Hi Joseph,

Thanks for the envy.  The frustrating thing for me is that the record which identifies my ancestor as  does not allow me to search much further.  As you know indigenous people needed permission from a european to legally use a surname.  I found this information in film #1156614, Bautismos de Senecú in the Juarez Cathedral Archives.  I quickly looked into my copies of the microfilms and found two individuals, 4 Oct. 1793 and 11 Nov. 1793, described in the body of the text as  and  respectively.  Also there's another entry describing a family as .  Senecú was a very diverse pueblo.  Most of the entries in this film simply use the word  but there are other designations including .  I may buy the whole film some day.  It seems that dozens of people in Senecú are related to my ancestors.  The same film also includes entries from the mission at San Lorenzo del Real.  Both communities were about 9

Hi Kitty Cortez

ANA has same information of Pedro Sandoval and Juana
Cortez.

1. Her Cortez Line: YGNACIO CORTES Y MARIA TERESA DE
AVILA
 2. Ygnacio Rafael Cortes m. Petronila Magallanas, 
3.Matias Cortes m. Maria Reducindo Arellano b. 05 MAR
1802, 4. Antonio Cortes spouse Decideria Sandoval
{parents Felix Sandoval and Francisca Sandoval}, 5.
Casimira De Jesus Cortes b. 09 MAR 1846  m. Trinidad
Cortes date: 20 JUN 1866 {his parents were #4 above.}
>From Trinidad and Casimira: Epifania Cortes Cortes 
m.1911 had son Jose Refugio Arellano 19 MAR 1912 who
married Teresa Luna Lamas.

The luna Line; Bonifacio b 1877 spouse Romalda Lamas:
Cruz de Luna b. 19 JUL 1840 m. 23 APR 1863 to Pilar
Sandoval b. 11 OCT 1839{parents: Jose Filomeno
Sandoval and spouse Ana Huizar}: Yldefonso de Luna and
his Estefana Gonzales: Victor de Luna 06 MAR 1776:
etc, etc....to Bartolome De Luna 1620 his spouse
Lorenza De Haro b. 17 OCT 1630

jose munoz

--- Kitty Cortez  wrote:

> Jose Munoz,  
>

David P. Delgado wrote:

I have two Chiricahua grandmothers and a Piro ggggGrandfather.

The identity of the tribes. . .you are so so so blessed in your finding
of these treasured pieces of information. I think I'd trade 6 months
worth of research time to find information like that. How did you find
that info? Was it written right in the record? My records just use the
generic Yndio. I also have roots in El Paso and I've seen some tribes
mentioned by name in the records but not in mine.

thanks for sharing and if you think I'm thinking of you enviously. . .
.well yes I am. I'm happy for you, but yes I want to be happy for me too!

joseph

Hello and Welcome Jose,

I know exactly how you feel.  I too was born and
raised in the US and have found that while I am here
in the US many people ask me where I am from and I say
I am from the US.  They do not accept that response,
when I say that I am Mexican they say, "OH, Yes. I see
it in you."
Now when I am in Mexico I am confronted with the same
from Mexican citizens.  They ask me where I am from
and do not accept my response that I am from
Zacatecas.  They tell me that I speak with an accent
and that I am not from Mexico.  I tell them that I was
born in the US and they say, "Si, claro, eres
Chicana."
I guess I can say like La India Maria, NO soy ni de
aqui ni de alla. Then i like to quote Selena
Quintanilla's father, Abraham, when he told her that
"When we are in the US we (Mexican-Americans) have to
be more American than the Americans to be accepted and
when we are in Mexico, we need to be more Mexican than
the Mexicans."

I don't know where I was going with that.
I do want

>> "Mexican
>>genealogy is like a
>>big bowl of tamales, you never know what you're
>>gonna get".  You may
>>pull out a pork tamale, or beef, or cheese, beans,
>>coconut, sugar and
>>raisins.....
>>
Raisin Tamales. . .I thought my mom was the only one that made these.

Boy could I eat a dozen by myself right now (but not all Raisin). I
guess I'd have to say that Pork with lots of "gordo" on the meat are my
favorite. but I can't eat Tamales that have been cooked, cooled, frozen
and warmed up [well I guess I could]. I have to have mine fresh cooked.
Boy are they good.

I'd say that Tamales are my favorite food, then again I think I'd rather
have a big bowl of Menudo with lots of chopped onion, some oregano,
cilantro, and lemon juice and a tall pile of flour
tortillas (fresh made).

Can the next person flying to North

"Mexican

genealogy is like a
big bowl of tamales, you never know what you're
gonna get". You may
pull out a pork tamale, or beef, or cheese, beans,
coconut, sugar and
raisins.....

Raisin Tamales. . .I thought my mom was the only one that made these.

Boy could I eat a dozen by myself right now (but not all Raisin). I
guess I'd have to say that Pork with lots of "gordo" on the meat are my
favorite. but I can't eat Tamales that have been cooked, cooled, frozen
and warmed up [well I guess I could]. I have to have mine fresh cooked.
Boy are they good.

I'd say that Tamales are my favorite food, then again I think I'd rather
have a big bowl of Menudo with lots of chopped onion, some oregano,
cilantro, and lemon juice and a tall pile of flour tortillas (fresh made).

Can the next person flying to North Carolina bring me some tamales?

Solito aqui en Carolina del Norte,

joseph

ps: my mom's mom was from Jalisco. That is how this discussion of
Tamales fits in and stays on

This is my dead end with the Avila/Sandoval branch of our family.
HUSBAND: 	 Miguel Avila 	     WIFE: 	 Carmen Sandoval
	: 		 CHILDREN
	1 	| 	Name: 	  Felix De Avila
	 	bir: 	 1804
		| mar: 	 28 Feb. 1824 		Villa Del Refugio, Zacatecas, MEXICO
	 	to: 	   Fabiana Salamanca
		|	Father:       Miguel Avila
    Mother :   	Carmen Sandoval
2 	| 	Name: 	Maria Eufracia  Avila Sandobal
F | 	chrr: 	 20 Mar 1782		Villa Del Refugio,  Zacatecas, MEXICO
3			Name:	Maria Josefa Fermina Avila Sandoval

F chrr 17 Jul 1790 Villa Del
Refugio, Zacatecas

4			Name	Maria Margarita Avila Sandobal

F chrr 28 oct. 1797 Villa Del
Refugio, Zacatecas

5			Name	Jose Casildo Avila Sandobal

M chrr 11 Apr 1803 Villa Del
Refugio, Zacatecas

6	Name:	Maria Luiza Avila Sandobal
F	chrr:	01 Sept 1805                                      Tayahua, Zacatecas

_______________________________________________