Colotlan 1785 Census

I have uploaded the first three pages of my section so that you can 
see what the data entry looks like.  It is in the Colotlan folder in 
the files section of this site.

Joseph... if you think we should move this to Ranchos2, please go 
ahead and do so and just let us know.

--- In ranchos@yahoogroups.com, "Arturo Ramos"  
wrote:
>
> Victor, Alicia, Joseph et. al.
> 
> I have created a folder in the files section for Ranchos that has 
> instructions on how to do the transcription of the Colotlan 
Census.  
> It is at the end of member genealogy folders.
> 
> Joseph has volunteered to take pages 90 to 100.  These pages are 
all 
> names.  There are names and text interspersed through about page 
130, 
> so Victor, if you can take pages 101-110 and Alicia, if you can 
take 
> pages 111-120, I will take pages 121-130.
> 
> If there are others interested in doing transcription, the 
remainder 
> of the document is mostly text.  Please write me an email and I 
will 
>

Mexican Border

Ed/Angie:

Whatever the political status of the American Southwest was 
throughout the 1700s and early 1800s, it was if not indigenous in 
identity, certainly Mexican.  Most of the settlers in the area were 
not Spaniards, as a lot of Anglo revisionist historians like to 
purport by glorifying the missions, etc., but Mexicans... Tlaxacaltec 
colonizers in New Mexico, immigrants from Sonora, Chihuahua, 
Aguascalientes, etc... The original founding families of Culver City, 
California, for example were the Talamantes and Avila from 
Aguascalientes... probably related to some people in the group.

The following book is very well researched and provides a whole new 
insight into the attempted "de-Mexicanization" of Los Angeles.  A 
very good read.

Whitewashed Adobe : The Rise of Los Angeles and the Remaking of Its 
Mexican Past
by William Deverell

Review:

Chronicling the rise of Los Angeles through shifting ideas of race 
and ethnicity, William Deverell offers a unique perspective on

Territorial Acquisitions

It still is.

Alberto Duarte Prieto
Santa Maria, Californai

--- Arturo Ramos  wrote:

> Yes Angie, those maps are great.  Emilie, I think
> the reason why the 
> U.S. did not aquire all of Mexico was that the part
> they did not 
> acquire had too many Mexicans living in it.  In
> other words, the 
> xenophobia was greater than the greed.
> 
> --- In ranchos@yahoogroups.com, "Emilie Garcia"
>  
> wrote:
> >
> > Wow, Angie,
> > 
> > You are a great researcher.  I have never seen
> those maps before.  
> Thanks much for the links to those maps.  It really
> helps me to 
> understand the scope of "Manifest Destiny" of the US
> Government.  I'm 
> surprised they didn't "acquire" all of Mexico.
> > 
> > Emilie Garcia
> > Port Orchard, WA ---
> >
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 



		
__________________________________ 
Start your day with Yahoo! - Make it your home page! 
http://www.yahoo.com/r/hs

Territorial Acquisitions

Good links.  

Here's a morphing map from pbs.
http://www.pbs.org/kpbs/theborder/history/morphingmap.html

Are we done?  ;-)


--- In ranchos@yahoogroups.com, "Emilie Garcia" 
wrote:
>
> Wow, Angie,
> 
> You are a great researcher.  I have never seen those maps before. 
Thanks much for the links to those maps.  It really helps me to
understand the scope of "Manifest Destiny" of the US Government.  I'm
surprised they didn't "acquire" all of Mexico.
> 
> Emilie Garcia
> Port Orchard, WA ---
>





Territorial Acquisitions

Yes Angie, those maps are great.  Emilie, I think the reason why the 
U.S. did not aquire all of Mexico was that the part they did not 
acquire had too many Mexicans living in it.  In other words, the 
xenophobia was greater than the greed.

