Nuestros Ranchos Site

1823. Jalisco, formerly a Province, is elevated to the status of State. The Jalisco of 1823 is considerably larger than the Jalisco of today, including regions that are today in the states of Nayarit, Colima and Zacatecas.
I found this in a historical journal regarding the state of Jalisco
 
El ano 1823, se eleva Jalisco como estado, siendo anteriormente solo una provincia. El Jalisco de 1823 siendo mas grande de lo que es hoy. Incluia regiones de Nayarit, Colima y Zacatecas.
 
Alicia,
San Jose, Calif

Las Genealogías de Jerez Zacatecas siempre serán inconclusas.
Serán inconclusas por la extracción de archivos de la iglesia, según consta en documento presentado en el libro de Filigranas, Fundaciones y Genealogías del Sr José León Robles de la Torre en el tomo de Jerez, Monte Escobedo, Zacatecas, en la pagina 60, donde dice que el día 5 de julio de 1867, a nombre de gobierno del estado se le entregaran los libros, en total fueron 96 en total, 56 de bautismos, 22 de matrimonio, y 18 de defunciones. Los cuales aparentemente fueron quemados e la revolución, para poder avanzar en nuestra genealogía solo nos queda seguir buscando en los archivos de la sagrada mitra que no fueron consultados por la genealogista Doña luz Montejano, no se si alguien sepa mas de esto

Navegando en internet me encontre un gedcom de Bernardino de Velazco el supuesto padre de Diego, nadamas que es muy pesado 18,852 lo que seria el bak, pero poca gente que desiende de diego lo tiene, como podria compartirlo

I updated my file on my DE ESCOBEDO ancestral line down to and including my parents

Hola a todos,
Con los árboles genealógicos de Uds y un análisis de ADN podrian ayudar a otras personas. Desde el 9 de Junio hasta el 24 de Junio www.familytreedna.com tiene un descuento de mas de 50% de análisis de ADN Y-DNA37+mtDNA por US$119 para los que participan en cualquier proyecto. Recomiendo que participen en en el proyecto México-DNA usando el siguiente enlace - http://www.familytreedna.com/group-join.aspx?Group=Mexico-DNA
El administrador del grupo tiene una fantástica página en http://members.tripod.com/~GaryFelix/index63.htm y tambien un foro en http://www.ybase.org/forum/forum_topics.asp?FID=511
El envio internacional solo son US$6 extra. Si necesitan traducción de íngles a español estoy a sus ordenes.
Saludos

Hello everyone,
Using your family trees and a DNA analysis you could help a lot of people out. From June 9 to June 24 there is a %50 discount on Y-DNA37+mtDNA for US$119 for participants in any group project. I recommend joining the Mexico-DNA project at http://www.familytreedna.com/group-join.aspx?Group=Mexico-DNA
The admin has a great site at http://members.tripod.com/~GaryFelix/index63.htm and also a forum at http://www.ybase.org/forum/forum_topics.asp?FID=511
International orders are only US$6 extra.
Saludos

Hi All, I am wondering if anyone has any San Miguel El Alto films on Loan or are located at their local FHC.

I have this line that I can find possibly the grandparents of one ancestor, since I dont have the marriage of the parents.

María Jesús Gutiérrez de la Cruz
24 June 1829
San Miguel El Alto, Jalisco, México
Hija de Pedro Gutiérrez y Isidra de la Cruz

Many Thanks,
Daniel

mendezdelcamino@live.com

Hello Everyone, seeing the post today in regards to Y DNA results, It occurred to me that I said I would share my results when they came in. Sorry I didn't do this sooner, although I'm sure no one was losing sleep over it ( HA !) My Y DNA results are E1b1b1a2 \ Shorthand E-V13. It is the 3rd most common haplogroup among European men and considered one of the core or founding groups in Europe. It is the only E subclade that is found in low frequencies (2% ) in N. Africa. This subclade is associated with the Balkans where the largest worldwide percentage of E-V13 is found. It is used to identify ancient peoples such as the Illyrians, Thracians and Macedonians, as well as Greeks. Modern populations that show high percentages of E-V13 are Albanians, Peloponnesian Greeks, Bulgarians and Macedonians.

As far as Spain is concerned, it is found in low numbers and mostly confined to the west of the country, the highest percentages being found in Extremadura (9%), Galicia (7%) and NW Castile (6%). It was, at one time, thought to be found in Spain due to ancient Greek exploration and settlement, but Greek settlements noted are only found on the east coast in the regions of Cataluña and Valencia. The vast majority of “E” Y DNA in Spain is associated with the Berbers, but this is sub clade E-M81.

One theory as to how a DNA marker so prevalent in the Balkans and the Eastern Mediterranean made it's way to Western Europe and Spain can be found in a town in Wales called Abegele. A study was conducted involving the town and out of 18 men tested, 7 tested positive for the marker E-V13. A wider study was conducted and it concluded that 40 % of the men in the town carried the E-V13 marker. It turns out in antiquity; Abergele was an important Roman town. It was not garrisoned by Romans \ Italians, but by Thracian auxiliaries and other men with a Balkan origin. A similar scenario could also apply to Spain, perhaps the marker made it's way there with auxiliaries in the Roman army ? The E-V13 marker also found it's way into Afghanistan and Pakistan with the men in Alexander the Great's army. A small percentage is found amongst groups who claim these men as their ancestors.

So what does it all mean?well, for one, I'm the only E-V13 on Gary Felix's website, the “Geneology of Mexico”. There are others who have the same 12 \37 marker results, but have not done the deep clade test, so who knows ? As far as helping me with my genealogy studies, as of yet it has not. I'm thinking that my ancestors in Spain may have come from one of the western provinces, perhaps Extremadura, but it’s all speculation at this point. Sorry to bore you all ! Thanks for your patience!

Robert ~

I've understood that the coat of arms was a first born to first born to
first born "thing". Heck how would I know if my line of Puentes
currently wears the Coat, heck even if it does it wouldn't be me since
my brother is older than I and my Dad is second born and my grandfather
was second born and my great grandfather was second born, hmmm this is
getting interesting. Anyway I wasn't willing to shell out any money for
something I am not going to wear.

Yes I think you do have to pay to get the info they offer but I would
just do a print screen of what you see and then call one of the
libraries that own this set of volumes
(http://www.loc.gov/rr/hispanic/geneal/index_gc.html) and see how much
they charge for photocopy services:

Name Vol. Page
Cerroa 26 101
Cerrudo 26 102
Cervantes 26 102-108
Cervató 26 102
Cervato 26 102
Cervatón 26 102
Cervatos 26 102

and

Olaeta 63 188
Olagorta 63 191
Olagüe 63 191
Olaguer 63 191
Olaiz 63 194
Olaizola 63 195
Olalde 2 130

There will be pages and pages of info on these names, all in spanish,
and that should cover the written part of names you are researching.

joseph

======================

Joseph Puentes
NoMeat@h2opodcast.com
http://h2opodcast.com/vsse.html (Vegan Environmental Solutions Podcast)
http://h2opodcast.com (Environmental Podcast)
http://h2opodcast.blogspot.com (Blog for above)
http://PleaseListenToYourMom.com (Women's Peace Podcast)
http://NuestraFamiliaUnida.com (Latin American History Podcast)
http://nuestrosranchos.org (Jalisco, Zacatecas, and Aguascalientes
Genealogy)

Emilie Garcia wrote:
> Joseph,
>
> I tried to print out my surnames and Tony's (Olague and Cervantes)
and they wouldn't print off this website. Did you have to pay to get
the image and the history? They wanted almost $20.00 just for the image.
>
> Emilie
> Port Orchard, WA

I've understood that the coat of arms was a first born to first born to
first born "thing". Heck how would I know if my line of Puentes
currently wears the Coat, heck even if it does it wouldn't be me since
my brother is older than I and my Dad is second born and my grandfather
was second born and my great grandfather was second born, hmmm this is
getting interesting. Anyway I wasn't willing to shell out any money for
something I am not going to wear.

