Nuestros Ranchos Site

There are three groups. The research@nuestrosranchos.org group is
specifically for the discussion of genealogy that relates to the Mexican
states of Jalisco, Zacatecas, and/or Aguascalientes.

With regards to who subscribes it can be anyone with roots in Jalisco,
Zacatecas, and/or Aguascalientes that demonstrates they are serious about
their research. Currently the research@nuestrosranchos.org discussion board
shows a membership of 767 individuals.

The general@nuestrosranchos.org group is for discussion of genealogy that
might deviate to some degree from our target states but long and drawn out
discussions away from our focus are discouraged.

The announce@nuestrosranchos.org group is for announcements

Joseph

=========================

Joseph Puentes
Clean@h2opodcast.com
http://h2opodcast.com

> -----Original Message-----
> From: research-bounces@lists.nuestrosranchos.org [mailto:research-
> bounces@lists.nuestrosranchos.org] On Behalf Of Alice Blake
> Sent: Wednesday, September 19, 2012 12:15 AM
> To: research@nuestrosranchos.org
> Subject: [Nuestros Ranchos] email address
>
> Hello group,
> Can anyone tell me what is the purpose of research@lists.nuestrosranchos
and who
> subscribes?
> Thanks so much,   Alice Blake

Thank you linda
Ronnie

> Date: Mon, 17 Sep 2012 17:15:37 -0700
> From: longsjourney@yahoo.com
> To: research@nuestrosranchos.org
> Subject: Re: [Nuestros Ranchos] Aguascalients records
>
> try this
>
> https://www.familysearch.org/search/image/index#uri=https%3A//api.famil…
>
>
> ________________________________
> From: "agutierrez07@sbcglobal.net"
> To: research@lists.nuestrosranchos.org
> Sent: Monday, September 17, 2012 5:14 PM
> Subject: [Nuestros Ranchos] Aguascalients records
>
> I also need to know where I could find birth/baptism records for Aguascalientes.
> Where would we look for them? Thank you for any assistance you can provide.
>

The DNA that is in common between the Spanish and the Irish is R1b Y-DNA. This DNA is the most common throughout Western Europe and not just Ireland and Spain. Rolando tested positive for R1b1a2 shorthand R-M269 which from Wikipedia http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Haplogroup_R1b_%28Y-DNA%29#R1b1a2_.28R-M26… "The frequency is about 71% in Scotland, 70% in Spain and 60% in France. In south-eastern England the frequency of this clade is about 70%; in parts of the rest of north and western England, Spain, Portugal, Wales and Ireland, it is as high as 90%; and in parts of north-western Ireland it reaches 98%. It is also found in North Africa, where its frequency surpasses 10% in some parts of Algeria.[29]

That means a significant number of people from Scotland, Spain, France, England, Portugal, Wales, and Ireland have common ancestry. Based on calculations of mutation rates the common ancestor lived 9,500 years ago. Based on posts by Dienekes at http://dienekes.blogspot.com/ there were people that populated Western Europe about 5,000 years ago that were farming based bronze age warriors. The Y-DNA R1b was most likely among these groups of farming based bronze age warriors. So the common ancestors of all the people in Scotland, Spain, France, England, Portugal, Wales, and Ireland that have R1b1a2 shorthand R-M269 Y-DNA have a common ancestor between 9,500 and 5,000 years ago.

The myths found in a book written in the 11th century cannot explain what science (anthropology, archaeology, and DNA) shows to have happened about 5,000 years ago. That is 3,000 years before the Roman Empire and 2,500 years before the Classical Greek period.

Saludos,
Armando

I was noticing that I may be distantly related to Maria Elena Magallanas that you described from the Census.

This is from information that I have collected from IGI:

Anttonio DE MAGALLANES married Gregoria MIRAMONTES daughter of Juan DE MIRAMONTES and Maria DE AVILA on 14 Jun 1705 in Tlaltenango De Sanchez Roman, Zacatecas, Mexico.

