Hi everyone, I’m currently in Degollado, Jalisco visiting my parents. I have visited the surrounding ranches where my ancestors lived, la chancla, el sombrerillo, la Tinajera, barbechitos, el saucito, el lindero y la campana. Went and had dinner in Ayotlan and Huascato. I will also be visiting Jesús Maria. This time of year is green and beautiful out here.
Esther
Hola prim@s,
Many of us have ancestors from Jalisco that came from Cotija, Michoacan, and since there are no records of the parish available other than a few dispensas, I wanted to share these 2 census records that I found:
They were very, very useful in my research...
1759
https://www.familysearch.org/ark:/61903/3:1:939L-67ZN-9?i=89&cc=1883388
1768
https://www.familysearch.org/ark:/61903/3:2:77TX-BNW8?i=1258&cc=1883388
I have transcribed both padrones into spreadsheets, if anyone is interested in such, I will be very happy to share that as well.
Happy day to all! :)
I am having an audiobook produced, dedicated to my great-grandmother,
Hipolita Orendain de Medina. I need to know the correct Spanish
pronunciation of "Orendain." I've gone to a variety of resources online,
but they don't all agree. I have no contact with any living relatives in
Mexico. Is the "dain" part of the name pronounced similar to the English
"dain" (long a sound), "dine" (long i sound) or "dean/deen" (long e sound)
? And where should the accent mark fall?
I truly would appreciate your assistance.
Thank you,
Laurel Anne Hill
I would go for a long i ( your second choice), but then that's how we (mexicans) pronounce it now, heavens knows how they did it back then.
Abraham de Alba
Enviado desde Yahoo Mail para Android
El miér., 2 de oct. de 2019 a la(s) 15:47, research-request@lists.nuestrosranchos.org escribió: Send Research mailing list submissions to
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Today's Topics:
1. Need help with correct pronunciation of family name Orendain
(Laurel Anne Hill)
2. Two Diego de Alcocer (pavendano@earthlink.net)
3. Guadalajara Entierros (pavendano@earthlink.net)
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Message: 1
Date: Tue, 1 Oct 2019 14:46:38 -0700
From: Laurel Anne Hill
To: research@lists.nuestrosranchos.org
Subject: [Nuestros Ranchos] Need help with correct pronunciation of
family name Orendain
Message-ID:
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="UTF-8"
I am having an audiobook produced, dedicated to my great-grandmother,
Hipolita Orendain de Medina. I need to know the correct Spanish
pronunciation of "Orendain." I've gone to a variety of resources online,
but they don't all agree. I have no contact with any living relatives in
Mexico. Is the "dain" part of the name pronounced similar to the English
"dain" (long a sound), "dine" (long i sound) or "dean/deen" (long e sound)
? And where should the accent mark fall?
I truly would appreciate your assistance.
Thank you,
Laurel Anne Hill
------------------------------
Message: 2
Date: Tue, 1 Oct 2019 18:39:12 -0700 (PDT)
From: pavendano@earthlink.net
To: research@lists.nuestrosranchos.org
Subject: [Nuestros Ranchos] Two Diego de Alcocer
Message-ID:
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=UTF-8; format=flowed; delsp=yes