Yes I think you do have to pay to get the info they offer but I would
just do a print screen of what you see and then call one of the
libraries that own this set of volumes
(http://www.loc.gov/rr/hispanic/geneal/index_gc.html) and see how much
they charge for photocopy services:

Name Vol. Page
Cerroa 26 101
Cerrudo 26 102
Cervantes 26 102-108
Cervató 26 102
Cervato 26 102
Cervatón 26 102
Cervatos 26 102

and

Olaeta 63 188
Olagorta 63 191
Olagüe 63 191
Olaguer 63 191
Olaiz 63 194
Olaizola 63 195
Olalde 2 130

There will be pages and pages of info on these names, all in spanish,
and that should cover the written part of names you are researching.

joseph

======================

Joseph Puentes
NoMeat@h2opodcast.com
http://h2opodcast.com/vsse.html (Vegan Environmental Solutions Podcast)
http://h2opodcast.com (Environmental Podcast)
http://h2opodcast.blogspot.com (Blog for above)
http://PleaseListenToYourMom.com (Women's Peace Podcast)
http://NuestraFamiliaUnida.com (Latin American History Podcast)
http://nuestrosranchos.org (Jalisco, Zacatecas, and Aguascalientes
Genealogy)

Emilie Garcia wrote:
> Joseph,
>
> I tried to print out my surnames and Tony's (Olague and Cervantes)
and they wouldn't print off this website. Did you have to pay to get
the image and the history? They wanted almost $20.00 just for the image.
>
> Emilie
> Port Orchard, WA

This is a message sent to me from a fellow ranchos member, Olivia
Jaurequi-Reyes.

joseph

======================

Joseph Puentes
NoMeat@h2opodcast.com
http://h2opodcast.com/vsse.html (Vegan Environmental Solutions Podcast)
http://h2opodcast.com (Environmental Podcast)
http://h2opodcast.blogspot.com (Blog for above)
http://PleaseListenToYourMom.com (Women's Peace Podcast)
http://NuestraFamiliaUnida.com (Latin American History Podcast)
http://nuestrosranchos.org (Jalisco, Zacatecas, and Aguascalientes
Genealogy)

-------- Original Message --------
Subject: Fw: [CA-SCGS] California Legislation Threatens Records
Availability - Need Your Help
Date: Fri, 3 Jul 2009 19:07:52 -0700 (PDT)
From: Olivia Jaurequi-Jaurequi
To: Joseph Puentes

Hello Jospeh,
I received this email yesterday and thought I'd forward it along to you
to be sent to Ranchos members if you think appropriate. Don't know if
you've received any information on Assembly Bill 130 which is to be
heard in the Senate Appropriations Committee sometime soon. I'm
associate with GSHA-SC and received it from my contact. If passed the
bill will most probably affect most researchers in California.

Olivia Jaurequi-Reyes
Rowland Heights, CA

----- Forwarded Message ----
From: Donie Nelson
To: GSHA-SC eNews List
Sent: Wednesday, July 1, 2009 4:29:02 PM
Subject: FW: [CA-SCGS] California Legislation Threatens Records
Availability - Need Your Help

Dear Researcher:

Please read the message below from our colleagues at SCGS. This affects
anyone who accesses California records now or in the future. We need to
write to Gov. Schwarzenegger NOW.

Donie Nelson
eNews You Can Use
Genealogical Society of Hispanic America - Southern California
310-204-6808
http://www.scgsgenealogy.com/GSHA.htm
*************************************

------ Forwarded Message
From: "Paula Hinkel"
Date: Tue, 30 Jun 2009 11:27:55 -0700
To:
Subject: [CA-SCGS] California Legislation Threatens Records Availability -
Need Your Help

Passing along this notice from
Liz Stookesberry Myers
California Alliance of Genealogical Societies
Legislative Committee

Assembly Bill 130 will be heard in the Senate Appropriations
Committee very soon. It was introduced by Kevin Jeffries
(Republican) of the Temecula area. The Bill was presented at the
request of the Recorder Association of California. They want to be
able to handle Marriage Records the same as Birth and Death Records.
That means that they can black out the Mother's Maiden name, if the
County Recorder chooses. The Recorder also has the option of sending
out an informational copy only.

The main concern is what the Recorder of each county may or may not
choose to do. At least that is the way it is written today.

As we know, the unfounded fear of ID theft is a worry to
legislatures on the state and national levels. Yet, research shows
that ID Theft is caused by Data Hackers or stolen items from a
friend or acquaintance!

I urge you to notify the Senate Appropriation's Committee and your
State Representatives of our feelings about access to these public
records. Remind them that these records help us to find family and
determine if an inherited disease is running through the family
lines. That seems to get their attention.

Go to www.senate.ca.gov/ and click on Committees go to: Standing
Committee to Appropriations. There you will see the members of the
committee and staff information. Call or write these committee
members and let them know how important changing this rule is to
genealogists world wide!

Go to http://www.legislature.ca.gov/ to find your local
representative. When this bill goes to the Senate and Assembly
Floor, we will need to jump in and let them know how important
access to these records is to us!

We have been advised by Jan Meisels Allen, of the International
Association of Jewish Genealogical Societies and Chairperson, of
Public Records Access and Monitoring Committee to "write to the
governor as it can be heard as soon as today and the way this bill
is moving it won't take long for it to pass both houses on the
floor." Urge the governor to veto the bill..."
http://gov.ca.gov/interact#contact

Please take a moment to make a call, or write a letter or Fax your
thoughts. It will only happen if we take the time to do it now!

- * - * - * - * - * - * - * - * - * - * -
SCGS is now a FamilySearch Center.
Order your microfilms at the SCGS
Family Research Library.

-------------------------------
To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to
CA-SCGS-request@rootsweb.com with the word 'unsubscribe' without the quotes
in the subject and the body of the message

------ End of Forwarded Message

If anyone in the group has information and feels inclined to help please
send reply to this person who needs help in researching how to find a
person buried in Guadalajara in 1993.

thanks,

joseph

======================

Joseph Puentes
NoMeat@h2opodcast.com
http://h2opodcast.com/vsse.html (Vegan Environmental Solutions Podcast)
http://h2opodcast.com (Environmental Podcast)
http://h2opodcast.blogspot.com (Blog for above)
http://PleaseListenToYourMom.com (Women's Peace Podcast)
http://NuestraFamiliaUnida.com (Latin American History Podcast)
http://nuestrosranchos.org (Jalisco, Zacatecas, and Aguascalientes
Genealogy)

-------- Original Message --------
Subject: Re: Nuestros Ranchos user notice
Date: Thu, 02 Jul 2009 13:14:39 -0400
From:
Reply-To: kjsooners@classicnet.net
To: moderator@nuestrosranchos.org

I am so sorry that I didn't reply sooner. This isnt really what I was
looking for. I need help with questions in regards to doing research in
Guadalajara - finding out where someone is buried. We dont have alot of
genealogy to share because there is only one family member that is
buried there and we just recently found out that is where he passed
away. He left Texas in the early 1960's and we had no idea on where he
went. He died in 1993 and is buried there. We just don't know where.
Trying to find out information on cemeteries as his granddaughter will
be coming to this area for Christmas 09 and would like to visit his grave.

