional labor en pro del Centro Histórico que realizó el historiador, coleccionista, bibliófilo y promotor cultural fue recordada por Fernando Estrada.

Christopher Barrios de Leon

Mr. Mendez,

I wanted to bring this wonderful tribute to don Guillermo to your attention.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=sjnVthVXkWk

kind regards,

Nothing new here, but I have cleaned up the burial record of my 10th Grand Uncle for whomever would like to copy:

http://i979.photobucket.com/albums/ae280/PappyRod/deEsparzaLupeRuiz-Bur…

also, here is a copy of Jaime Holcome's record sheet:

http://i979.photobucket.com/albums/ae280/PappyRod/AnaFranciscaGabaydeMo…

Happy New Year to all,
Roy

Page 384, Catalogo de Pasajeros a Indias Durante los siglos XVI, XVII y XVIII. Archivo General de Indias Sevilla. Murcia, Spain: Ministerio de Cultura. 1986. Vol. 7 (1586-1599). 998p.
This is a document that names Lope's parents.
I found the document online, but I do not remember where. There is a copy of the document on my Ancestry.com tree (Ruiz de Esparza Family Tree, owner: ScottStockwell62) among the images for Lope Ruiz de Esparza (Arrival).
Or send a message to me at musettafan@yahoo.com and I will email the image to you.
-Scott Stockwell

considering some of the names you mentioned, we might be related

Ruben, where is the older post you found? I would like to read it too. There are helpful guides for deciphering texts, but I cannot find one that addresses symbols in the margin.

I found a marriage record with a similar symbol, and am wondering its meaning there. The record is;
https://familysearch.org/pal:/MM9.3.1/TH-1-18453-5545-67?cc=1874591&wc=… : accessed 28 Feb 2014), Mexico, Jalisco, Catholic Church Records, 1590-1979 > Mexico, Jalisco, Catholic Church Records, 1590-1979 > Colotlán > San Luis Obispo > Matrimonios 1720-1752 > image 34 of 508.

It shows the marriage of Diego Pinedo (mulatto) and Chatarina de la Cruz (of Tepuliche). Below that notation in the margin is a symbol like our percent (%) and a cross with circles at each of the four ends, outlined with four curves.

What does that mean?

Eric Freeman