--- In ranchos@yahoogroups.com, "Emilie Garcia"  
wrote:
>
> Wow, Angie,
> 
> You are a great researcher.  I have never seen those maps before.  
Thanks much for the links to those maps.  It really helps me to 
understand the scope of "Manifest Destiny" of the US Government.  I'm 
surprised they didn't "acquire" all of Mexico.
> 
> Emilie Garcia
> Port Orchard, WA ---
>





Territorial Acquisitions

Wow, Angie,

 

You are a great researcher.  I have never seen those maps
before.  Thanks much for the links to those maps.  It really helps me
to understand the scope of "Manifest Destiny" of the US Government.  I'm
surprised they didn't "acquire" all of Mexico.

 

Emilie Garcia

Port Orchard, WA ---

1785


here are a couple more pages. of the 1785
Census.



joseph



ps: Arturo if the format is not correct let me know ASAP



Attachment:
1785ColotlanCensus_P89-91.xls


Description: MS-Excel spreadsheet

1785: New file uploaded to ranchos


1. Enter Archivos Espanoles en Red
  You will need to create an account if you do not yet have one.  Go to
  http://www.aer.es and click on "Alta de Usuario".  Fill in all of the
  required information and when you reach the last fields "usuario" and
  "contrasena" make sure that your username/usuario is no longer than 10
  characters... one of the many arbitrary restrictions of the site.

[[[[[[[[[[[[Arturo its been a long time and from what I remember it was
more challenging that this to get started.

Here is the url that give more details on the Subscribing process:

http://groups.yahoo.com/group/Ranchos2/files/Archivos%20Espanoles%20en%20Red/
http://www.ldelpino.com/aeren.html   ]]]]]]]]]]]]]

2. Log into AER and find document
  Log in using your username and password.  You must click on the "Aceptar"

text under the password field. Simply hitting enter will not work.
Once
logged in mouse over the "busqueda" menu heading on the upper left.
Click

  on the "Busqueda por

Archivos Espanoles en Red


Awhile back I was going to order this film
from the Archivo de Indias: C-7025 in one description it made
reference to a 1773 Census of Colotlan




Archivo

Archivo General de
Indias



Código de Referencia

ES.41091.AGI/16418.17//MP-MEXICO,294



Título

Mapa de la Villa
de Xerez de la Frontera y curatos de su jurisdiccion, situada en 23
grados de Latitud Norte



Alcance y Contenido

Márcase
con lineas de colores el distrito de cada uno de los curatos de la
jurisdiccion de esta Alcaldía, que son Xerez, Colotlan, Monte de
Escovedo y Mesquitic.


Colotlan 1785 Census

Victor, Alicia, Joseph et. al.

I have created a folder in the files section for Ranchos that has 
instructions on how to do the transcription of the Colotlan Census.  
It is at the end of member genealogy folders.

Joseph has volunteered to take pages 90 to 100.  These pages are all 
names.  There are names and text interspersed through about page 130, 
so Victor, if you can take pages 101-110 and Alicia, if you can take 
pages 111-120, I will take pages 121-130.

If there are others interested in doing transcription, the remainder 
of the document is mostly text.  Please write me an email and I will 
assign a piece to you.






--- In ranchos@yahoogroups.com, "Arturo Ramos"  
wrote:
>
> There is a 1785 Census of the Colotlan region that is held at the 
> Archives of Simanca in Spain and has bee digitized.
> 
> I was thinking that perhaps we could get a few volunteers from the 
> group to help transcribe it and then perhaps even publish it.  I 
think 
> it would

Colotlan 1785 Census

Arturo,

Not sure if I can meet your standards but I can give it a try.  Give
me a few pages that nobody is currently working on and what are the
team guidelines we have to follow.  

Victor


--- In ranchos@yahoogroups.com, "Arturo Ramos"  wrote:
>
> There is a 1785 Census of the Colotlan region that is held at the 
> Archives of Simanca in Spain and has bee digitized.
> 
> I was thinking that perhaps we could get a few volunteers from the 
> group to help transcribe it and then perhaps even publish it.  I think 
> it would be very useful for many people in the group and as far as I 
> know, it has not previously been published.
> 
> The document can be found on Archivos Espanoles en Red at:
> 
> ES.47161.AGS/19.8//SGU,7015,2
> 
> Let me know if you are interested in helping out on this project.
>





Records for "No Pagados" and some others.