Thank you for your help.

I am also the third generation born in this country. My father was raised in
East L.A. his grandparents came from Aguascalientes and Culiacan. My father
only spoke spanish until the age of 5 when he started attending public
school. My mother is a NewYorican ( a Puerto Rican from New York) her mother
came as a girl w/parents from Humacao, PR. She says she dosen't ever
remember not understanding both english and spanish. While both my parents
are bilingual they never taught their children spanish. They would say they
spoke primarily in english because they "think in english". The funny thing
is that they spoke spanish around us just enough for us to understand what
was being said when we heard the language, but we can't speak it. I have
learned that the 3rd generation born in the US usually don't speak spanish.
The first must speak it to communicate w/parents. The 2nd generation usually
speak it to communicate w/grandparents who frequently take care of them as
children. The third generation rarely speak spanish fluently. I have about
30 first cousins and none of them speak spanish except 2 of them who moved
to Mexico for an extended period of time to learn the language. I personally
feel like my parent did me a diservice.

On Sun, Jul 5, 2009 at 4:03 PM,
wrote:

A good program for translation has yet to be invented. In my opinion there
will never be a sutible replacement for a human translator. Language itself
is so complex and subjective that a computer just can't do the job properly.
The person that comes up with a good translation program will be rolling in
cash, but it's most likley not possible. I know a good professional
translator, if anyone is interested in hiring him let me know and I'll pass
along contact his contact information.

On Sun, Jul 5, 2009 at 4:06 PM,
wrote:

> Send Research mailing list submissions to
> research@lists.nuestrosranchos.org
>
> To subscribe or unsubscribe via the World Wide Web, visit
>
> http://lists.nuestrosranchos.org/listinfo.cgi/research-nuestrosranchos…
>
> or, via email, send a message with subject or body 'help' to
> research-request@lists.nuestrosranchos.org
>
> You can reach the person managing the list at
> research-owner@lists.nuestrosranchos.org
>
> When replying, please edit your Subject line so it is more specific
> than "Re: Contents of Research digest..."
>
>
> Nuestros Ranchos Research Mailing List
> DAILY DIGEST
> ****************************************
>
>
> Today's Topics:
>
> 1. Google translate doesn't work (arman212@sbcglobal.net)
>
>
> ----------------------------------------------------------------------
>
> Message: 1
> Date: Sun, 5 Jul 2009 07:10:05 -0700 (PDT)
> From: arman212@sbcglobal.net
> Subject: [Nuestros Ranchos] Google translate doesn't work
> To: research@lists.nuestrosranchos.org
> Message-ID:
> &nid=17863&pid=16027&cid=16036&uid=3159&tid=
> 2&fc2eb26cae86f8c35fd0b428ef6d29b6@www.nuestrosranchos.org<2%26fc2eb26cae86f8c35fd0b428ef6d29b6@www.nuestrosranchos.org>
> >
>
> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=UTF-8; format=flowed
>
> Google translate really isn't good enough. I have been trying to find time
> in the past few days to translate for the readers that would like a
> translation. Even though I am not the best person to do translations I can
> do a better job than Google.
> An example is that even for the simple phrase "How's that?" Google
> translated it to "?C?mo es eso?" when it should be "?Esta bien?" or ?Que
> tal?
> "?Como les parecen?" means "How do you (plural) look like them?" It should
> be ?Que les parece? Please don't take it personal. I have done bad
> translations before and I will continue to do so. Also, typos can make it
> look like a person doesn't know how to write in that language.
>
> Cordially,
> Armando
>
>
> Las traducci?nes de Google realmente tiene demasiados errores. He estado
> tratando de encontrar tiempo de traducir para los lectores que les gustaria
> una traducci?n. Aun no soy el mejor para hacer traducciones pero lo podria
> hacer mejor que Google.
> Por ejemplo el simpre frase "How's that?" esta traducido por Google como
> "?C?mo es eso?" cuando deber?a ser "?Esta bien?" o ?Que tal?
> "?como les parecen?" quiere decir "How do you (plural) look like them?"
> cuando deber?a ser ?Que les parece? Por favor no lo tomes mal. He hecho mal
> las traducciones antes y seguir? haci?ndolo. Adem?s, errores por falta de
> usar bien el teclado pueden hacer que se vea que una persona no sabe
> escribir bien en ese idioma.
>
> Cordialmente,
> Armando
>
>
> ------------------------------
>

http://translate.google.com/translate_t#en|es|translate%20English%20into%20Spanish

Para los que necesitan traducir los e-mails a ingles/espanol

Link for those who need translations for Enlish/Spanish.

How's that? Ha! como les parecen?

Emilie
Port Orchard, WA

Interpretations of Christening Records of Aguascalientes 1727-1762

Source:
Mexico Aguascalientes Catholic Church Records, Rincón de Romos.
Bautismos en la Parroquia de San José de Gracia, 1726-1762
(pilot.familysearch.org, images 1-221, image files 4340118_277-497)

... = omitted text
___ = unknown characters that are hidden in the gutter of the bound volume
( ) = text that is uncertain, or clarifying comments
< > = text from the margin

* = in database
+ = in database as research note only
---------------------------------------
Interpretations of christenings Ags 1743

image filename 4340118_353.jpg

En la Hazienda de Santiago Feligrecia de la Villa de Aguascalientes en
ocho dias de Dic 1742 ... Maria, mestisa __ nuebe dias de nasida
originaria del Puesto del Rio Blanco, hija lexitima de Maselino de
Herrera y Maria de los Dolores, fueron sus padrinos ____ de Aleman y
Juana Nicolasa

En la Hazienda de Santiago Feligrecia de la Villa de Aguascalientes en
sinco del mes de 1743 ... Maria Manuela, yndia nacida de dose
dias hija de padres no conocidos y originaria de dicha hazienda,
fueron padrinos Francisco Albares de la Torre y Maria Theresa

En la Hazienda de Santiago Feligrecia de la Villa de Aguascalientes en
veinte y siete ___ mes de henero 1743 ... Petra Lugarda, coyota __ tr.
(60?) dias de nacida, hija legitima de Matheo de Hortis y Maria de
Esparza, y es originaria de dicha hazienda, fueron sus padrinos Manuel
Duron y Antonia de Chabes

+En la Hazienda de Santiago Feligrecia de la Villa de Aguascalientes
en veinte y ___tro del mes de Febrero 1743 ... Joseph Antonio ( )
Natibo del Pueblo de San Joseph de Gracia de Nb. dias de nacido hijo
legitimo de Phelipe Bentura y Maria Josepha, fueron sus padrinos
Ma(nuel/gdaleno?) Antonio y Anna Maria de los Dolores