Hi Rick, I see ?hermano?. I am however a novice in reading old
manuscript. I?ve asked a few people including historians and credible
genealogists and they concur. Maybe others can weigh in? I see: ?QUE EL
DOCTOR JUAN D?AZ DE ALCOCER DEL NUESTRO CONSEJO VUESTRO HERMANO... ? In
this immediate family there are many Diego?s and a few Pedro?s so I?m
not surprised that people easily get them confused and much of my research is
in secondary resources since Not everything is online and I?m in
California. According to Los Conversos y la Inquisicion Sevillana by Juan Gil
v. 3, page 206-211. Dr. Juan Diaz de Alcocer was the Brother of Diego Alcocer
(married to Blanca). Other brothers include 1. Fernando married to Gracia de
Prado ( I think the Prado Madrid fam) 2. Pedro Gonzalez de Alcocer
Coincidently, in vol. 5 p. 394 of this book series it lists Pedro de Toledo
married to Beatriz Fernandez, parents of Blanca Nunez is listed in reference
to Beatriz testamento in 1508 where she requests to be buried in San
Bartolom? ( juder?a Sevilla) and names her children. 1. Rodrigo de Toledo
2. Garcia de la Torre 3. Blanca Nunez , mujer del jurado Diego de Alcocer.
I?d be interested to know anything u would like to share on Pedro de
Toledo. My research so far encompasses the alcocers including Maria Ortiz
their mother but I?ve barely scratched the surface if Blanca. Best, Maven
------------------------------
Message: 3
Date: Tue, 1 Oct 2019 18:58:33 -0700 (PDT)
From: pavendano@earthlink.net
To: research@lists.nuestrosranchos.org
Subject: [Nuestros Ranchos] Guadalajara Entierros
Message-ID:
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=UTF-8; format=flowed; delsp=yes
Hi Sus, This is great. Thank you for sharing. I found my many times gg
greatfather hernando Frias recorded. Best, Maven
------------------------------
Subject: Digest Footer
Hi,
I found I book online that I thought someone might find interesting.
the title of the book is:
NOTICIAS BIOGRAFICAS CONTENIDAS EN LAS PARTIDAS DE ENTIERRO DE LOS LIBROS SEGUNDO, TERCERO Y CUARTO DE DEFUNCIONES DEL ARCHIVO DEL SAGRARIO METROPOLITANO DE LA CIUDAD DE GUADALAJARA 1634-1667
Here is the link for the pdf:
https://www.museocjv.com/LIBROSDECLAUDIO/monografias/NOTICIAS%20BIOGRAF…
saludos
sus
Hi, Laurel....Orendain in Spanish (pronunciation) would be
"oh-ren-dine"....the "r" has a "rolled r" sound...long i sound...if you
google pronouncenames.com you can hear the pronunciation...best wishes on
your venture!
On Wed, Oct 2, 2019 at 7:27 PM
wrote:
Dear Laurel,
Your question is a good one.
Spanish grammar dictates that words are accented on the second to last syllable of the word unless there is a written accent. However, the name Orendain is of Basque descent, so in Basque, the written accent falls above the “a”.
Did you see this video? https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=HfR5xnbMsck
Here the accent is unwritten and follows the rule and “dain” is more like the English sound in “dine or pine”
Hope this helps.
Stephanie
Sent from Windows Mail
From: research-request@lists.nuestrosranchos.org
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To: research@lists.nuestrosranchos.org
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****************************************
Today's Topics:
1. Need help with correct pronunciation of family name Orendain
(Laurel Anne Hill)
2. Two Diego de Alcocer (pavendano@earthlink.net)
3. Guadalajara Entierros (pavendano@earthlink.net)
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Message: 1
Date: Tue, 1 Oct 2019 14:46:38 -0700
From: Laurel Anne Hill
To: research@lists.nuestrosranchos.org
Subject: [Nuestros Ranchos] Need help with correct pronunciation of
family name Orendain
Message-ID:
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="UTF-8"
I am having an audiobook produced, dedicated to my great-grandmother,
Hipolita Orendain de Medina. I need to know the correct Spanish
pronunciation of "Orendain." I've gone to a variety of resources online,
but they don't all agree. I have no contact with any living relatives in
Mexico. Is the "dain" part of the name pronounced similar to the English
"dain" (long a sound), "dine" (long i sound) or "dean/deen" (long e sound)
? And where should the accent mark fall?
I truly would appreciate your assistance.
Thank you,
Laurel Anne Hill
------------------------------
Message: 2
Date: Tue, 1 Oct 2019 18:39:12 -0700 (PDT)
From: pavendano@earthlink.net
To: research@lists.nuestrosranchos.org
Subject: [Nuestros Ranchos] Two Diego de Alcocer
Message-ID:
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=UTF-8; format=flowed; delsp=yes