Wow Elvira, you are just a wealth of information.  It's no wonder, 
though, it sounds like you've been researching for over 25 years.  
Too bad you don't live in the Sacramento, CA area so that you could 
meet with the group of us Rancho members who are getting together 
next month.  We have some really talented and experienced researchers 
attending this first meeting, but you (and several others) would be 
such a great addition. 

Maria

--- In ranchos@yahoogroups.com, "elviraz"  wrote:
>
> Jose Roman:
> 
> 
> What you are suggesting is exactly what I did for the town of San 
Juan de Guadalupe, Durango.  I had been trying to get info from there 
for about  25 years and the priests would not relent.  The registro 
civil was okay but that was it. I found out that the LDS church would 
pay for the microfilming and I started campaigning.  I was fortunate 
to meet the president of the Sociedad Genealogica del Norte de Mexico 
(Benicio Sanchez). I told  him my situation and

1785 I've been there/

Wow Arturo that 1785 Census is so cool! What a discovery. I'm ready to
start my part of the transcription. but I can see we need a plan. I'm
not going to be able to do but sporatic amounts of work, but what
appears to be 300+ pages of which I'm guessing like you said about 150+
pages of the actual Padron



Okay I've talked to Arturo and I'm starting at page 89 at the bottom
and working toward page 100, but would like to see if I can get to page
110 or 120 by the end of Nov or mid Dec



he is what I have so far (p89-90verso/recto)



joseph.


src="jpgicPWaROIwZ.jpg" border="0">

Attachment:
1785ColotlanCensus_P89-100.xls


Description: MS-Excel spreadsheet

CALAVERA POEMS

Hi Yolanda,
Thanks for the confidence, but I'm very limited in the
creativity department.  What a wonderful gift that your suegrita gave her
children.
i



From: ranchos@yahoogroups.com
[mailto:ranchos@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of Yolanda Bobby
Perez
Sent: Tuesday, November 08, 2005 6:29 PM
To:
ranchos@yahoogroups.com
Subject: RE: [ranchos] CALAVERA
POEMS

Gracias Irma,  that was my first
calavera ever.  My husband says that one must be inspired when writing one
and that the person it's about must be your guide.  Mi suegra, que en paz
descanse, wrote one for each of her children and they treasure
them.  Give it a try and you might surprise
yourself.    I did!
Yolanda Medina
Perez
 

Irma GomezLucero
wrote:
Excellent Calavera.  How cool is that. 
Muy bien dicho!
Irma



From: ranchos@yahoogroups.com
[mailto:ranchos@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of Joseph
Puentes
Sent: Saturday, November 05, 2005 12:39 AM
To:
ranchos@yahoogroups.com
Subject

Romero ancestors [ranchos] Re: Digest Number 651

Hello Emilie and Linda,
   
I also have some Romero ancestors:
 
 Antonio Romero who married Maria de Jesus Castellano
in La Barca, Jalisco (Feb. 12,1820)
 
They had the following children:
 
Jose-Ramon  & Dario-de-Jesus  Bap. 12/21/1820
(Tala, Jalisco)  East of Guadalajara.
Ma. Ygancia-del-Refugio Bap. 1832  Union de San
Antonio, Jal.  --Stone's throw from Tepatitlan...
Pablo-Rafael-del-Refugio Bap. 1821 Tamazula del Refugio,
Jal.  --little further...
Joaquin  Bap.1837 Atotonilco, Jal---Stone's throw from
Tepatitlan
Ma.-Guadalupe Romero (My maternal grandmother's Great
Grandmother)
 
 Don't know much else about my Romeros.  It would
be interesting to see who your G Grandfather, Manuel's parents are.  Makes
me wonder though if there's a connection.  Maybe some of the names
above  might tie into yours?  I would be interested if you find
anything after looking at the marriage record that Arturo
mentions.
 