*En la Hazienda de Santiago Feligrecia de la Villa de Aguascalientes
en veinte y quatro del mes de Marzo 1743 ... Gertrudis, yndia
originaria del Pueblo de Señor San Joseph de Gracia de nuebe dias de
nacida hija lexitima de Francisco Rodrigues y Nicolasa de los Reies,
yndios, fueron sus padrinos Simón de Silba y Juana Catharina

{see also Ags, Sagrario, Bautismos 1717-1727, image 84 image filename
4339960_299.jpg " En la Villa de Aguascalientes en mes de
Agosto 1721 baptise y puse los Santos Olios á Francisco Xavier, indio
hijo legitimo de Manuel Rodrigues y de Juana de la Cruz, fueron us
padrinos Xpthobal Basques y Paula Garcia" and image 88, filename
4339960_303.jpg "En la Villa de Aguascalientes en ocho de Octubre 1721
baptise y puse los Santos Oleos á Nicolasa, india hija lexitima de
Matheo de los Reies y de Michaela Ramires, padrino Xpl (probably
Christóbal) Peres". Note: there were several Francisco Xavier's born
in 1721, and another born in 1734 who also married a Nicolasa de los
Reyes aka de los Santos aka de la Cruz - very confusing}

*En la Hazienda de Santigao Feligrecia de la Villa de Aguascalientes
en veinte y siete de Abril 1743 ... Maria Cecilia, mulata de diesiocho
dias de nacida originaria de dicha hazienda hija legitima de Pedro
Basques y Josepha Girosta, fueron sus padrinos Sebastian Cordero y
Maria de Esqueda

*En la Hazienda de Santiago Feligrecia de la Villa de Aguascalientes
en primero del mes de maio 1743 ... Juan George, yndio de nuebe dias
de nacido originario del Puesto de Garabato hijo legitimo de Alexandro
de Ybarra y de Nicolasa Garcia, sirbiente en Garabato, fueron sus
padrinos Andres Rodrigues y Andrea Felipa

En la Hazienda de Santiago Feligrecia de la Villa de Aguascalientes en
sinco del mes de Maio 1743 ... Aniceto de Jesus, de diesyocho dias de
nacido, yndio originario del Pueblo de San Joseph de Gracia hijo
lexitimo de Geronimo de Ortis y de Asencia Hernandes, fueron sus
padrinos Ysidro Joseph y Maria de / la Encarnasion

image filename 4340118_354.jpg

En la Hazienda de Santiago Feligrecia de la Villa de Aguascalientes en
quinse del mes de io 1743 ... Juana Rosalia, yndia de dies dias de
nacida originaria del Pueblo de San Joseph de Gracia hija lexitima de
Ma____ Preciado y de Juana Dias, fueron sus padrinos Simon de Silba y
Juana Cath_____

En la Hazienda de Santiago Feligrecia de la Villa de Aguascalientes en
nuebe del mes de Junio 1743 ... Manuela Gertrud__, yndia natural del
Pueblo de San Joseph de Gracia de doze dias de nacida, hija legitima
de Juan Gonzales y de Maria de la Cruz, fueron sus padrinos Sipriano
de Herrera y Juana Muños

*En la Hazienda de Santiago Feligrecia de la Villa de Aguascalientes
en Veinte y (tres) del mes de Junio 1743 ... Juan Santo Sustinio,
coiote de dose dias de nacido originario de la Labor del Garabato hijo
legitimo de J___ Leandro y de Maria de Eredia difunta, fueron sus
padrinos Raphael Rodrigues y Efigenia Serrano

*En la Hazienda de Santiago Feligrecia de la Villa de Aguascalientes
en seis del mes de Junio ... Petra Gertrudis, de
quinse dias de nacida mulata hija legitima de Juan Basques y de Maria
de la Cruz, sirbientes de dicha hazienda, fueron sus padrinos Lazaro
de Santiago y Maria Josepha de Esparsa

*En la Hazienda de Santiago Feligrecia de la Villa de Aguascalientes
en 16 del mes de Julio 1743 ... Pedro Joseph, yndio de quinse dias de
nacido hijo legitimo de Jasinto Guerrero y de Juana Maria del Carmen,
originarios del el Pueblo de Señor San Joseph de Gracia, fueron sus
padrinos Juan Joseph de Alda(co) y Juana Antonia

En la Hazienda de Santiago Feligrecia de la Villa de Aguascalientes en
veinte y ocho de Julio 1743 ... Joseph Ygnacio, yndio de ocho dias de
nacido originario de la Labor del Garabato hijo lexitimo de Bernardo
Sedrano y de Maria Antonia sirbientes de dicha labor de Garabato,
fueron sus padrinos Francisco Xavier y Antonia Basilia

En la Hazienda de Santiago Feligrecia de la Villa de Aguascalientes en
quatro de Agosto 1743 ... Eusebio, yndio de un mes de nacido de padres
no conosido natural de dicha hazienda, fue su madrina Monica de
Salasar

image filename 4340118_355.jpg

En la hazienda de Santiago Feligrecia de la Villa de Aguascalientes en
quinse del mes de Septiembre 1743 ... Joseph Mariano, yndio de ocho
dias de nasido hijo legitimo de Joseph (Man?___) Ortis y de Eusevia
Francisca, sirbientes del Puesto de Garabato, fueron sus padrinos
Lorenzo Siriaco y Maria Domingues

En la hazienda de Santiago Feligrecia de la Villa de Aguascalientes en
tres del mes de Octubre 1743 ... Joseph Maria, yndio originario del
Pueblo de San Joseph, de sinco dias de nacido hijo legitimo de
Cristobal Garcia y de Barbara de Luna, fueron sus padrinos de
Alexandro Castañeda y de Maria de Niebes

En la hazienda de Santiago Feligrecia de la Villa de Aguascalientes en
tres del mes de Oct 1743 ... Josep Matheo de veinteitres dias de
nacido originario del Pueblo de San Joseph de Padre no conocido,
fueron su padrinos Joseph Losano y _____Lina

*En la hazienda de Santiago Feligrecia de la Villa de Aguascalientes
en veinte y siete del mes de Oct 1743 ... Andres de Santiago,
originario del Pueblo de San Joseph de Gracia de ____ dias de nacido
hijo legitimo de Pedro de Santiago y de Paula Garcia, yndios de dicho
pueblo, fueron sus padrinos Maximo Antonio Lopes y Juana Basques

En la hazienda de Santiago Feligrecia de la Villa de Aguascalientes en
dies de nobiembre 1743 ... Simona Thadea, yndia originaria del Pueblo
de San Joseph de Gracia de quinse dias de nacida (xx-h.l.-xx) de Nicolas
de Silba y Juana Catharina, fueron sus padrinos; hija de padres no
conosidos (It appears that the scribe started to write "h. l. de
Nicolas de Silba y Juana Catharina ...", then crossed out the "h. l."
and appended "fueron sus padrinos; hija de padres no conosidos")