Hi Rick, I see ?hermano?. I am however a novice in reading old
manuscript. I?ve asked a few people including historians and credible
genealogists and they concur. Maybe others can weigh in? I see: ?QUE EL
DOCTOR JUAN D?AZ DE ALCOCER DEL NUESTRO CONSEJO VUESTRO HERMANO... ? In
this immediate family there are many Diego?s and a few Pedro?s so I?m
not surprised that people easily get them confused and much of my research is
in secondary resources since Not everything is online and I?m in
California. According to Los Conversos y la Inquisicion Sevillana by Juan Gil
v. 3, page 206-211. Dr. Juan Diaz de Alcocer was the Brother of Diego Alcocer
(married to Blanca). Other brothers include 1. Fernando married to Gracia de
Prado ( I think the Prado Madrid fam) 2. Pedro Gonzalez de Alcocer
Coincidently, in vol. 5 p. 394 of this book series it lists Pedro de Toledo
married to Beatriz Fernandez, parents of Blanca Nunez is listed in reference
to Beatriz testamento in 1508 where she requests to be buried in San
Bartolom? ( juder?a Sevilla) and names her children. 1. Rodrigo de Toledo
2. Garcia de la Torre 3. Blanca Nunez , mujer del jurado Diego de Alcocer.
I?d be interested to know anything u would like to share on Pedro de
Toledo. My research so far encompasses the alcocers including Maria Ortiz
their mother but I?ve barely scratched the surface if Blanca. Best, Maven
------------------------------
Message: 3
Date: Tue, 1 Oct 2019 18:58:33 -0700 (PDT)
From: pavendano@earthlink.net
To: research@lists.nuestrosranchos.org
Subject: [Nuestros Ranchos] Guadalajara Entierros
Message-ID:
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=UTF-8; format=flowed; delsp=yes
Hi Sus, This is great. Thank you for sharing. I found my many times gg
greatfather hernando Frias recorded. Best, Maven
------------------------------
Subject: Digest Footer
Not sure if this has been posted before, but I recently stumbled upon a book titled "No queda huella ni memoria?: semblanza iconográfica de una familia" by Aurelio de los Reyes. The book appears to be out of print and I'm not sure if it can be purchased, but large portions of the book can be viewed through Google Books. Starting around page 171 the author posts an extensive collection of family photos - some dating as far back as 1864. It's a pretty awesome collection and if you have ancestors from Pinos or the surrounding areas you may want to check it out.
Here is a link to the book. https://books.google.com/books/about/No_queda_huella_ni_memoria.html?id…
Click on any of the selected pages being displayed and scroll to page 171
Can Any HELP! Those who have Ruiz de Velasco lines in Los Altos
the patriarch is Pedro Ruiz de Velasco y Haro married to ANa Núñez
y Bohórrquez. He is supposed to have been a relative of the Viceroy
Luís Ruiz de Velasco y Haro or commonly shortened to Luís de Velasco.
Has anyone made this connection yet or have any info or leads? If
Pedro was a Velasco y Haro he has to descend from Antonio
de Velasco, Sñor de salinas and Juana Ruiz de Alarcón. The Ruiz de Velasco y Haro last name was created when these two married. I have Pedro born ca. 1590
His uknown father ca. 1560 and his grandfather uknown ca. 1518 and his grt grandfather should be Antonio de Velasco and Juana Ruiz de Alarcón. Who
knows maybe the viceroy was his grandfather anything is possible but we need proof. Any leads or info welcomed! -Daniel Méndez del Camino
My name is Betty Ritchley and like many of you, I have a rich and proud family ancestry based in Zacatecas. My mother's family started out in Los Jauregui, Nochistlan de Mejia, Zacatecas with Cristoval Manuel Jauregui Yanez and Catarina de Sarate Aramburu. The families kept migrating north, eventually settling in San Miguel de los Anchos in Chihuahua. My grandparents, Librado Quiroz and Maria Trinidad Rodriguez y Solis, eventually moved to Juarez, Chihuahua to escape the revolution.
I have been researching our family for a while now and have learned so much. If I can share any information that I have found, please let me know. I want to say how very glad that I have found all of you and look forward to working with you to learn more about our families and how they connect.
Thank you for taking a look at this.
My husband’s 4th great grandfather was Andres Borjon (b.about 1800-1830), married to Manuela Resendes/Resendez.
Our records show then the Valparaiso, Zacatecas area, specifically Hacienda Carrillo. His spouse was Manuela Resendez about 1800–1894, and the children are:Son Cecilio/Sesilio Borjon 1829–1894 and Daughter Maria "Marequita" Borjon 1830–1918.
There’s a tree on ancestry that merges our Andres Borjon with Jose Andres Borjon Sanchez, from Atotonilco el Alto, son of Jose Ygnacio De Loiola Borjon Garcia (b. 1792), with several generations and extended family in Atotonilco el Alto, Jalisco.
I was excited to see this, because the Atotonilco el Alto Botjon Sanches lines go straight back to Spain.