They had the following children:
i. Juan Joseph MAGALLANES MIRAMONTES was christened on 12 Apr 1705 in Tlaltenango De Sanchez Roman, Zacatecas, Mexico.
ii. Hanjelina Figenia MAGALLANES MIRAMONTES was christened on 3 Jun 1708 in Tlaltenango De Sanchez Roman, Zacatecas, Mexico.
iii. Maria Elena MAGALLANES MIRAMONTES was christened on 8 Apr 1711 in Tlaltenango De Sanchez Roman, Zacatecas, Mexico.
iv. Po. Fabio MAGALLANES MIRAMONTES was christened on 8 Sep 1722 in Tlaltenango De Sanchez Roman, Zacatecas, Mexico.
v. Antonio Sipriano MAGALLANES.
Antonio Sipriano married Juana GAETA ALMEDA daughter of Thomas DE GAETA and Maria DE ALMEDA on 15 May 1749 in San Luis, Colotlan, Jalisco, Mexico. Juana was christened on 17 Oct 1729 in San Luis, Colotlan, Jalisco, Mexico.

Maria Elena's father Anttonio De Magallanes had a brother, Joseph De Magallanes, who is my direct ancestor. Here is the information I have for his family.

Joseph DE MAGALLANES married Maria Lucrecia MARIN DE HERRERA on 30 Mar 1705 in Tlaltenango De Sanchez Roman, Zacatecas, Mexico.

They had the following children:
i. Xpttobal MAGALLANES HERRERA was christened on 7 Jun 1705 in Tlaltenango De Sanchez Roman, Zacatecas, Mexico.
ii. Maria Lucrecia MAGALLANES HERRERA was christened on 30 Oct 1707 in Tlaltenango De Sanchez Roman, Zacatecas, Mexico.
Maria Lucrecia married Juan Manuel DE ROBLES. (My 6th great-grandparents!)
iii. Joseph Antonio MAGALLANES HERRERA was christened on 30 Apr 1710 in Tlaltenango De Sanchez Roman, Zacatecas, Mexico.
iv. Francisco Phelis MAGALLANES HERRERA was christened on 24 Sep 1712 in Tlaltenango De Sanchez Roman, Zacatecas, Mexico.
v. Efigenia MAGALLANES HERRERA was christened on 28 Feb 1715 in Tlaltenango De Sanchez Roman, Zacatecas, Mexico.
vi. Santiago Gerbacio MAGALLANES HERRERA was christened on 26 Jul 1722 in Tlaltenango De Sanchez Roman, Zacatecas, Mexico.
vii. Casimiro Guillermo DE MAGALLANES.
Casimiro Guillermo married Juana Getrudis MARTINEZ CORREA daughter of Andres Martines CORREAS and Thomasa GONSALEZ on 3 Feb 1741 in Tlaltenango De Sanchez Roman, Zacatecas, Mexico.
viii. Juan Coronado MAGALLANES.
Juan married Maria Anttonia Margarita RAIGOSA daughter of Marcos DE RAIGOSA and Anna DE SANTIAGO on 31 Jul 1741 in Tlaltenango De Sanchez Roman, Zacatecas, Mexico.

I wonder if Joseph Magallanes' wife, Maria Lucrecia Marin De Herrera is related to the family of Maria Elena Magallanes husband?

Helyn, these are the same Magallanes family that you and I share right?

Arturo, did you happen to see any of the above Magallanes familes listed in the census?

Thanks for the information,
Angie Godina

Espanoles definitely does not mean they were born in Spain. It is simply a caste designation... so they were of the second-highest caste (next to peninsular, which would designate someone born in Spain). When someone is born in Spain, they go out of the way to mention it (as that would make them penisular) and state where in Spain they were born ... something like "natural de Madrid en los Reinos de Castilla"

I am still reading that Tlaltenango Marriage film from the 1600s and will keep my eyes open for any other "Marin de Herrera." Perhaps Luis was a brother of Cayetano?

=====================
From: Latina1955@aol.com
Date: 2006/07/19 Wed PM 01:49:57 CDT
To: research@nuestrosranchos.org
Subject: Re: [Nuestros Ranchos] Marin de Herrera in Tlaltenango

Hi, I've read the film entry of Prudencio Marin de Errera where he married
Nicolaza Paula San Martin Estrada where he married in 1757

It says "no resulto impedimento alguno" and does not mention that he was a
"viudo".

Also, it says he was vecino del rancho de "Ojo dela rana"
It appears he might have been born about 1744

She was from the _________ dela Ena?
His father was Luis Marin Herrera and mother Maria Roza Serrano (both
deceased by 1757)
Her father was Gregorio San Martin Estrada and Maria Elena Magallanas

I am trying to figure out where they all were born??? Although both
Prudencio and Nicolaza are listed as "Espanoles", I truly doubt they were born in
Spain....