En la Hazienda de Santiago Feligrecia de la Villa de Aguascalientes en
dies del mes Nob 1743 ... Joseph Carlos, yndio de sinco dias de nacido
hijo legitimo de Juan Bentura y de Catharina dela Cruz, sirbiente de
dicha hazienda, fueron sus padrinos Christobal de la Cruz y Maria
Luisa

En la Hazienda de Santiago Feligrecia de la Villa de Aguascalientes en
(??) del mes de disiembre 1743 ... Maria Catharina de dies y ocho dias
de nacida yndia originaria de el Pueblo del Señor San Joseph hija
legitima de Juan de Estrada y de Felipa Francisca, fueron sus padrinos
Jasinto de Herrera y Juana Maria

1744

*En la Hazienda de Santiago Feligrecia de la Villa de Aguascalientes
en sinco de henero 1744 ... Joseph Thomas, yndio de quatro dias de
nacido, nasido en el Pueblo de San Joseph de Gracia hijo legitimo de
Juan Anguel (possibly Miguel) y de Maria de San Juan vesinos de la
hazienda de Tallagua, fueron sus padrinos Joseph Marthin y Maria de la
Candelaria

En la hazienda de Santiago Feligrecia de la Villa de Aguascalientes en
sinco de henero 1744 ... Juana Manuela, coyota de nuebe dias de nacida
hija legitima de Joseph Garcia y de Josepha de Esp.a sirbientes de
dicha hazienda, fueron sus padrinos Joachin Rendon y Luisa Jasinta

*En la hazienda de Santiago feligrecia de la Villa de Aguascalientes
en doze del mes de henero 1744 ... Maria Thomasa, yndia de dos dias de
nacida hija lexitima de Salbador de Luera y de Maria Ygnes originarios
del Pueblo de San Joseph de Gracia, fueron sus padrinos Joseph Martin
y Maria de la Candelaria
{Note: Thomasa's father was Miguel Salvador de Luera y Córdova}

--
Best regards,
Stuart mailto:stuartarms@gmail.com

I'm pretty much going from a 80thcousin/friends information who is much
much more knowledgeable than I am in DNA understanding. Here are some
communications I've had with him:

Specifically it comes from:
http://www.houseofnames.com/xq/asp.c/qx/puentes-coat-arms.htm

====================

On the subject of your haplogroup, red means predicted as opposed to
confirmed. The certificate you emailed me from Ethno (S21+)390 is
confirmation of your U106. I suggest emailing it to FTDNA and
requesting that your haplo be changed to R1b1b2g green as confirmed.
You could also email it to the U106 project administrator and also
advise that you are R1b1b2g confirmed. As to the offer below, I would
accept it, as many more recent studies are uncovering special genetic
groupings within the SNP's. The South Euro (Spain Portugal France) part
of U106 represents a very small 4%, with distintive differences in their
markers ie: DYS390+25, 385b=14 or 15, 447=25 or 26, 464A-D=15,15,16,17,
GATA H4=11, YCA I and II= 19, 23 or 24 and 456=15. These are all
different than the large modal for U106 (Frisian) which dominates the
project. My belief and that of other studies suggests these markers are
found in Basque and Gaelic populations that migrated from the Pyrennes
and Northern Spain to Ireland. This study may also shed light on when
and where this special signature emerged (Alpine Germanic? to Iberia) Lyn

======================

The simple answer to your question is yes. All R1b1b2a1a tested
individuals relate to one person who mutated to the SNP referred to in
short as R1b-U106. So far research suggests that took place about 3500
years ago. This individual was a son of SNP P311 and his brother was
P312, an SNP found in numerous Spanish individuals. These two SNP's
are so close, that recently several individuals originally tested as
U106 (your S21), were reclassified as P312. The key is the markers and
specifically the first 12. The bulk of U106 have a 390=23 and indicate
a subclade of U106 called L48+. The rest of us are L48-, and for those
closest to you 390=25. That is found in a wide area, and the debate
continues as to whether it originated in Austria moving south and north?
or Belgium moving east and south? I would bet on the second and still
see no evidence to change my opinion that those with this signature in
Spain, southern France, Ireland and Scotland are the downstream
descendants of the Celtic-Germano Volcae who migrated from the north
into Iberia circa 300BC. New subclade SNP's are discovered every day,
and maybe one will surface to further define our group. Lyn

======================

Thank you for the invite Joseph, I sincerely hope to have a chance to
meet you both at some point. My wife Cecilia (French on the maternal
side) is descended from the family Poitvin anciently of Lanquedoc in
Southern France (kinda the same area, on the North slopes of the
Pyrennes) and believe it or not as the Ripleys used to say, our
progenitor (the Volcae) if I have it figured correctly link to Turkey as
well. The distance calculation between us is a genetic distance of
26/67, so aproximately 2200-2400 years/av 30 between generations (FTDNA)
or about an 80th cousin removed by the time that original U106 line had
migrated and mutated to 13, 25, 14 10. Lyn

joseph

======================

Joseph Puentes
NoMeat@h2opodcast.com
http://h2opodcast.com/vsse.html (Vegan Environmental Solutions Podcast)
http://h2opodcast.com (Environmental Podcast)
http://h2opodcast.blogspot.com (Blog for above)
http://PleaseListenToYourMom.com (Women's Peace Podcast)
http://NuestraFamiliaUnida.com (Latin American History Podcast)
http://nuestrosranchos.org (Jalisco, Zacatecas, and Aguascalientes
Genealogy)

arman212@sbcglobal.net wrote:
> Joseph, I see you commented "Spanish Origins Valley of Trucios,
Province of Biscay" Do you have more info? My ancestors are from the
same area, Valmaseda, but with a surname from Valle de Mena, Burgos. I
won't have my results until August though. Armando

hola,
Ya tengo donde conseguir el libro en la Ciudad de México, le interesa a
alguien?, cuesta aprox. $100 US mas gastos de envio.

I have been doing genealogy for the past 18 years and never found the benefits of the Information Matrimonial records until last night. In the past I have ordered rolls and rolls of these films looking for missing links with no success. But last night I was helping my research colleague with a mystery in Aguascalientes. He had the date of his ancestors marriage, but the marriage document didn't provide much information....date, their names and witnesses only. So for the heck of it I went to the Information Matrimonial film for the year of the marriage. I looked for the month previous to the date of this couples marriage and lo and behold it was there along with the names of the couples parents (one line came from Sierra de Pinos).

So if you're looking for the marriage of Joseph Peres and Juliana Chabes in Aguascalientes for 3 Feb 1704, the Information Matrimonial was in January, I believe it was image 15.

I just thought I'd share this new find....not sure if you've had the same problem that I've had with these records...I had pretty much given up on them due to frustration and cost....but now I know how to use them.....go back 6-3 weeks before the couples marriage. I'm hoping Jalisco, Zacatecas and Sonora digitized records will be online soon.

Well, looks like I'll be doing some major hunting this week-end.

Rose Hardy
Fresno

Dear Members,
I just visited the Pilot website and found that it has been updated. I am happy to see Coahuila as part of my maternal family comes from that area. At this pace, we all wish Jalisco to be on line this year.