But on further review, there are no documents linking our Andres with their Jose Andres. It's an assumption based on the names.
I’ve looked for baptismal records that show abuelos, nothing.
Our Zacateca records linking our Andres Borjon to the 3rd great grandparents/aunt are the death records that list Andres and Manuela as the decedent's parents.
I do note that others from Zacatecas seem to originate from Atotonilco el Alto. The areas are very close.
I’d appreciate any suggestions. Are there Atotonilco records that are not indexed or not on Ancestry/Family Search.Org? Are there any genealogy lists that might tell us who their Jose Andres Borjon Sanchez married?
Where should I look?
Thanks
Anita Brenner
Hola prim@s,
I came upon this IM in the San Matias Sierra de Pinos archives (found HERE), and I was able to make some new discoveries regarding the families of Juan Díaz de León cc Francisca de Ortega and Juan de Santiago cc María de la Trinidad.
Saludos!
Manny Díez Hermosillo
Gaspar Gómez de León and Ana de los Reyes
Gaspar Gómez de León and Ana de los Reyes petitioned marriage on 29 Sep 1662, in Sierra de Pinos. They were both categorized as Mestizos.
Gaspar Gómez was born around 1642 in San Luis Potosí. He was an “hijo de la Yglesia” (of unnamed parents), and had been living in Sierra de Pinos for a little over a year. Ana de los Reyes, aka Ana Gutiérrez, was born in Pinos, and was the daughter of Melchor de los Reyes and Luisa de Ávalos, both deceased.
Gaspar and Ana presented 4 witnesses to attest to their eligibility for marriage: Marcos Arevalo (Spaniard, age 40), Pedro Díaz de León (Spaniard, age 46), Juan de Santiago (Spaniard, age 67), and Nicolás de Medina (Mestizo, age 30). Of interest, are what Pedro Díaz de León and Juan de Santiago had to say:
Pedro Díaz de León (son of Juan Díaz de León cc Francisca de Ortega, and married to Josefa de Santiago) said that he had had Gaspar Gómez in his company for a little over a year, during which time, he had remained single and free of impediments to contract marriage; nor did he have any from before, for having heard it from reputable people, who had seen the youth grow-up in and around San Luis Potosí, as he had inquired with utmost care, after the boy came into his company, because he knew that he was the son of one of the sisters of this witness, for which reason he was helping him contract marriage with Ana de los Reyes, who was the 1st-cousin of his wife, and whom he had known since she was born, and whom he had seen grow-up in the company of his father-in-law. For this reason, he knew that she was also single and eligible for marriage.
Juan de Santiago (married to María de la Trinidad) confirmed what Pedro Díaz de León had said, that Gaspar Gómez, who was about 20 years-old, grew up in and around San Luis Potosí among reputable people, who were friends of his, and whom he had heard say, on several occasions, that there were no impediments for the youth to marry Ana de los Reyes, whom he had raised in his home, like a daughter, as he had baptized her (he was her padrino), and she was the niece of his wife. For this reason, he knew that she was also eligible to marry.
From these 2 statements, we learn 4 things:
Additional information about Gaspar Gómez de León and Ana de los Reyes
The children of Gaspar Gómez de León and Ana de los Reyes are:
Both Gaspar Gómez de León and Ana de los Reyes were deceased by the time their son, Nicolás Gómez de León, married on 6 Nov 1715.
Quiero saber si alguien tiene algo de informacion sobre Juan Vasques Perea y si pude ser el mismo Juan Perea mentado en el libro "Fundadores de Nueva Galicia" por Guillermo Garmendia Leal:
p. 13 "Lista de Otros 23 Pobladores de la Ultima Guadalajara"
PEREA, Juan. Originario de Valladolid. Hijo de Juan Perea y Elvira Sanz. Fue vecino de Mexico. Fue a la Conq. de Guatemala y Honduras. Fue a Colima con Pedro de Alvarado. Fue con el virrey Mendoza a la pacificacion de Xalisco. Se avecindo en Guadalajara siendo soltero.
Juan Vasques Perea caso "ya viejo" con Elvira Gil de Lara, hija del conquistador Juan Cermeno. Tenian varios hijos e hijas. Sus descendientes vivian en el area de Lagos de Moreno y usaban los apellidos "Vasquez Zermeno" y "Vasquez de Lara." Juan Vasques Perea murio cerca el ano 1550. Un nieto Juan Gomez hizo preguntas en 1576 a un conquistador "de los servicios hechos al Rey p[o]r el d[ich]o Juan Vasquez..."
