Nuestros Ranchos Site

Yolanda,

You can find "oodles" on Ciudad Guzman through a Wikipedia (spanish) search
at http://es.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ciudad_Guzm%C3%A1n
This site has a variety of informative links, and you can also obtain
further informationby making, within wikipedia, a Google search for Ciudad
Guzman.

Happy surfing,

Efrain
San Diego, California

> [Original Message]
> From: yotomas
> To:
> Date: 5/11/2007 9:07:12 AM
> Subject: [Nuestros Ranchos] historical info on Cd. Guzman, Jalisco
>
>
> good morning,
> can anyone direct me to information on the town of Cd. Guzman, Jalisco in
regards to Church establishment, political changes, historical acitivities,
famous people, all this during the era of 1600-1900
>
> thank you,
>
> Yolanda

great. can you scan some of the arrowheads and other things you've
found. Would love to see them.

joseph

====================

Joseph Puentes
http://H2Opodcast.com (Environment Podcast)
http://H2Opodcast.blogspot.com/ (Blog for above)
http://NuestraFamiliaUnida.com (Latin American History Podcast)

Lester Alvarado wrote:
> Hi Mickey ,
>
> Nice to read you again ! I've got a question for you , there are a couple of folks here that are interested in any books that are for sale . Books that are of use to the folks from here .
> Apart from that how are you and what have you been up to . I've been doing some fossil hunting and was luck enough to find some indian arrow heads and a fantastic place that has lots and lots of indian paintings in very good condition.
>
> Take care,
> Welester
>
>
>
>
>> To: general@nuestrosranchos.org> Date: Thu, 10 May 2007 00:47:26 -0400> From: mmg8938@aol.com> Subject: Re: [Nuestros Ranchos] Hillerkuss Diccionario Biografico del Occidente Novohispano> > General> For anyone doing genealogy in the area....this book is a must!!! I have recently paid $80.00 just for the 3rd copy here in Texas! The books are 81/2 by 11....and the last copy has 496 pages. They are soft covered and worth every penny!!> If I did not have them...I would be purchasing them now!!> > Mickey> > > > > -----Original Message-----> From: arturo.ramos2@gmail.com> To: general@lists.nuestrosranchos.org> Sent: Wed, 9 May 2007 9:36 PM> Subject: [Nuestros Ranchos] Hillerkuss Diccionario Biografico del Occidente Novohispano> > > > I do not have copies of the books but have seen excerpts of the electronic > version of the first volume, thus the entry I have for Pedro de Bobadilla in the > GEDCOM database based on the book.> > The books are only in Spanish and as far as I know they are no translations into > English. The books are basically volumes of a dictionary that instead of having > word definitions have names and short biographies. I think you will get a > pretty good idea of what the entries look like by looking at Pedro de Bobadilla > in the GEDCOM database as that is the basic format and length of the entries.> > I don't think they have a table of contents, just as word dictionaries do not... > i.e. there are no chapters and the names are listed alphabetically thus negating > the needs for a table of contents or an index.> > If you would like more info on the logistics of ordering a set, please contact > me personally through the web contact form on the Nuestros Ranchos site.> -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- > Nuestros Ranchos General Mailing List> > To post, send email to:> general(at)nuestrosranchos.org> > To change your subscription, log on to:> http://www.nuestrosranchos.org> ________________________________________________________________________> AOL now offers free email to everyone. Find out more about what's free from AOL at AOL.com.> -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- > Nuestros Ranchos General Mailing List> > To post, send email to:> general(at)nuestrosranchos.org> > To change your subscription, log on to:> http://www.nuestrosranchos.org
>>
> _________________________________________________________________
> Change is good. See what’s different about Windows Live Hotmail.
> www.windowslive-hotmail.com/learnmore/default.html?locale=en-us&ocid=TX…

Sure !