Jaime Alvarado

Interpretations of Christening Records of Aguascalientes 1727-1762

Source:
Mexico Aguascalientes Catholic Church Records, Rincón de Romos.
Bautismos en la Parroquia de San José de Gracia, 1726-1762
(pilot.familysearch.org, images 1-221, image files 4340118_277-497)

... = omitted text
___ = unknown characters that are hidden in the gutter of the bound volume
( ) = text that is uncertain, or clarifying comments
< > = text from the margin

* = in database
+ = in database as research note only

----------------------------------------------
image filename 4340118_343.jpg

**En la Hazienda de Santiago feligresia de la Villa de Aguascalientes
en treinta y uno de Henero 1740 ... Maria Antonia, india originaria de
el Pueblo de San Joseph hijo de padres no conocidos, fueron sus
padrinos Simon Benites y Juana de Lara

+En la Hazienda de Santiago feligresia de la Villa de Aguascalientes
en primero de Febrero 1740 ... Paula Merenciana, loba originaria de la
dicha villa digo de la dicha hazienda hija legitima de Juan de
Salasar, indio, y Maria de la Concepcion, mulata, sirvientes en la
expresada hazienda, fueron sus padrinos Phelipe de Jesus y Ana Maria
Basques

En la Hazienda de Santiago feligresia de la Villa de Aguascalientes en
tres de Febrero 1740 ... Maria Anastasia, loba, originaria de la dicha
hazienda hija legitima de Juan Antonio, mulato, y Thadea, india,
sirvientes en dicha hazienda, fueron sus padrinos Miguel Carrasquilla
y Maria Dolores

En la Hazienda de Santiago feligresia de la Villa de Aguascalientes en
beinte uno de febrero 1740 ... Blas de la Candelaria, indio originario
del Pueblo de San Joseph hijo legitimo de Martin Lopez, difunto, y
Maria de la Concepcion, vecina de dicho pueblo, fueron sus padrinos
Ygnacio Rodrigues y Maria Gertrudis

*En la Hazienda de Santiago feligresia de la Villa de Aguascalientes
en beinte y dos de Febrero 1740 ... Juan Pablo, lobo originario de
dicha hazienda hijo legitimo de Santiago Ramires, indio, y Juana de
Lara, mulata, sirvientes en dicha hazienda, fue su madrina Maria
Antonia

image filename 4340118_344.jpg

+En la Hazienda de Santiago feligresia de la Villa de Aguascalientes
en dose de Marzo 1740 ... Joseph Francisco originario de dicha
hazienda hijo legitimo de Augustin Garcia, mestiso, y Leonicia
Marcela, india, sirvientes en dicha hazienda, fue su madrina Ana
Basques

En la Hazienda de Santiago feligresia de la Villa de Aguascalientes en
beinte y sinco de Marzo 1740 ... Maria Alexandra hija natural, india
originaria de la Labor de Garabato, fueron sus padrinos Joachin
Caldera y Gertrudis Garcia

En la Hazienda de Santiago feligresia de la Villa de Aguascalientes en
dos de Mayo 1740 ... Joseph Antonio, mulato originario de la Labor de
Garabato, hijo legitimo de Juan Antonio Sandobal y Gertrudis Caldera,
mulatos vecinos en dicha labor, fueron sus padrinos Nicolas Garcia y
Francisca Thomasa

*En la Hazienda de Santiago feligresia de la Villa de Aguascalientes
en seis de Mayo 1740 ... Pablo Martin, indio originario de dicha
hazienda hijo legitimo de Luis Santiago y Maria Magdalena, indios
sirvientes en la referida hazienda, fue su madrina Maria de la Cruz

En la Hazienda de Santiago feligresia de la Villa de Aguascalientes en
ocho de Mayo 1740 ... Maria Guadalupe de la Cruz, india originaria de
la dicha hazienda hija legitima de Juan Bentura y Catarina Augustina,
indios sirvientes en la expresada hazienda, fueron sus padrinos
Christobal de la Cruz y Maria de la Cruz

En la Hazienda de Santiago feligresia de la Villa de Aguascalientes en
catorse de Mayo 1740 ... / (next image) Anastacia Rosalia, mestisa
originaria de la dicha hija legitima de Juan Antonio de Esparsa y
Maria Ysabel, sirvientes en dicha hazienda, fueron sus padrinos Manuel
Basques y Chrestina Garcia

image filename 4340118_345.jpg

En la Hazienda de Santiago feligresia de la Villa de Aguascalientes en
sinco de Junio 1740 ... Antonia de la Cruz, india originaria de el
Pueblo de San Joseph hija natural, fueron sus padrinos Joseph Hilario
y Francisca Domingues

*En la Hazienda de Santiago feligresia de la Villa de Aguascalientes
en sinco de Junio 1740 ... Maria Guadalupe, india originaria de el
Pueblo de San Joseph hija legitima de Juan de Rosas y Michaela
Josepha, vesinos de dicho pueblo, fueron sus padrinos Francisco Xavier
Ramos y Getrudis Ramos

En la Hazienda de Santiago feligresia de la Villa de Aguascalientes en
beinte y cinco de Julio 1740 ... Margarita Gertrudis, india originaria
de el Pueblo de San Josehp hija legitima de Francisco Mathias y
Gregoria Quiteria, vecinos de dicho pueblo, fue su madrina Juana de
Aguallo

En la Hazienda de Santiago feligresia de la Villa de Aguascalientes en
tres de Agosto 1740 ... Maria Magdalena, india originaria de el Pueblo
de San Joseph hija de padres no conocidos, fueron sus padrinos Diego
Martin y Maria Josepha

En la Hazienda de Santiago feligresia de la Villa de Aguascalientes en
beinte uno de Sept 1740 ... / (next image) Antonio Maria, collote
originario de dicha hazienda hijo legitimo de Asencio Hernandes,
indio, y Juana Gertrudis, española, ambos vecinos de dicha hazienda,
fueron sus padrinos Juan Antonio de Esparza y (Ysab__) de Ledesma

image filename 4340118_346.jpg

+En la Hazienda de Santiago feligresia de la Villa de Aguascalientes
en beinte y sinco de Sept 1740 ... Francisco Xavier, indio originario
de la Hazienda de Paderes hijo de padres no conocidos, fue su madrina
Juana de Aguallo

*En la Hazienda de Santiago feligresia de la Villa de Aguascalientes
en seis de Nov 1740 ... Pablo Joseph, lobo orignario de la Hazienda de
Paderes hijo legitimo de Francisco Angel, mulato, y Viviana de la
Rosa, india, vesinos en dicha hazienda de Paderes, fueron sus padrinos
Alexandro Phelipe y Maria Dolores

En la Hazienda de Santiago feligresia de la Villa de Aguascalientes en
beinte y sinco de Nov 1740 ... Maria Antonia, india hija de padres no
conocidos originaria de el Pueblo de San Joseph, fueron sus padrinos
Juan Simon y Juana Catarina

En la Hazienda de Santiago feligresia de la Villa de Aguascalientes en
cinco de febrero 1741 ... Joseph Antonio indio originario de el Pueblo
de San Joseph hijo legitimo de Pasqual Ruis y Antonia Rodrigues,
vecinos de dicho pueblo, fue su madrina Viviana de la Cruz