 
Irma


Tlaltenango Census - Miramontes Family





aajay1073 wrote:

Steven,

As an FYI... the Census was posted in the file section

I've deleted it from the file section. . .its only in the links area.



joseph

 and is also 
available in the link section.  As a note, the census doesn't give 
any specific information on families just on landowners/head of 
household.

I too am following the Miramontes Family from Tlaltenango.  Just 
wondering if you want to exchange some info...

Thanks,
Angie


--- In ranchos@yahoogroups.com, "Steven F. Hernández" 
 wrote:
  
I have not checked my email in a very long time, but this email 
    
caught my
  
eye right away.  Lorenzo de Miramontes is my ancestor so I am 
    
interested if
  
it mentions any of his immediate family, as well as the family of 
    
his
  
brothers, sisters, and/or his parents and other children.  

How would you send such a document?  Would it be a computer file or 
    
the
  
actual copy

Mexican Border

Glo,

Here is some information:

Treaty of Guadalupe Hidalgo
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Treaty_of_Guadalupe_Hildalgo

Maps:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Image:National-atlas-territorial-
acquisitions.png
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Image:Territorial-acquisition-uscensus-
bureau.jpg

If the links wrap be sure to recreate in address bar.

- Angie


--- In ranchos@yahoogroups.com, "glo Sandoval-Fuentes" 
 wrote:
>
> I would like to hear further on this because I always thought that 
Mexico 
> did own California too, like till the beginning of the 1900's?
> 
> 
> 
>                ~~glo~~
> 





Mexican Border

I would like to hear further on this because I always thought that Mexico
did own California too, like till the beginning of the 1900's?




              ~~glo~~







From: "Edward Serros" 
Reply-To: ranchos@yahoogroups.com
To: ranchos@yahoogroups.com
Subject: [ranchos] Re: Mexican Border
Date: Wed, 09 Nov 2005 16:32:03 -0000

Angie,

As a point of clarification, the independent country of Mexico owned much of
the
Southwest for only a few decades (1810/1820 time frame to ~1848). Spain
owned the
Southwest for centuries. The only reason I bring this up is that I hear the
statement that
Mexico owned California all the time and I am not sure people remember the
dates well or

fully understand the entities involved.


Ed

--- In ranchos@yahoogroups.com, "aajay1073"  wrote:
>
> Emilie,
>
> Just wanted to comment on what you wrote below...I once heard someone
> with a similar experience as your sister...  There response was "I
> didn't cross the border it

Tlaltenango Census - Miramontes Family

Steven,

As an FYI... the Census was posted in the file section and is also 
available in the link section.  As a note, the census doesn't give 
any specific information on families just on landowners/head of 
household.

I too am following the Miramontes Family from Tlaltenango.  Just 
wondering if you want to exchange some info...

Thanks,
Angie


--- In ranchos@yahoogroups.com, "Steven F. Hernández" 
 wrote:
>
> I have not checked my email in a very long time, but this email 
caught my
> eye right away.  Lorenzo de Miramontes is my ancestor so I am 
interested if
> it mentions any of his immediate family, as well as the family of 
his
> brothers, sisters, and/or his parents and other children.  
> 
> How would you send such a document?  Would it be a computer file or 
the
> actual copy of the original manuscript?  I will pay you good 
moneyyou're
> your trouble.  Please send it to my email address:
> 
> PacoHernandez73@m...
> 
> I now use this address way more than

Mexican Border

Ed,

Sorry...I have a tendecy to simplfy things and generalize...  I fully 
understand what you mean.

Thanks,
Angie

--- In ranchos@yahoogroups.com, "Edward Serros"  wrote:
>
> Angie,
> 
> As a point of clarification, the independent country of Mexico 
owned much of the 
> Southwest for only a few decades (1810/1820 time frame to ~1848). 
Spain owned the 
> Southwest for centuries. The only reason I bring this up is that I 
hear the statement that 
> Mexico owned California all the time and I am not sure people 
remember the dates well or 
> fully understand the entities involved.
> 
> 
> Ed
>




Mexican Border

Angie,

As a point of clarification, the independent country of Mexico owned much of the 
Southwest for only a few decades (1810/1820 time frame to ~1848). Spain owned the 
Southwest for centuries. The only reason I bring this up is that I hear the statement that 
Mexico owned California all the time and I am not sure people remember the dates well or 
fully understand the entities involved.