Welester

> Date: Thu, 10 May 2007 17:13:18 -0500> From: makas@nc.rr.com> To: general@nuestrosranchos.org> Subject: [Nuestros Ranchos] Fossils: Was- Books and Howdy ! Mickey> > great. can you scan some of the arrowheads and other things you've > found. Would love to see them.> > joseph> > ====================> > Joseph Puentes> http://H2Opodcast.com (Environment Podcast)> http://H2Opodcast.blogspot.com/ (Blog for above)> http://NuestraFamiliaUnida.com (Latin American History Podcast)> > > > Lester Alvarado wrote:> > Hi Mickey ,> > > > Nice to read you again ! I've got a question for you , there are a couple of folks here that are interested in any books that are for sale . Books that are of use to the folks from here .> > Apart from that how are you and what have you been up to . I've been doing some fossil hunting and was luck enough to find some indian arrow heads and a fantastic place that has lots and lots of indian paintings in very good condition.> > > > Take care,> > Welester> >> >> >> > > >> To: general@nuestrosranchos.org> Date: Thu, 10 May 2007 00:47:26 -0400> From: mmg8938@aol.com> Subject: Re: [Nuestros Ranchos] Hillerkuss Diccionario Biografico del Occidente Novohispano> > General> For anyone doing genealogy in the area....this book is a must!!! I have recently paid $80.00 just for the 3rd copy here in Texas! The books are 81/2 by 11....and the last copy has 496 pages. They are soft covered and worth every penny!!> If I did not have them...I would be purchasing them now!!> > Mickey> > > > > -----Original Message-----> From: arturo.ramos2@gmail.com> To: general@lists.nuestrosranchos.org> Sent: Wed, 9 May 2007 9:36 PM> Subject: [Nuestros Ranchos] Hillerkuss Diccionario Biografico del Occidente Novohispano> > > > I do not have copies of the books but have seen excerpts of the electronic > version of the first volume, thus the entry I have for Pedro de Bobadilla in the > GEDCOM database based on the book.> > The books are only in Spanish and as far as I know they are no translations into > English. The books are basically volumes of a dictionary that instead of having > word definitions have names and short biographies. I think you will get a > pretty good idea of what the entries look like by looking at Pedro de Bobadilla > in the GEDCOM database as that is the basic format and length of the entries.> > I don't think they have a table of contents, just as word dictionaries do not... > i.e. there are no chapters and the names are listed alphabetically thus negating > the needs for a table of contents or an index.> > If you would like more info on the logistics of ordering a set, please contact > me personally through the web contact form on the Nuestros Ranchos site.> -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- > Nuestros Ranchos General Mailing List> > To post, send email to:> general(at)nuestrosranchos.org> > To change your subscription, log on to:> http://www.nuestrosranchos.org> ________________________________________________________________________> AOL now offers free email to everyone. Find out more about what's free from AOL at AOL.com.> -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- > Nuestros Ranchos General Mailing List> > To post, send email to:> general(at)nuestrosranchos.org> > To change your subscription, log on to:> http://www.nuestrosranchos.org> >> > > _________________________________________________________________> > Change is good. See what’s different about Windows Live Hotmail.> > www.windowslive-hotmail.com/learnmore/default.html?locale=en-us&ocid=TX…; > -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- > > Nuestros Ranchos General Mailing List> >> > To post, send email to:> > general(at)nuestrosranchos.org> >> > To change your subscription, log on to:> > http://www.nuestrosranchos.org> >> >> > > -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- > Nuestros Ranchos General Mailing List> > To post, send email to:> general(at)nuestrosranchos.org> > To change your subscription, log on to:> http://www.nuestrosranchos.org
_________________________________________________________________
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There are Mendoza families in Spain with different origins. It is true that
one of those families was, and is, one of the most prominent of Spain (that
of the Dukes of the Infantado - the palace in Guadalajara is called "Palacio
de los Duques del Infantado"), Marquis of Santillana and several other
titles. To that family belonged don Antonio de Mendoza, 1st viceroy of New
Spain. I don't recall at this point their connection(s) with the Spanish
royalty (but I'm certain that there are several) and it is true that the
ancestry of the Spanish royal family can be traced back to Pedro, Duke of
Cantabria, who lived in the VI century.