The reason I think that Prudencio might have been married several times is
that in batch number C607125, film number 443811 - a grandaughter born in 1817
(Maria Felipa de los Dolores) was born to PRUDENCIO HERRERA and MANUELA
ESTRADA and RODUCINDO DE ROBLES and PAULINA CABALLERO - the father was LUIS
HERRERA and RUFINA ROBLES. Additionally, there was another granchild born in 1825
with the same data: Jose Andres Herrera Robles - same parents.

But then in 1829, once again a grandchild was born Jose Francisco Herrera
Robles to Luis Herrera, and it states that the grandparents were Prudencio
Herrera and Paula Estrada.

Luis Herrera (son of Prudencio) was a widower when he married Rufina de
Robles.

Message from Arturo Ramos arturo.ramos2@...

Though Colotlan is in the State of Jalisco for governmental purposes,
its parrish is part of the Diocese of Zacatecas and geographically it
is basically part of Zacatecas as there is no way in or out of the town
without going through Zacatecas.

As far as all of the other documents that you mention, those are all in
custody of the Spanish Ministry of Culture in Spain, thus Samuel
Sanchez's team that is presently in Zacatecas would not really be able
to film those very easily. Those should become available digitally any
time now via AER. If not, you can order copies of the documents or
films from them. I have done so already and they are very efficient,
if expensive.

Message from Arturo Ramos arturo.ramos2@...

I just got off the phone with Mr. Sanchez and yes, they do have a
filiming team down in Zacatecas now and are simply trying to get the
exact information re: the location and condition of the records that
they might film.

Let us cross our fingers and see if we can make this a reality. It
would be a big boon to our efforts.

If anybody else knows of records other than Colotlan and Jerez in the
region of Zacatecas that are not filmed, please contact Mr. Sanchez and
give him the details ASAP.

Sanchez-Castellanos

Alguien sabe cual es el estatus de los fims que iban a ser digitalizados de la feligresia de Jerez????

Unfilmed genealogical documents and genealogical books

Enviado por Nuestros Ranchos el Jue, 2006-02-23 01:48.

Message from Arturo Ramos arturo.ramos2@...

Here is the correspondence that I have been having with Mr. Sanchez
re: the unfilmed records in Jerez and Colotlan:

Arturo, Ojala que este senor Sanchez nos pueda ayudar con la
filmacion de los registros en Jerez y Colotlan. Voy a estar en Utah
en la biblioteca en Mayo, voy a volver a preguntar acerca del
progreso de nuestra peticion. Me parece que te comente que le escribi
al obispado solicitando permiso para ver los archivos en la
Inmaculada. Desgraciadamente no recibi contestacion. Voy a hablar por
telefono, haber que me dicen. "No hay peor lucha que la que no se
hace". Seguiremos en contacto susana ----- Original Message -----
From: Arturo Ramos To: 'B. Samuel Sanchez G.' Cc:
susyfarias@... Sent: Tuesday, February 07, 2006 10:02 PM
Subject: RE: Recomendacion

Señor Sánchez:

Mi número es +1-202-460-4589 (móvil) o +1-202-429-1515 (oficina). No
sabe canto gusto me da recibir su mensaje, ya que acabo de ir a
México a intentar ver algunos documentos sin éxito. Por favor
díganos como podríamos ayudar para que se filmen estos documentos ya
que son invaluables… son de dos de los asentamientos más antiguos de
la región y contienen información inedita.

En San Luis de Colotlán, Jalisco existen los restos de varios libros
del tiempo del antiguo convento de los franciscanos que datan de
mediados a fines de los 1600s. Yo he visto estas hojas sueltas que
están engargoladas pero no he podido leerlas ya que el cura no lo
permite. El cronista de Totatiche Estaban Valdés Salazar los ha
leído y transcrito una parte menor de ellos.

En la Inmaculada de Jérez, Zacatecas existen varios libros que no
fueron filmados. Estos incluyen la gran parte de las confirmaciones
e información matrimonial de los 1600s. El Señor Leonardo de la
Torre Berumén de quien le escribí anteriormente los ha visto estos
libros y ha trascrito una gran parte. Como la mayoría de los libros
de bautismo se han perdido para esta época, las confirmaciones son
invaluables.