Found this map of the "Puerto de San Francisco" by Juan De Ayala of the pacquebot San Carlos. This is a detailed map of the San Francisco Bay year 1775.
The dark shaded area is the water and the light shaded area is land. The mouth or entrance into the bay is as the bottom.
This map is complete with reference points. Point D is "Almejas" at the bottom. Point B is Isla Angel (Angel Island). There are so many other points.
http://oi57.tinypic.com/14y4kg8.jpg
If you want to see the archive from its original source so you can zoom it up close as much as you want and copy it form there?
The reference is: MP-MEXICO,305
Website is:
Hello!
Have you ever heard of a rancho or pueblo called Mineral del Favor? could be in Jalisco or Michoacan,
I am tracing Alejo Espinoza's first wife Antonia Barragan (the marriage record attached indicates she was burried there)
Thank you in advance
Hello!
Have you ever heard of a rancho or pueblo called Mineral del Favor? could be in Jalisco or Michoacan,
I am tracing Alejo Espinoza's first wife Antonia Barragan (the marriage record attached indicates she was burried there)
Thank you in advance
Rick responded to a post I had made in another part of the Forum; however, to prevent that post from going off topic I decided to make its own.
Rick's slightly edited post:
"Please provide more information if you want help on Juan Vasquez de Mercado and Ynes Rangel de Acuña. Who are their kids? What years are they likely to be alive? Where did they reside? Did they move around a lot or did they mainly stay in one or two places? Who were their padrinos in their kids baptisms? Do you have any specific information on them?
There were different lines of descent that carried the Mercado Vasquez surname. There are Vasquez de Mercado or Mercado de Vasquez throughout Mexico.
One of them was started when with Juan de la Cueva del Mercado, Señor de la Casa de la Cueva de Úbeda y doña Leonor de San Martín Vázquez de Acuña. They had a son named Juan de la Cueva Mercado Vasquez.
From Spain to Fresnillo, Zacatecas. mexico
A second line of Mercado Vasquez, or Vasquez de Mercado line originated with Lic. Ginés de Mercado y Inés Vázquez.
They had a son named Gines de Mercado y Vasquez. This line of descent is the one that the Vasquez de Mercado from Fresnillo, Zacatecas, descend from.
1). Lic. Ginés de Mercado ) y Inés Vázquez,
2). Capitán Ginés Vázquez de Mercado (b. in Talavera, Spain, d. 1553, Juchipila) and Ana Vázquez de Tapia (d. Before husband as he is a widower in his later years) ), Ginés and his wife Ana were cousins.
They had one son and three daughters.
Your Juan Vasquez de Mercado that is married to Ynes Rangel de Acuña is most likely a descendant of one of these four siblings."
END RICKS POST
I am direct male descendant of Juan Vasquez de Mercado and Ines Rangel de Acuna. I have taken a Y-DNA test if that will help at all.
Juan Vasquez de Mercado (I have seen him referred to using first name Bacilio and Onofre; however, this is in dispensas many years later) and Ines Rangel de Acuna had at least 5 children:
1. Juan Vasquez de Mercado m. 19 Feb 1703 Tepatitlan to Maria de Alva Navarro
2. Antonio Vasquez de Mercado m. 29 Jun 1704 Cuquio to Maria Plascencia Maldonado
3. Rosa Vasquez de Mercado m. NN probably to a Gutierrez
4. Maria Vasquez de Mercado m. to Juan Plascencia Maldonado
5. Domingo Vasquez de Mercado m. to Teresa Plascencia Maldonado
I determined the parents to these siblings via the marriage record for Juan Vasquez de Mercado and Maria de Alva Navarro.
https://familysearch.org/ark:/61903/3:1:9392-K79G-JK?mode=g&i=78&wc=3JD…
The record states that Juan, the younger, was from Fresnillo. It also states by this time, his father, Juan, had passed away. Unfortunately there are no records on FamilySearch for Fresnillo during the time period in which my ancestor lived so I've got myself a nice brick wall.
I have never seen Juan or Ines on any other record. Based on the aforementioned marriage record I assume they came from Fresnillo. Several of their children left that area and came to Cuquio, Tepatitlan and Nochistlan for unknown reasons.