>From: mormonboy74
>Reply-To: research@nuestrosranchos.org
>To: research@lists.nuestrosranchos.org
>Subject: [Nuestros Ranchos] The Mendoza Family in 1500's Mexico
>Date: Wed, 9 May 2007 22:45:44 -0700 (PDT)
>
>
>I heard the Mendoza family comes from a long line of Castilian Nobility is
>this true? There were dukes, counts, lords, princes, etc. They also owned
>the Guadalajara Palace of Mendoza and descend from Fernando I? Is all this
>true. I found websites that have this genealogy for the Mendoza familiy
>going back to 500 A.D.

Thank you Arturo, However, I think some of us will need an English translation (I struggled to read it and am overwhelmed). Some years ago, when I first contacted the webmaster there, he did have an English translation. Is there one for this new system?

Emilie
----- Original Message -----
From: Arturo Ramos
To: research@nuestrosranchos.org
Sent: Tuesday, May 08, 2007 7:03 PM
Subject: [Nuestros Ranchos] New Online System to Replace Archivos Espanolesen Red

MINISTERIO DE CULTURA

La Ministra de Cultura
Se complace en invitarle a la inauguración del programa

PARES
Portal de Archivos Españoles

Estimadas/os amigas/os:

En estos momentos se inaugura la primera fase de desarrollos
informáticos que se corresponden con los módulos de búsqueda y de
descripción, es decir, los referidos a la entrada y a la salida de
datos del sistema.

Los usuarios podrán acceder por dos vías. Directamente, a
través de la dirección > usando cualquier
navegador en Internet, o mediante un enlace en el Área de Archivos,
dentro de la página web del Ministerio de Cultura
(www.mcu.es/archivos/index.html
>).

El Portal de Archivos Españoles es una herramienta destinada
a la difusión de los archivos y a facilitar el trabajo interno de
gestión y descripción. Proporciona a los investigadores y usuarios en
general una serie de funcionalidades que facilitan la localización de
los documentos:

1. Un buscador con dos modalidades, tanto de búsqueda sencilla,
como de búsqueda avanzada o experta, con diferentes tipos del filtro
de la información.

2.El Inventario Dinámico de Contenidos, que ofrece al usuario
información detallada e instantánea sobre qué fondos y colecciones de
cada archivo están difundidas Internet a través del Portal. Se ofrece
también información sobre las novedades que han tenido lugar en los
últimos treinta días.

3. El acceso es libre y gratuito, sin necesidad de códigos de
identificación ni contraseñas.

4. Agenda del Investigador que puede exportarse vía correo
electrónico a la dirección que desee el usuario.

5. El envío telemático de documentos que permite al usuario la
exportación de imágenes digitalizadas de un documento cualquiera vía
correo electrónico.

Además, como Portal Web sirve de plataforma para la difusión
de proyectos archivísticos de interés antes de ser integrados en la
base de datos general, facilitando su consulta a los usuarios. Los
primeros proyectos de esta naturaleza son:

a)Catastro del Marqués de la Ensenada, mediante un buscador en
base de datos que localiza los documento originales digitalizados
para su consulta.

b)Carteles de la Guerra Civil. Una de las principales
colecciones de carteles de esta etapa bélica producidos en ambos
bandos contendientes.

c)Deportados españoles a campos de concentración nazis. Aporta
información sobre más de 8.000 personas que estuvieron presas o
murieron en los campos de Mauthausen o Gusen, fundamentalmente.

Como herramienta de trabajo archivístico, PARES proporciona
un módulo de descripción que permite la elaboración e introducción de
la información documental e imágenes digitalizadas dentro del
sistema. La plataforma es nutrida diariamente con el trabajo de
descripción en red de los profesionales de los archivos, así como con
la carga de sus correspondientes bancos de imágenes digitalizadas,
conforme se van materializando los distintos proyectos en curso.

En una segunda fase, que comienza también en estos momentos
hasta final de año, se perfeccionarán los módulos de la primera, y se
desarrollarán distintas herramientas necesarias para la gestión tanto
de los archivos como la de usuarios, el control y el movimiento de
fondos o la gestión del servicio de reprografía.

Los usuarios que accedan a PARES tienen la opción de
comunicarse constantemente con la administración del sistema para
resolver cualquier necesidad de información que se plantee.