Según el señor de la Torre:

"Tengo lo de Jerez, porque si existe archivo antiguo, hay bautismos
desde 1648 a 1658 y de 1684-1700 y de 1743 hasta hoy. Matrimonios o
màs bien informaciones de matrimonio desde 1664 hasta hoy. Partidas
de matrimonio de 1697, y desde 1712 hasta hoy, y confirmaciones de
1648 hasta hoy."

Según la señorita Susana Leniski, integrante de mi grupo genealógico:

"Recientemente hablé por teléfono con una persona encargada de los
archivos de la iglesia de la Inmaculada en Jerez, Zacatecas. Me
contó que el matrimonio más antiguo que tienen es de 1697 y de
información matrimonial desde 1665. El catálogo de la biblioteca de
LDS comienza con 1712 (faltan 15 años) y en lo de información
matrimonial comienza en 1789 (faltan 124 años). Especuló que cuando
llegaron a filmar, en 1690, pidieron los "libros" de registro y estos
no se filmaron ya que estaban en hojas sueltas."

-----Original Message-----
From: B. Samuel Sanchez G. [mailto:samuelsanchez@...]
Sent: Wednesday, February 08, 2006 12:42 AM
To: arturo_ramos@...
Subject: Re: Recomendacion

enviame mas detalles de los libros que faltan por microfilmar,
enviame tu telefono pues tengo interes en llamarte.

Haz tu Arbol Genealogico ... el Arbol mas Hermoso de la Creacion

Benicio Samuel Sanchez Garcia
Presidente
La Sociedad Genealogica del Norte de Mexico
Rancho San Javier 109
Nueva Aurora
Guadalupe, Nuevo Leon
67190 Mexico

samuelsanchez@...
http://www.genealogia.org.mx
tel:
fax:
(81) 1340-0000
(81) 1340-0000 ext. 117

Alice and "Grup,"

One thing that I did learn today by contacting FamilyTree DNA was that the FamilyFinder Test results are only compared with others that have taken the FamilyFinder Test and not with those that may have been previously YDNA or mtDNA tested.

I have a situation of 5 members of my family linked by a paper trail to a direct line common male ancestor, but their YDNA test results reflect 4 that match (marker and halplogroup)and one that does not, his is a completely different haplogroup...

I'm being told that in order to proceed with trying to establish lineage,(if any) FamilyFinder testing would need to be done for the one that did not match and one (or all) of the 4 that did. Each person would need to be tested using the FamilyFinder test, even though all 5 have been previously YDNA tested by FamilyTree DNA.

I think in my situation, at this time the FamilyFinder test may or may not prove beneficial, plus it's the added expensive for at least two members to be tested that concerns me when they have already been previously YDNA tested...

Pat Silva Corbera

----- Original Message -----
From: "Alice Blake"
To: research@nuestrosranchos.org
Sent: Thursday, September 13, 2012 9:51:31 AM
Subject: [Nuestros Ranchos] DNA

Hello Grupo,
I'm looking into the Familytree DNA testing, specifically the Family Finder for close genealogy and the YDNA 37+mtDNAPlus. I'm not an expert genealogist (not by a long shot) and not knowledgable of indepth DNA testing in general. The choices are very confusing to me and I'm wary of paying for too much information not usable to me. I know I want both maternal and paternal results, including the ancestral makeup percentages info for both. I'd appreciate input from those who have used either one or another of the Familytree DNA products and whether or not you were satisfied with the results or got TMI.
Thanks so much for your help. Alice

Over the past few days I have done a few searches to compare costs. I was
already aware of what FamilyTreeDNA offered. However over the past few
years 23andme has become popular and now National Genographic Geno 2.0
project has started.

You are looking at taking three different tests for all of the info you say
you want. YDNA 37+mtDNAPlus would be two of them for $269.00. Family Finder
(Autosomal SNP) test for $289.00 would be the 3rd to get ancestral makeup
percentages. It won't tell you the which side has the ancestral percentage.
They can only tell you a combined percentage. If you are going to get a
Y-DNA 37 STR maker test you are also going to want a Deep Clade test which
I paid an extra $89 for and $29 for an SNP specific test.

I haven't tested with 23andme but I believe they do the following - a Y-DNA
Deep Clade, Autosomal SNP, and an MT-DNA ancestry test for $299 . They do
not do the Y-DNA 37 STR marker test. They do not have the projects that
FamilytreeDNA does. They will not match people on the 37 marker Y-DNA test
because they don't do that test.