En la Hazienda de Santiago feligresia de la Villa de Aguascalientes en
cinco de febrero 1741 ... Maria Hilaria, india originaria de el Pueblo
de San Joseph hija legitima de Usevio Lopez y Ygnes de Arambula,
vecinos de dicho pueblo, fueron sus padrinos Joseph Delgado y Maria
Niño

image filename 4340118_347.jpg

En la Hazienda de Santiago feligresia de la Villa de Aguascalientes en
dies y nuebe de febrero 1741 ... Joseph Guadalupe, originario
de el Pueblo de San Joseph, hijo legitimo de Christobal de Santa Ana y
Maria Rodrigues, vecinos de dicho pueblo, fueron sus padrinos Joseph
Castañeda y Maria de los Dolores

En la Hazienda de Santiago feligresia de la Villa de Aguascalientes en
beinte de febrero 1741 ... Joseph Cornelio, indio originario de el
Pueblo de San Joseph hijo legitimo de Ramon Gusmas y Manuela Josepha,
vecinos de dicho pueblo, fueron sus padrinos Juan de Lizaldi y Dominga
Hernandes

En la Hazienda de Santiago feligresia de la Villa de Aguascalientes en
beinte y seis de febrero 1741 ... Maria Getrudis Guadalupe, india
originaria en el Pueblo de San Joseph hija legitima de Man___
Francisco y Maria Getrudis, besinos de dicho pueblo, fueron sus
padrinos Gregorio Bonifasio y Ana Belasques

En la Hazienda de Santiago feligresia de la Villa de Aguascalientes en
beinte y seis de febrero 1741 ... Maria Gertrudes, india del Pueblo de
San Joseph hija de padres no conocidos, fue su padrino Ygnacio de
Santiago

*En la Hazienda de Santiago feligrecia de la Villa de Aguascalientes
en seis de Marzo 1741 ... Joseph Manuel, indio originario de el Pueblo
de San Joseph hijo legitimo de Jasinto Trinidad y Maria Francisca,
vecinos de dicho pueblo, fueron sus padrinos Pablo Casimiro y Ana
Maria

image filename 4340118_348.jpg

En la Hazienda de Santiago feligresia de la Villa de Aguascalientes en
treinta de Abril 1741 ... Maria Agustina, india orinaria de dicha
hazienda hija legitima de Tho___ Martin y Catarina Lucia, indios
sirvientes en la expresada hazienda, fueron sus padrinos Juan Augustin
y Maria Antonia

+En la Hazienda de Santiago feligresia de la Villa de Aguascalientes
en treinta de Abril 1741 ... Maria Thorivia, india originaria de dicha
hazienda hija legitima de Francisco Xavier y Nicolasa de los Reyes,
indios sirvientes en dicha hazienda, fueron sus padrinos Favian
Sebastian y Ana de la Cruz

En la Hazienda de Santiago feligresia de la Villa de Aguascalientes en
treinta de Abril 1741 ... Joseph , indio hijo ilegitimo
originario de dicha hazienda, fueron sus padrinos Joseph Cruz y Maria
Antonia

*En la Hazienda de Santiago feligresia de la Villa de Aguascalientes
en dose de Agosto 1741 ... Christobal Santiago, indio originario de la
dicha hazienda hijo legitimo de Juan Antonio Martin y Pasquala de los
Reyes, indios sirvientes de dicha hazienda, fueron sus padrinos
Christobal de de Cruz y Maria de la Cruz

*En la Hazienda de Santiago feligresia de la Villa de Aguascalientes
en ocho de Oct 1741 ... Maria de la Merced, india a los quinse dias de
nacida originaria de el Pueblo de San Joseph hija legitima de Marcos
Antonio y Maria Lopez, vesinos de dicho pueblo, fueron sus padrinos
Joseph Chiquito y Juana Bentura

image filename 4340118_349.jpg

*En la Hazienda de Santiago feligresia de la Villa de Aguascalientes
en ocho de Oct 1741 ... Maria Micaela a los onse dias de nacida
originaria de dicha hazienda hija legitima de Juan Antonio Martin y
Pasquala de la Cruz, sirvientes en dicha hazienda, fueron sus padrinos
Domingo de Rosas y Maria Manuela

(Handwriting changes: prior records are signed by Manuel Colon de
Larreátiqui and Joseph Xaviera Thello de Lomas; the following by
Manuel Colon de Larreátiqui and Andrés Cayetano de Medina)

En la Hazienda de Santiago feligresia de la Villa de Aguascalientes en
sinco de Nob 1741 ... Maria Josepha Rafela a los trese dias de nacida,
mulata originaria de la Labor de Garabato hija legitima de Xrisptobal
de los Santos y de Maria Manuela, becinos en dicha labor, fueron sus
padrinos Joseph Santiago y Maria D(olores?)

En la Hazienda de Santiago feligrecia de la Villa de Aguascalientes en
(dose) de Nob 1741 ... bautisé y puse oleo y chrisma á Severino
Victorio a los sinco dias de nacido originario del Pueblo de
Teocaltichi del Barrio de San Po y nacido en esta dicha hazienda, hijo
legitimo de Antonio de Salas y Pasquala de la Cruz, fueron sus
padrinos Joseph Maria y Maria Thereza.

En la Hazienda de Santiago felegrecia de la Villa de Aguascalientes en
dose de Nob 1741 ... Ju.n de los Santos a los onse dias de nacido
originario de la Labor de Garabato yndio hijo legitimo de Ju.n Manuel
y Juana de la Rosa, fueron sus padrinos Joachin Caldera y Gertrudis
Garcia

*En el Pueblo de Señor San Joseph de Gracia feligrecia de la Villa de
Aguascalientes en catorse del mes de Nob.e 1741 ... Bernardo, de 4
dias de nacidos originario de la Hazienda de Paredes yndio hijo
lexitimo de Antonio Hernandes y Anna Basques, fueron sus padrinos
Faustino Gonzales y Juana Sipriana

{see also Mexico Aguascalientes Catholic Church Records, Matrimonios de San
José de Gracia, Libro 1, 1769-1783 image 4342320_007.jpg: "En el
Pueblo de Señor San Joseph de Gracia en veinte y tres de Mayo 1769 ...
Ygnacio Bernardo Hernandes, yndio originario de esta jurisdición en la
Hazienda de Paredes, hijo legitimo de Antonio Hernandes, difunto, y de
Maria Vasques; con Maria Francisca Rodrigues, yndia originaria de la
Villa de Aguascalientes y vesina de esta jurisdición en la Hazienda de
Paredes de dos años y medio, hija legitima de Joseph Antonio
Rodrigues, difunto, y de Maria Bernarda Ximenes, (se amonesto en dicha
Villa) a quienes dí las Bendiciones Nupciales, fueron sus padrinos
Joseph Nicolas Hernandes y Maria Leonisia, y testigos Joseph Castañeda
y Atanacio de Luna"}

*En el Pueblo de Señor San Joseph de Gracia feligrecia de la Villa de
Aguascalientes en dies y ocho del mes de Nob 1741 ... Anselmo, de dos
dias de nacido originario de dicho pueblo yndio hijo lexitimo de Juan
Lucas y P(etra) Maria, fueron sus padrinos Pablo Casimiro y Anna Maria
{Note: May be Juan Lucas de la Cruz, son of Domingo de la Cruz and
Micaela or Melchora de Villagrana}

image filename 4340118_350.jpg

*En la Hazienda de Santiago feligrecia de la Villa de Aguascalientes
en veinty___ de Dic 1741 ... Joseph Antonio, de onse dias de nacido
originario de dicha hazienda hijo legitimo de Juan Hernandes y Maria
de __ Trenidad, indios, fueron su padrinos Po Basques y Maria Thereza
Basques