PARES arranca proporcionando a sus usuarios unos 19 millones
de imágenes digitalizadas, que están asociadas a 1,7 millones de
registros descriptivos de los documentos. Para ello, la Subdirección
General de los Archivos Estatales, en 2007 ha llevado a cabo un Plan
de Apoyo para la Descripción Intensiva de los Archivos, con la
finalidad de potenciar el trabajo de descripción de éstos y aumentar
la producción de registros descritos en cada fondo. A finales de
2007, está previsto el aumento de estas cifras a 28 millones de
imágenes, generadas por distintos proyectos de ámbito nacional e
internacional, así como a 2,7 millones de registros.

PARES es una herramienta de gestión e información electrónica
de archivos que se ve favorecida por las ventajas en acceso en red,
que en conjunción con el volumen creciente de datos, propicia y
abunda en la superación de las barreras tradicionales del acceso a
los archivos:

a)Temporales. PARES permite el acceso libre y gratuito desde
cualquier lugar del mundo las veinticuatro horas del día. El usuario
ya no tiene que estar supeditado a los horarios de los centros.

b)Geográficas. El usuario no tienen que desplazarse de su lugar
de residencia habitual, facilitando el ahorro des costes de viajes.

c)Dispersión de la información. PARES permite al usuario obtener,
en un sola operación, información tradicionalmente repartida por
distintos archivos.

Frente a los instrumentos de descripción tradicionales, PARES
actúa como un gran inventario, en el que cada orden de búsqueda por
un criterio subjetivo supone la obtención de un listado de resultados
equivalente a los tradicionales catálogos de una manera más ágil,
rápida y efectiva.

Natalie,

No, your idea is not hare-brained Arturo already has a file called "Poems and Cuentos" that is for poems so far, but I'm sure he could open another file for "Immigrants' Stories". I love to read such stories. It fleshes out for me what the stories of my own immigrant ancestors might have been being that I never knew any but my father and he never talked about his experiences during the Revolution in Mexico and the trip to the US or his early years here.

I was born in Colorado in 1939 and raised in California, so I don't have the family knowledge that some of the other members have. My mother was American/Nuevo Mexican/Tewa and we were immersed in that culture that had existed there for 400 years and they considered my father's relatives "foreign newcomers". They were always talking about their ancestors, and my father never got a word in edgewise, nor did he want to. He would just shake his head and complain later about the archaic Spanish dialect they spoke that had not kept up with modern Castellan as spoken in Mexico. He was always correcting my mother's Spanish and ours, and as a result, I stopped trying to speak Spanish. He didn't allow us make-up or bright colors, either. I think he would have loved to have seen us at home only or wearing black rebozos on our heads when we went out. He was very provincial.

Since Ancestry.com came out with the Border Crossings database, I have found so much to flesh out some of the story of my father's people. In the Border Crossing database, and Historical Newspapers, and Obituaries, and WWI and WWII Registrations I have learned so much about my immigrant ancestors who are all gone now. For instance, I did not know that before settling in Colorado for 25 years, they had first gone to Mogollon, NM or to Glazier TX in the early part of the 20th C. and both of those are now ghost towns. I wonder what they did there, what life was like (pretty rough, I imagine, but with family around, it was bearable).

A really good story about one family's saga of immigration and what drove some people to leave Mexico is a book called, "Rain of Gold" by Victor Villasenor. I also have a book called "Como Viven Los Mexicanos en los Estados Unidos" published privately in Mexico in the 1920s that my husband's aunt gave me almost 50 years ago.

So, it is a good idea, Natalie. I look forward to hearing everyone's stories.

Emilie
Port Orchard, WA---
----- Original Message -----
From: nc_coleman
To: general@lists.nuestrosranchos.org
Sent: Tuesday, May 08, 2007 1:02 PM
Subject: [Nuestros Ranchos] Immigrant stories

Is there a collection of immigration/immigrant stories here on the NUESTROS RANCHOS page/site? (If so, how do I go about finding them?) Stories of how an ancestor or parent migrated to the U.S.; how and when did they travel?; why did they come to the U.S.?; how long did it take?; did they come alone or in a group?; where in the U.S. did they eventually settle?
I think it would be interesting to compare and contrast the immigrant stories. (Or is this just a hare-brained idea??)