National Genographic Geno 2.0 does Y-DNA Deep Ancestry, MT-DNA, and an
Autosomal SNP test for $199.95. It doesn't do Y-STR testing and it doesn't
do cousin matching in Family Finder Autosomal SNP even though all of the
tests are done by FamilytreeDNA for National Genographic Geno 2.0

Depending on what you want the most and how much you want to spend is going
to determine what you should get. Personally I would place a higher
priority on a $149.00 Y-DNA STR 37 marker test with FamilyTreeDNA and a
$199.95 Deep Clade test with National Genographic Geno 2.0. which would
also give you an MT-DNA ancestry, and an Autosomal SNP test. This comes out
to $348.95. It is more informative than the 23andme test in some aspects
for only $49.95 more.

Regards
Armando

On Thu, Sep 13, 2012 at 11:51 AM, Alice Blake wrote:

> Hello Grupo,
> I'm looking into the Familytree DNA testing, specifically the Family
> Finder for close genealogy and the YDNA 37+mtDNAPlus. I'm not an expert
> genealogist (not by a long shot) and not knowledgable of indepth DNA
> testing in general. The choices are very confusing to me and I'm wary of
> paying for too much information not usable to me. I know I want both
> maternal and paternal results, including the ancestral makeup percentages
> info for both. I'd appreciate input from those who have used either one or
> another of the Familytree DNA products and whether or not you were
> satisfied with the results or got TMI.
> Thanks so much for your help. Alice

Hola,

Me pueden dar mas información acerca de "Luis Moreno Alcala y Mariana Alcala Diaz Infante casados el 26 de febrero de 1658 en lagos de Moreno el hijo de Nicolas Moreno y Mariana Gutierrez y ella hija de Carlos Alcala y Ana Garcia de Lara."

Pregunto porque esa información parece demasiado al matrimonio de Luis Moreno de Ortega con Teresa de Alcalá y Hurtado de Mendoza casados el 25 de junio 1688 en Lagos de Moreno el hijo de Nicolás Moreno de Ortega Villegas y Mariana Gutierrez de Hermosillo y ella hija de Carlos Alcala y Ana Garcia de Lara.
http://www.nuestrosranchos.org/node/19107

Ellos son antepasados del escritor de "Los de Abajo" Mariano Azuela González y de una esposa de un tío primo mio. Luis Moreno de Ortega también es hermano de 11o abuelo mio. Todos parientes del Insurgente Pedro Moreno.

También pregunto porque no encuentro ese matrimonio de 1658 en Lagos en el libro de Mario Gómez Mata.

Armando

Estos son los que pienso yo que son los ascendientes de Juan Antonio Moreno de Ortega Alcalá, padre de Ana Petra Moreno. Tengo mas en Geneanet or si desean un reporte en PDF.

Generación 1
1 Juan Antonio Moreno de Ortega Alcalá. Padres: 2 y/e 3.

Generación 2
2 Luis Moreno de Ortega Alcalá. Padres: 4 y/e 5. ... casado el 16 de junio 1728, Santa María de Los Lagos, Lagos de Moreno, Jalisco, México, con...
3 Mariana de Alcalá, bautizada el 27 de mayo 1711, Santa María de los Lagos, Lagos de Moreno, Jalisco, México. Padres: 6 y/e 7. ...

Generación 3
4 Luis Moreno de Ortega González de Hermosillo, nacido en 1667, Santa María de los Lagos, Lagos de Moreno, Jalisco, México, fallecido. Padres: 8 y/e 9. [Nota 4]. ... casado el 25 de junio 1688, Santa María de Los Lagos, Lagos de Moreno, Jalisco, México, con...
5 Teresa de Alcalá y Hurtado de Mendoza, nacida en 1670, Santa María de los Lagos, Lagos de Moreno, Jalisco, México, fallecida.
Padres: 10 y/e 11.
6 Lucas de Alcalá y Hurtado de Mendoza. Padres: 12 y/e 13. ... casado el 3 de mayo 1706, Santa María de Los Lagos, Lagos de Moreno, Jalisco, México, con...
7 Leonor Díaz Infante de Villegas, bautizada el 2 de marzo 1677, Santa María de los Lagos, Lagos de Moreno, Jalisco, México. Padres: 14 y/e 15. [Nota 7].