We descend from Dr Geronimo de Orozco and Beatriz Tello de Lomas (Sandoval). I cam across an interesting article called Jewish Presence in Los Altos de Jalisco. You can read it here:
https://diariojudio.com/opinion/presencia-judia-en-los-altos-de-jalisco…
It names the Tello de Orozco clan (among many others) and implicitly refers to them as though they would have been of Jewish descent. Does anyone have any documentation or family history that would corroborate this statement? The whole point of being a Crypto was not to get caught, so finding books or documents that would verify the Jewish descent of the progenitors or there immediate succeeding generations has proved somewhat difficult.
I am confident we receive (at least in part) our Jewish heritage from families just like this one...
Thanks
I have both of Sergio Gutierrez's books "Los Altos de Jalisco" Vol I & II. Vol I contains a census for Nochistlan in 1649 and Vol II has on for Nochistlan in 1664. At the end of Vol II there is a "Relacion o Descripcion del Curato de Nochistlan y Otros Pueblos, con su Padron [de 1651]" which seems to be a description of the people in the city.
Is the description above what is being considered as the Padron of 1651 or is there an actual census? If so, where can I access the census? Thank you
Hay alguien por ahí en NR que sepa quienes son los padres de Joseph Nicolás de Aceves y Ma. Gertrudis Navarro . Se que se casaron antes de Agosto de 1790, en Tepatitlán, pero no logro encontrar la fecha del matrimonio. Aquí están los datos básicos sobre está pareja que tuvo cinco hijos:
Joseph-Nicolás de Aceves Nació: ca. 1768 en Tepatitlán, Jalisco, México Falleció: Se desconoce
.. +María-Gertrudis Navarro Nació: ca. 1772 en Tepatitlán, Jalisco, México Se casaron: Bef. Agosto 1790 en Tepatitlán, Jalisco, México Falleció: Se desconoce
1. María-Guadalupe de Aceves Nació: 01 Mayo 1791 en Tepatitlán, Jalisco, México Falleció: Se desconoce
..... +Sixto Hernández Nació: ca. 1790 en Tepatitlán, Jalisco, México Se casaron: 27 Octubre 1813 en Tepatitlán, Jalisco, México Falleció: Se desconoce Padre: Ignacio Hernández Madre: Francisca Hernández
2. María-Nicolasa de Aceves Nació: 22 Mayo 1797 en Tepatitlán, Jalisco, México Falleció: Se desconoce
3. María-Ramona de Jesús de Aceves Nació: 13 Marzo 1799 en Las Milpillas, Tepatitlán, Jalisco, México Falleció: Se desconoce
..... +Juan-Antonio Abad Fernández de Rueda Nació: 08 Septiembre 1801 en Las Coronillas, Tepatitlán, Jalisco, México Se casaron: 12 Mayo 1819 en Tepatitlán, Jalisco, México Falleció: Se desconoce Padre: Juan-Antonio Fernández de Rueda Madre: María-Margarita Félix
4. María-Gertrudis de Aceves Nació: 11 Agosto 1805 en Tepatitlán, Jalisco, México Falleció: Se desconoce
5. María de los Santos de Aceves Nació: 11 Noviembre 1807 en Tepatitlán, Jalisco, México Falleció: Se desconoce
Estaría bastante agradecido si alguien me pudiera ayudar con esta familia.
I have all my family tree info in Family search, since it was the first site I used when I started working on my tree last year.
I am still very new at researching and learning new things constantly, thanks to this forum for example.
Now, I have considered taking this a little more seriously and want to have control of my information, so here is my question...
Which one, in your opinion is the best site to have your family tree that is not as expensive as ancestry? (I understand that building your tree in ancestry is free, but you cannot see records, unless you subscribe)
Thanks in advance for your opinions
Gaby Barbosa
Dear prim@s:
I have seen records of wills on Family Search for Jalisco, but I am wondering if there is an index somewhere, or anyone has done any work on these? let's say if a death records shows that the person left a will, what are the chances of finding it? and if so, which resources could I use to do so?
Thank you in advance
Gaby B.
Hola prim@s,
Here is an essay I have written about these early Sierra de Pinos settlers. My sources are San Matias Pinos parochial records (provided by Mary Lou Montagna), and parochial and protocolo records found at FamilySearch and at PARES.