Natalie in VA

Bon Voyage, Arturo,

I wish you could help their techs make their Guia more user-friendly. they need someone with your expertise. I can't even bring up the search fields.

Emilie
----- Original Message -----
From: arturoramos
To: research@lists.nuestrosranchos.org
Sent: Sunday, April 29, 2007 1:32 PM
Subject: [Nuestros Ranchos] Visit to Archivo General de la Nacion

Hello fellow Ranchos members...

I will be in Mexico City next Thursday through Sunday and am hoping to spend most of the day Friday at the Archivo General de la Nacion. I cannot promise that I will have time, but if someone has a specific document for which they have exact repository (i.e. collection name, folio number and page number, etc.) that they would like me to look up I will try to do my best.

I hope everybody's research is going well.

I don't know about James I, but I do know that a book I found at the
Benson Rare Book Library (UT Austin), mentioned ties to the Beaumonts.
However, they were never clear as to whether or not there was a
relationship. As far as I understood it, a Lope de Esparza (not sure
which generation) performed some act of heroism or fought next to the
king (Beaumont), and the king in turn rewarded him with a coat of arms
and a casa solar.

I don't know the name of the book off hand, but can check at home.
What is the name of your source?

----- Original Message -----
From: mormonboy74
Date: Monday, May 7, 2007 9:49 pm
Subject: [Nuestros Ranchos] Esparza Genealogy
To: research@lists.nuestrosranchos.org

>
> I found a source that has Lope Ruiz de Esparza lineage going back
> to 1230 to James First of England. Im not sure if its correct or
> not. It said he is descended through the Beumonts near FRance to
> JAmes I. Can anyone asisst me how to know this is a reliable source.

The Beaumonts of Navarre lineage is very well documented and has been
published in several books. I have some information on them and never seen
any connection with Lope Ruiz de Esparza. Plus James I of England lived
around 1600 making impossible that Lope would be his descendant. The
Beaumonts are descendants of St Louis IX of France.

Inaki Garrido, Spanish historian and genealogist, is about to publish a book
on the Beaumonts which may contain Lope if he was connected to them.

Would you kindly let us know which source is that?

Thank you
Hector Felix Aizcorbe

>From: mormonboy74
>Reply-To: research@nuestrosranchos.org
>To: research@lists.nuestrosranchos.org
>Subject: [Nuestros Ranchos] Esparza Genealogy
>Date: Mon, 7 May 2007 20:49:47 -0700 (PDT)
>
>
>I found a source that has Lope Ruiz de Esparza lineage going back to 1230
>to James First of England. Im not sure if its correct or not. It said he is
>descended through the Beumonts near FRance to JAmes I. Can anyone asisst me
>how to know this is a reliable source.

Excuse the following US expression which captures my enthusiasm as I read your AGN experience in Mecca, aka Mexico City.

YOU DA' MAN!!!!

Edward Serros

Leticia, thank you for sharing your very emotional journey. I do know how you feel since I went to my grandfathers homestead in Jerez Zacatecas in 2003 and found what you did, family I didn't know but saw myself in.. what a wonderful feeling.

Linda in Everett

Marionicia wrote:

I made a trip to my ancestor´s town. I claim it to be very fortunated because is the result of a bunch of diggins. I did found a hidden treasure: the getting a hug from my mother´s side of long time absence. This means, my fellows group, I just met two of my mother´s siblings and a bunch of cousins.
My mother was raised by a relative or friend of the family (her mother died from giving birth) and added to that her father never had an affective relation with she, so me and my cousins, nor one in the family, had any affective relation with them, not even close. This spring took iniciative and went to seek for them. It was a great treat, came bach happy to the full, I still can´t put it in the right words. I invite you to look in my just added album.