Generación 4
8 Nicolás Moreno de Ortega Villegas, nacido alrededor de 1629, Santa María de los Lagos, Lagos de Moreno, Jalisco, México, fallecido el 8 de julio 1701 (a la edad de posiblemente 72 años). [Nota 8]. ... casado con...
9 Juana Mariana González de Hermosillo González Florida, nacida alrededor de 1641, Jalostotitlán, Jalisco, Mexico, fallecida.
10 Carlos de Alcalá y Hurtado de Mendoza. Padres: 12 y/e 13. ... casado el 14 de mayo 1661, Santa María de los Lagos, Lagos de Moreno, Jalisco, México, con...
11 Ana García de Lara, bautizada en 1645, Santa María de los Lagos, Lagos de Moreno, Jalisco, México, fallecida el 17 de abril 1724 (a la edad de posiblemente 79 años).
12 Juan Lucas de Alcalá y Orozco. ... casado con...
13 Juana Aviña y Hurtado de Mendoza, nacida el 28 de enero 1616, Zamora, Michoacán, fallecida.
14 Bartolomé Díaz Infante de Villegas, nacido el 7 de septiembre 1634, San Luis Potosí, San Luis Potosí, México, fallecido. ... casado el 8 de enero 1662, Santa María de Los Lagos, Lagos de Moreno, Jalisco, México, con...
15 María González de Villegas, nacida el 26 de diciembre 1643, Santa María de los Lagos, Lagos de Moreno, Jalisco, México, fallecida el 20 de mayo 1715, Santa María de los Lagos, Lagos de Moreno, Jalisco, México (a la edad de 71 años).

# Generación 5

* 16 - Alonso Moreno de Ortega ca 1605-1647
* 17 - Josefa Villegas Rodas ca 1607-1666
* 18 - Juan González de Hermosillo Muñoz ca 1591-1666
* 19 - Ana González Florida ca 1594-1672
* 20 => 12
* 21 => 13
* 22 - Juan Vázquez Zermeño Lara 1615-1672
* 23 - María Teresa Anda Altamirano y Ruiz de Nava
* 24 - Juan de Alcalá y Zamora
* 25 - Leonor Tovar de Orozco
* 26 - Juan de la Mora Mendoza
* 27 - Francisca Ochoa Garibay
* 28 - Hernando Díaz Infante
* 29 - Ana Espinosa
* 30 - Juan Solano Villegas López de Nava
* 31 - Francisca Velasco 1621

# Generación 6

* 32 - Nicolás Moreno de Ortega
* 33 - ? ?
* 34 - Hernando de Villegas ca 1563
* 35 - Inés López de Nava y López Muñiz ca 1570
* 36 - Juan González de Hermosillo Rodríguez 1572
* 37 - María Muñoz †
* 38 - Francisco Gutiérrez Rubio 1551
* 39 - Ana González Florida 1555
* 44 - Martín Vásquez Zermeño †
* 45 - Ana García de Miranda †
* 46 - Juan de Anda Altamirano y González de Castañeda 1595-1632
* 47 - Juana Ruiz de Nava 1593-1677
* 48 - Juan de Alcalá
* 49 - Isabel de Zamora
* 50 - Juan Lucas de Morcillo
* 51 - Isabel Tovar de Orozco
* 52 - Manuel de la Mora
* 53 - Juana Aviña Hurtado de Mendoza
* 54 - Diego Ochoa Garibay
* 55 - Juana Núñez de Sotomayor
* 56 - Juan Díaz Infante
* 57 - Juliana Victoria
* 60 => 34
* 61 => 35

# Generación 7

* 68 - Francisco Solano Calderón de Villegas 1533
* 69 - Francisca Jiménez Altamirano 1535
* 70 - Juan López de Nava 1535
* 71 - Inés López Muñiz 1555
* 72 - Juan González de Hermosillo
* 73 - Ana Rodríguez de Madaleno
* 76 - Diego González de la Vega 1525
* 77 - María Rubio 1530
* 88 - Juan Vásquez Perea
* 89 - Elvira Gil de Lara
* 90 - Juan de Arrona †
* 91 - Angelica María García †
* 92 - Pedro de Anda Altamirano 1551
* 93 - Beatríz González de Castañeda 1556
* 94 - Alonso Lorenso Guerra 1557-1604
* 95 - María de Nava
* 98 - Antonio de Zamora
* 99 - Francisca de Lozano
* 102 - Pedro Hernández de Aguilera
* 103 - Beatriz de Orozco Tovar
* 108 - Martín de Ochoa y Garibay
* 109 - María de Solís
* 110 - Gonzalo Núñez de Sotomayor 1531
* 111 - Bernardina Hurtado de Mendoza 1533