Enjoy!
Manny Diez Hermosillo
FRANCISCO DE CARDONA Y MAGDALENA DE CARAVAJAL
Francisco de Cardona was born around 1569 in Mexico City, son of Francisco Ramón de Cardona and Leonor de Villegas. He was brother of Mariana de Cardona, baptized 1 Sep 1567, and of Leonor de Cardona, who married Juan de Armas, on 23 Oct 1594, in Mexico City.
In 1597, Francisco de Cardona was living in San Luis Potosí, when Alonso Jiménez sold him and Juan de Armas 28 mules. Both he and Juan de Armas are said to be arrieros (mule skinners). Note: I believe this is the same Juan de Armas who married his sister, Leonor de Cardona (and who are parents of Leonor de Armas y Cardona, wife of Pedro de Vargas Moriano); after the death of Leonor de Cardona, Juan de Armas married Leonor de la Vega Cortés, on 15 Feb 1616 in San Luis Potosí.
On 13 Apr 1602, in San Luis Potosí, Francisco de Cardona filed a civil suit against miner Juan del Valle, who had hired him to haul silver from his mines to his shop, and who still owed him 238 pesos.
Presented on 12 Nov 1603, was a map of a proposed town, “located 4 leagues from the mines of Nuestra Señora de la Concepción de Sierra de Pinos,” showing the layout of the town, with streets, a plaza mayor, and lots assigned to individuals. One of the lots was assigned to Francisco de Cardona.
On 05 Feb 1604, in San Luis Potosí, Francisco de Cardona, now the owner of a requa, or a pack train, sold 60 mules to Juan de Llamas, at 30 pesos per head. 60 mules seems like an entire fleet, so apparently, Francisco was getting out of the freight business, and my guess, reinvesting in mineral prospecting. His leap of faith paid off, because on 15 May 1604, he filed claims on no less than 11 mines, located in the Nuevo Descubrimiento del Peñón Blanco.
On 18 Jun 1604, in San Luis Potosí, Francisco de Cardona appeared as a witness in a civil suit between María de Espina and Alonso Carrillo. He gave his age as 35, placing his birth around 1569.
In Sierra de Pinos, Francisco de Cardona would live on Real de San Bartolomé Agua de La Pendencia, located at a crossroads between Peñón Blanco, Pinos, and San Luis Potosí. As a wealthy miner, he became prominent in his community, and over the years, appears as padrino for several baptisms and confirmations, and as witness to various marriages. He also owned a hacienda de beneficio (a mining hacienda), located somewhere in Pinos, and later administered by Diego Delgado "El Moso."
On 11 May 1614, in Pinos, his criados, Lorenzo and María, were married. On 6 Nov 1620, two more criados, Francisco and María, were married; Lorenzo and María were their padrinos.
Francisco de Cardona married Magdalena de Caravajal, likely in mid-1619. A clue to her origin appears in the 3 Dec 1649 marriage petition of their son, Juan de Cardona, for his marriage to Leonor Pérez de Mojica: one of the witnesses, Luis de Urdiales, declared that he was a 1st-cousin of Juan de Cardona. Luis de Urdiales was son of Luis de Urdiales and Bernardina de Arellano, also residents on La Pendencia; Bernardina de Arellano was daughter of Marcos González Obregón and Doña Magdalena de Caravajal, who would be the parents of Francisco de Cardona’s bride, obviously named for her mother.
The following year, the household staff was augmented with the acquisition of a slave: baptized on 27 Mar 1621, was Lucia, adult Negra Esclava de Francisco de Cardona. Her padrinos were Juana Díaz and her son, Diego Delgado “El Moso,” neighbors on Pendencia. One year later, on 20 Mar 1622, baptized was Tomasa, daughter of the same Lucia, Negra Esclava de Francisco de Cardona.
Francisco de Cardona died and was buried 28 Feb 1650, San Matías, Pinos, Zac. His executors were his sons, Juan and Miguel Cardona, and his wife, Magdalena de Caravajal.
On 15 Oct 1655, Doña Magdalena de Caravajal, widow of Francisco de Cardona, and now resident of San Luis Potosí, filed the necessary paper work to free her slave, Clemente, Mulato, age 2, born in her house, son of her Mulata slave, Agustina de la Cruz, “for the great love she has for the child’s mother.”