You can respond and send me Susana's e-mail address at

autlandelagrana@myfamily.com

Sylvia H Corona

plug her name into the search window and send her an email throught the
website

joseph

====================

Joseph Puentes
http://H2Opodcast.com (Environment Podcast)
http://H2Opodcast.blogspot.com/ (Blog for above)
http://NuestraFamiliaUnida.com (Latin American History Podcast)

Sylvia Corona/Rcac wrote:
> I will like to connect with Susana Leniski RE: Carlos de Godoy from
> Zacatecas.
> Any one can connect me with her?
> Thank you
>
> Sylvia H Corona

Yolanda, have you posted your family file yet? I did not see it but I don't know your surname. Do you have any dates or approximate dates and names for your oldest ancestors?
Linda in Everett

yotomas wrote:

I'm chuckling,
cuz i should have said in the previous email, i should have said ancestors or acendants to a wonderful
family line

Anyway, here is more:

Maria Dominguez de Loyola, my maternal grandmother, born and raised in Cd Guzman, her mother,
Felipa Maria Garcia- Lopez de Dominguez, had 4 sisters according to the IGI
they are:

MARIA TEODORA GARCIA LOPEZ

MA. MARTA DE JESUS GARCIA LOPEZ

MA. VICTORIA DE LA TRINIDAD GARCIA LOPEZ

MA. DARIA GARCIA LOPEZ

I don't have any additional information other than they "might" be my great-grandma's sisters in
Cd. Guzman

any information would be wonderful!
thank you Yolanda

---------------------------------
Ahhh...imagining that irresistible "new car" smell?
Check outnew cars at Yahoo! Autos.

Hi, is this your family?
Results for: Jalisco, Mexico
Father: Guadalupe Garcia, Mother: Juana Lopez
Exact Spelling: Off
[refine search]
Prepare selected records for download [input] [input] International Genealogical Index / Mexico - 8 Select records to download - (50 maximum) [input] 1. MARIA TEODORA GARCIA LOPEZ - International Genealogical Index
Gender: Female Christening: 21 OCT 1866 Zapotlan El Grande, Ciudad Guzman, Jalisco, Mexico
[input] 2. MA. MARTA DE JESUS GARCIA LOPEZ - International Genealogical Index
Gender: Female Christening: 06 AUG 1871 Zapotlan El Grande, Ciudad Guzman, Jalisco, Mexico
[input] 3. MA. VICTORIA DE LA TRINIDAD GARCIA LOPEZ - International Genealogical Index
Gender: Female Christening: 26 DEC 1852 Zapotlan El Grande, Ciudad Guzman, Jalisco, Mexico
[input] 4. MA. DARIA GARCIA LOPEZ - International Genealogical Index
Gender: Female Christening: 26 OCT 1857 Zapotlan El Grande, Ciudad Guzman, Jalisco, Mexico
[input] 5. PABLO DE JESUS GARCIA LOPEZ - International Genealogical Index
Gender: Male Christening: 08 JUN 1850 Zapotlan El Grande, Ciudad Guzman, Jalisco, Mexico
[input] 6. JOSE ZEFRRINO DE JESUS GARCIA LOPEZ - International Genealogical Index
Gender: Male Christening: 31 AUG 1874 Zapotlan El Grande, Ciudad Guzman, Jalisco, Mexico
[input] 7. JOSE TORIBIO DE JESUS GARCIA LOPEZ - International Genealogical Index
Gender: Male Christening: 20 APR 1848 Zapotlan El Grande, Ciudad Guzman, Jalisco, Mexico
[input] 8. JOSE SECUNDINO GARCIA LOPEZ - International Genealogical Index
Gender: Male Christening: 06 JUL 1855 Zapotlan El Grande, Ciudad Guzman, Jalisco, Mexico
prev | next Prepare selected records for download

yotomas wrote:

good morning,

Here's the data:

Maria Dominguez de Loyola (my maternal grandmother- born & raised in Cd. Guzman)
sblings:

Paula Domiguez-Garcia de Nazoirin (sp?)
Francesca/ Francisca (Tia Pachita) Dominguez-Garcia
Emeteria Domiguez-Garcia

thier parents:
Felipa Maria Garcia- Lopez de Dominguez
Jose Dominguez (spanaird ?)
according to the IGI, they were married in Cd. Guzman May 1878

her parents:
Jose Guadalupe Garcia
Juana Lopez-Sanchez
(this information is uncofirmed, found in the family search)

Juana's parents:
Jose Nicolas Lopez
Juana Maria Sanchez

any assistance or advise will be appreciated

Yolanda

Corrine:

Congratulations and thank you for sharing that information with the group.