# Generación 8

* 140 - Juan López de Jimena 1498-1540
* 141 - Francisca Nava 1506
* 178 - Juan Zermeño
* 179 - ? Gil de Lara
* 188 - Francisco Guerra
* 189 - Gertrudis Alba
* 190 => 70
* 191 => 71
* 206 - Diego de Orozco Tovar
* 207 - Ana Mexía

# Generación 9

* 282 - Antonio Nava 1480
* 283 - María López 1483
* 412 - Diego de Burgos Villaseñor y Tovar 1442
* 413 - Guiomar de Orozco y Sandoval 1446

# Generación 10

* 824 - Diego de Villaseñor Tovar 1407
* 825 - Isabel Alfonso Villaseñor
* 826 - Diego de Orozco †
* 827 - Guiomar de Sandoval †

Armando

2010/12/14 C.P. Jose de Jesus Jimenez

> El citio familysearch esta bien, y como te digo yo saque una copia del acta
> matrimonial de vicente hermosillo e ines Martin y ahi no hay pierde ,
> de Ana
> Petra Moreno si saque muchisimo de sus padres se casaron el 30 de julio de
> 1760
> en cienega de mata hijo de luis moreno alcala y Mariana Alcala Diaz Infante
> y
> ella hija de Jose antonio Flores y Maria simona Herrera
>
> luis moreno alcala y Mariana Alcala Diaz Infante casados el 26 de febrero
> de
> 1658 en lagos de Moreno el hijo de nicolas Moreno y Mariana Gutierrez y
> ella
> hija de Carlos Alcala y Ana garcia de Lara
>
>
> Y de lo de Fermina Sanchez no es Hermana de la Esposa de mi pariente Jose
> Silverio Hermosillo Escoto aunque si se casaron el mismo año pero Cruz
> Sanchez
> Aparece como española y es Hija de Maximo Sanchez y Ma Polonia Calvillo
> casados
> el 9 de enero de 1819 en Mecatabasco Zacatecas hoy Tabasco Zacatecas, ella
> nacio en La Chona Jalisco, pero hay trs Hermanos que nacieron en San Miguel
> el
> Alto Jalisco y los abuelos de Cruz Sanchez son Antonio Sanchez y Luz
> Ramirez y
> abuelos maternos Manuel Calvillo y Juana Cortes, pero no he podido avanzar
> de
> esto, quiero conseguir la partida matrimonial para ver de donde era cada
> uno y
> asi buscar mejor
>
> Oie tengo una pariente que tampoque he podido avanzarle mucho se llama
> Toribia
> Sanchez Reynoso nacio en 1836 aproximadamente en paso de jesus San miguel
> el
> Alto hija de MIsidro Sanchez y Maria de los Santos Reynoso, por si sabes
> algo
> ahi te encargo
>
> Mil Gracias y estamos en contacto
>
>
>
> ----- Original Message ----
> From: Ronald Reynoso
> To: research@nuestrosranchos.org
> Sent: Tue, December 14, 2010 2:52:10 PM
> Subject: [Nuestros Ranchos] Hermosillo at: Jesus Jimenez
>
>
> Hola Jesus , estoy loco,lo que dices es cierto , En www.familysearch.orgpuso
> los dos nombres Ynes Martin y Maria Martin con las fechas el 5 de mayo 1726
> .
> Las dos mujeres tienen la misma fecha y lugar de nacimiento . Esta la cosa
> muy
> rara o el sitio de familysearch esta mal. O hablando de los Morenos creo
> que
> son los mismos. que tienes de Ana Petra Moreno ? No se si ayudo los dos
> nombres
> de los padres de Fermina Sanchez( Toribio Sanchez y Maria Nieves) .
> Platicaba mi
> Mama que mi abuelo dijo que Ignacio Hermosillo era un hombre con oyos
> azules y
> su esposa(Fermina sanchez) una India , no hay pruebas.
> Espermos tus pensamientos
> Ronnie(Ronald)

I usually don't consider Don a title, more a style. Usually back then
it was only reserved for the "well known", local elite, church
clergymen, hidalgos or nobles. I think the word hijosdalgo is perfect
hijo de algo "son of something." Someone who was esteemed or
respected in any case.

In your case with your ancestors they owned the Rancho de Madera.
So they belonged to the land-owning class.

I hope this helps a bit.

Daniel Mendez Camino