The children of Francisco de Cardona and Magdalena de Caravajal are:
Hola prim@s,
Indexing the “lost” archives provided by Mary Lou (San Matias Pinos 1613-1647), you can imagine that I’ve become pretty familiar with many of the first generation of residents in Sierra de Pinos - the family groups, the haciendas which they owned or on which they lived (by the way, I’ve been working on an ebook of all of these families, which I hope to share before the end of this year).
As some of you may have noticed, the marriages and baptisms of some of these early residents appear in Santa Maria de los Lagos, Jalisco, on Roll 221879 - Bautismos, confirmaciones, matrimonios, defunciones 1607-1728.
While going through this roll, I’d see baptisms of criados and slaves of Capitan Gabriel Ortiz de Fuenmayor, who owned Espiritu Santo in Pinos; he and his wife, Doña Ysabel Perez, appear as padrinos for some; I’d see the marriage of his successor as owner of Espiritu Santo, Don Juan Ramos de la Vega, to Juana de la Peña, daughter of Juan Perez de Alanis and Ysabel de Salas (owners of the Hacienda de Santa Ana in Pinos), and the baptisms of their children, as well as of their criados and slaves.
I always thought it odd that residents of Pinos would travel all the way to Lagos to marry or baptize their children - especially criados and slaves. Were they that mobile? Or, maybe these hacendados owned labores or ranchos in Lagos? Perplexed, I left it at that.
But as I was recently reviewing the images on this roll, starting at img150, I began to really notice how a lot of the people marrying or baptizing children, lived on either Espiritu Santo or Santa Ana. And then I noticed, on img230, confirmations performed on Espiritu Santo, on 18 Jun 1634; followed on img233, by a “Libro de Visitas” to “la yglesia del Agua del Spiritu Santo hacienda que es del Capitan Gabriel Hortiz,” which documents visits by the bishops of Guadalajara to that chapel, from 1612 to 1667. It’s followed by burials on the same hacienda.
And then it dawned on me: this is an entire book of baptisms, marriages, confirmations, visitas and burials that took place in Sierra de Pinos! They didn’t happen in Lagos! This book is in the wrong place! Either it was mistakenly transported to Lagos, or it’s a duplicate of a book that still exist in San Matias, Pinos!
Whatever the case, starting at img150-right, and through img245-left, is an entire book of holy sacraments that were performed in the chapel of the Hacienda del Espiritu Santo, in Sierra de Pinos, from 1606 to 1639.
Here are my notes and observations in regards:
- Though these events coincide with those that I indexed (1613-1647), these are not duplicates: this is an entirely different book.
- Whoever indexed this roll, only indexed the baptisms and marriages, but not the confirmations nor burials (which appear to be of criados, rather than of any of the principal families).
- Though some baptisms and marriages of the principal Spanish families appear, the majority of the records are for “castas” - mestizos, mulatos, negros and indios, who were either criados or slaves on the haciendas. What can be taken from this? Some are identified as “criados de so-and-so” or “esclavos de so-and-so,” so at least you can identify who worked for your ancestor (or who your ancestor worked for), as well as locate that ancestor. Also, many members of the principal families appear as padrinos or testigos; I’m one who likes to keep track of every detail about my people, so I log all of these events into their timelines.
In closing, even though these records are going to be found in Santa Maria de los Lagos, for accuracy’s sake, you might want to make note that these events occurred in Sierra de Pinos, Zacatecas: if your ancestor’s baptism appears among these pages, then they were likely born on Espiritu Santo, Santa Ana, or on another nearby hacienda.
I hope you’re all well!
Saludos!
Manny Díez Hermosillo
Hi my name is Stephanie Mendoza-Terrell,
I am looking for any information about my great-grandmother Jacinta Balcorta (Balcarte). She was married to a Pablo Sanchez from Zacatecas, most likely Tepetongo. I believe they were married in Zacatecas but I am not sure. All we know of Jacinta Balcorta was that she died when my grandmother was very young so she does not remember her mother. Jacinta was born in Mexico and married Pablo in Mexico but I don’t know where. They arrived in Los Angeles, Ca in 1905. I believe she was born sometime between 1872-1876.
Pablo Sanchez was born in 1872-1876. His father was Dario Sanchez and his mother was Elena Tinajero.
If anyone has any information please contact me.