Your message brought up something interesting that I found when looking at civil records. Up until recently I had stuck to church records since they are pretty complete and very good for the most part in the region on which I am focused (Colotlan, Tlaltenango and Totatiche).

However, the church records for Villa Guerrero, a new parrish founded around 1920 are not filmed (and I am told were destroyed in the Cristero War). So I went to look at the civil records (which survived since they were copied and sent off to Guadalajara--as is customary for civil records).

I found in those records that many of my ancestors are described as indigenas, even when the church records describe their ancestors as mestizos or espanoles. I had thought that after independence they had done away completely with the caste system and as such there would be no more race information in the records, which is the case with church records for the most part...

However, my find and your information confirms that they continued to keep this information in the civil records. I wonder if they generically refered to everyone as mestizo mexicano as a way of affirmatively erasing the previous caste designations? I wonder why they would designate my ancestors as indigenas if that were the case, unless perhaps as part of the Revolution ideology that was considered a good thing.

Maureen,

It's been my understanding that this means the person was indigenous
and did farmwork - as in "labor" which means farmwork and "laborio"
being the adjective form. I realize that you noted the script uses
a 'v' rather than a 'b', but these letters have been quite
interchangeable in most records.

To my knowledge, it did not have anything to do with the name of a
tribe.

Hope this is helpful.

Connie Dominguez

----- Original Message -----
From: Maureen Bejar
Date: Wednesday, May 2, 2007 3:33 pm
Subject: [Nuestros Ranchos] Ignacio Alviso race description in marriage
document
To: research@lists.nuestrosranchos.org

>
> Hoping someone might be able to help with the script in this
> document. I feel as if it is like Ojo de Agua
> revisited! The below link is the document that I am pretty sure
> is the marriage document for the great grandparents of Julian
> Alviso. It is the top document, the marriage of Jose Ignacio
> Albiso and Juana Maria Gonzalez. Ignacio's race is described as
> Indio, but there is another word after Indio. I suspect it is
> either Savorio or Lavorio, but I am not sure. I am sorry but, I
> do not have the complete film, so I cannot provide other records
> for comparison. Could it possibly be the Indian tribe? Does
> anyone recognize the script or have a clue what this would mean?
> Thanks for any help!
>
>
>
>
> http://www.nuestrosranchos.org/node/15952

David,
According to documents I've seen, this is true. He is said to have
been Lord of the palaces of Esparza and Zariquiegui in Navarra.
Somehow, I can't remember without my notes, his father/grandfather was
also supposed to be allied with or close to the Beaumonts of Navarra.

I have info on this family only as far as his grandparents, I believe,
in the late 1490s. It's what's been available from Jaime Holcombe's
submissions to LDS.

I visited the Archbishop's research office in Pamplona in 2003, but
the time allotted is so minimal that you really have to visit for a
few days straight to really find anything. I did find one of the
parishes his family visited, but I did not find anything concrete on
him or close family.

Hope this helps...or at least piques your interest a bit more. :-)

Connie Dominguez
----- Original Message -----
From: mormonboy74
Date: Wednesday, May 2, 2007 9:10 am
Subject: [Nuestros Ranchos] Lord of Esparza (Senor de Esparza)
To: research@lists.nuestrosranchos.org

>
> Does anyone know Lope Ruiz de Esparza's genealogy I need help. I
> found a source it said his father or grandfather (too many named
> Lope) Was Lord of Esparza in the city of Esparza they had lived in
> the Palace of the Esparza. Is this true? Any help is appreciated. -
> Daniel Mendez Camino

Thank you Maria. This is incredible. I have traced about nine generations
of this family back to Sevilla, to Nicolas and some of his first cousins.
I plan on buying this book. I just read "The Encomenderos of New Spain
1521-1555" and it had a few good nuggets for me. Please contact me if you think
you can expand your Flores de la Torre branch.
Charles Flores
user176613@aol.com

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