En la Hazienda de Santiago feligrecia de la Villa de Aguascalientes en
ocho de (Dic) 1741 ... Joseph Matheo, de ___ meses y veinte y tres
dias originario de el Puesto del Potrero hijo lexitimo de Antonio
Lopes y Maria de Medina, españoles, fue su madrina Juliana de
Contreras

*En la Hazienda de Santiago feligrecia de la Villa de Aguascalientes
en veinte y quatro de Dic 1741 ... Maria Guadalupe, onse dias de
nacida originaria de dicha hazienda hija legitima de Ygnacio Rod______
y Maria de la Cruz, fueron sus padrinos Manuel de (Zn)ora y Juliana
Rodrigues

*En la Hazienda de Santiago feligrecia de la Villa de Aguascalientes
en veinte y ocho dias del mes de Dic 1741 ... Maria Eusebia, de trese
dias de nacida originaria de dicha hazienda hija lexitima de Sebastian
Ysidro y Maria Antonia, indios, fueron sus padrinos Thomas Martin y
Catharina Augustina

En la Hazienda de Santiago feligrecia de la Villa de Aguascalientes en
siete de henero 1742 ... Maria Thomasa, de nuebe dias de nasida
originaria de el Pueblo de Señor San Joseph de Gracia hija lexitima de
Josep Hernandes y Margarita Domingues, fueron sus padrinos Esteban
Domingues y Juana de Aguallo, yndios

My first ancestor to stop using Ruiz de Esparza was known as Rafaela
Esparza at the time of her 2nd marriage (January 30, 1782). Her father,
Felipe-Toribio Ruiz-de-Esparza did use the compound surname. Maybe
they were preparing for Mexico's Independence when it would not have
been a good time to be connected to the Mother country, Spain. My Gomez
ancestor, Vicente Ferrer Gomez (his brother Agustin continued using the
compound name) had also dropped the Gomez de Mendoza when he married in
April 21, 1766 in the Jalostotitlan/San Juan de los Lagos area of
Jalisco.
What types of surname changes of others experienced?

Irma Gomez Gtz
N. California

En la Hazienda de Santiago feligresia de la Villa de Aguascalientes en
treinta y uno de Henero 1740 ... Maria Antonia, india originaria de el
Pueblo de San Joseph hija de padres no conocidos, fueron sus padrinos
Simon Benites y Juana de Lara, á quienes advertí su obligación y
parentesco espiritual, y lo firme con dicho Señor Cura

This record is very typical for children of unknown parents, and the
padrinos named here happen to be my wife's direct-line ancestors. I
wonder what the relationship was between Antonia and her godparents,
when there are no other parents known. Did the godparents assume
responsibility for raising the child? Did they merely fine her a home?
Did they do little or nothing but allow their names to be written
down? Just how seriously did godparents take "su obligación y
parentesco espiritual"?

--
Best regards,
Stuart mailto:stuartarms@gmail.com

Hi Rob--

I have some Arguelles from Huejucar in my database. Do you have some names and dates?

Rosalinda

____________________________________________________________________

I'M looking for the Arguelles family line from Huejucar, Jalisco.

Thanks,

Rob Cesena

I'M looking for the Arguelles family line from Huejucar, Jalisco.

Thanks,

Rob Cesena

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Date: Sun, 21 Jun 2009 22:08:10 -0700 (PDT)
From: alvaradj@comcast.net
Subject: [Nuestros Ranchos] Francisco Munos de Nava
To: research@lists.nuestrosranchos.org
Message-ID:

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I got Francisco Munos de Nava married to Maria Gonzalez as the parents
of two brothers (Juan Lopez and Andres Munos de Nava) who respectively
married two sisters (Luisa Marques and Luisa de Tiscareno) daughters of
Luis Tiscareno de Molina and Lorenza Ruiz de Esparza. Juan and Luisa
Marques married first, August 30, 1650 in Aguascalientes, followed by
Andres and Luisa, who were married on Sept 3, 1652. Juan and Luisa were
the godparents of Andres and Luisa.
I also have Luisa de Nava, daughter of Francisco Munos de Nava and Maria
Sanchez, who married Diego Alonso Gonzales de Hermosillo February 25,
1645, in Teocaltiche, Jalisco.
I got a few questions: Is Francisco Munos de Nava one and the same? If
yes, is Maria Gonzalez and Maria Sanches the same person? Finally, does
anyone has additional ancestral information on the Munos de Nava,
Sanchez and Gonzalez lines I mentioned?

Thanks

Jaime Alvarado

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Message: 2
Date: Mon, 22 Jun 2009 09:06:25 -0700
From: "Angelina Markle"
Subject: Re: [Nuestros Ranchos] Francisco Munos de Nava
To:
Message-ID:
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"

Hello Jaime,

I found in "Somos Primos" Sept 2006 (I believe) an article (Descendants
of
don Diego Alonso Ramirez de Pedroza) by John Inclan that states that
Juan
Munos de Nava was married to Elvira Tiscareno. Then according to
familysearch batch #7516203 sheet 40 Source call #0884527 - she was also
daughter of Luis Ticareno de Molina and Lorenza Ruiz de Esparza. I don't
have any parents for this Juan Munos de Nava .... Could this have been a
third brother that married a third sister? Or could Elvira be one of
your
Luisas? I believe John Inclan is part of this group, perhaps he can shed
light on this mystery.

-Angelina-

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Message: 3
Date: Mon, 22 Jun 2009 09:40:58 -0700
From: "Angelina Markle"
Subject: Re: [Nuestros Ranchos] Francisco Munos de Nava
To:
Message-ID: <289AC5C836FF4394AAA5327D838689C7@ariel>
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"

Hello Jaime,

In reference to your question "...is Maria Gonzalez and Maria Sanchez
the
same person?" Take a look at familysearch batch #F867689 sheet 042
Source
call #1396252 .... It shows Andres Munoz de Nava as son of Francisco
Munoz
de Nava and Maria Sanchez .... Then Maria Sanchez as being the daughter
of
Pedro de Huerta AND Maria Gonzales de Ruvalcaba!

Therefore it is quite possible that Maria Sanchez and Maria Gonzales are
the
same person ... Of course without seeing the actual documentation it is
just
conjecture, but it does seem plausible.

-Angelina-

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Hello research,

Does originario always mean birthplace?
I have run across a record that seems to say a child was "originario
de" one place and "nacido en" another place.

En la Hazienda de Santiago feligrecia de la Villa de Aguascalientes en
dose de Nob 1741 ... bautisé y puse oleo y chrisma á Severino Victorio
a los sinco dias de nacido originario del Pueblo de Teocaltichi del
Barrio de San Po y nacido en esta dicha hazienda, hijo legitimo de
Antonio de Salas y Pasquala de la Cruz, fueron sus padrinos Joseph
Maria y Maria Thereza

Does this suggest that the child's family lived in San Pablo
Teocaltiche but he was actually born and christened in Santiago?
--
Best regards,
Stuart mailto:stuartarms@gmail.com