Ed

--- In ranchos@yahoogroups.com, "aajay1073"  wrote:
>
> Emilie,
> 
> Just wanted to comment on what you wrote below...I once heard someone 
> with a similar experience as your sister...  There response was "I 
> didn't cross the border it crossed me!"
> 
> Here in Southern California...even though almost all the cities and 
> streets are in Español.  People seem to forget that Mexico use to own 
> all of the Southwest States.  And even though the border was moved to 
> its current location, many of the people stayed.
> 
> As for me, I have been able to successfully trace most

Records for "No Pagados" and some others.

Joseph,
 
Count me in.  Let me know when you are
ready.
 
Elvira
----- Original Message -----
Sent: Wednesday, November 09, 2005 12:45
AM
Subject: Re: [ranchos] Records for "No
Pagados" and some others.

Oigalo, Arturo! buen idea Jose Roman!

Arturo if you find
a new source of records in Colotlan and/or Totatiche, let's see if the LDS
library would consider sending a crew. In fact if you let them know ahead of
time that you are making the trip they might give you "tips" on how to prepare
for a "future" microfilming trip. I think this along with your call for
volunteers for the Colotlan Census is something that could very much benefit
future genealogist. you could make a difference!

Along that lines I've
been thinking of making a call for volunteers, but am not ready yet. My
project is the Notario records of Guadalajara. I was thinking that if 25
people volunteered to look at 1 or 2

Records for "No Pagados" and some others.

Jose Roman:
 
 
What you are suggesting is exactly what I did for
the town of San Juan de Guadalupe, Durango.  I had been trying to get info
from there for about  25 years and the priests would not relent.  The
registro civil was okay but that was it. I found out that the LDS church would
pay for the microfilming and I started campaigning.  I was fortunate to
meet the president of the Sociedad Genealogica del Norte de Mexico (Benicio
Sanchez). I told  him my situation and he started campaigning 
with both the San Juan  de Guadalupe and the registro civil  to obtain permission to film the
records. They were filmed about 2 and a half years ago and are now in the LDS
library.  I really wanted them filmed because a big chunk of my family
settled there over 200 years ago. 
 
It took me about five years of campaigning and
educating the priests about what microfilming is and  selling the idea of
preservation. I had to hard sell the fact that the Mormon Church would pay
for

CALAVERA POEMS





Yolanda Bobby Perez wrote:

Gracias Irma,  that was my
first calavera ever.  My husband says that one must be inspired when
writing one and that the person it's about must be your guide.  Mi
suegra, que en paz descanse, wrote one for each of her children and
they treasure them.  Give it a try and you might surprise yourself.   
I did!
Yolanda Medina Perez

no digas mas, me vas hacer llorar! Gracias Yolanda.






Irma GomezLucero wrote:
Excellent Calavera.  How cool is
that. 
Muy bien dicho!
Irma



From:
ranchos@yahoogroups.com [mailto:ranchos@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf
Of
Joseph Puentes

Sent: Saturday, November 05, 2005 12:39 AM

To: ranchos@yahoogroups.com

Subject: Re: [ranchos] CALAVERA POEMS


forgive me. . .I meant to reply the same day but decided to
wait and

then promptly forgot.



wow! you make me feel like a god. . .how many can say they've had poety


written for them. I'm sure

Records for "No Pagados" and some others.

Oigalo, Arturo! buen idea Jose Roman!



Arturo if you find a new source of records in Colotlan and/or
Totatiche, let's see if the LDS library would consider sending a crew.
In fact if you let them know ahead of time that you are making the trip
they might give you "tips" on how to prepare for a "future"
microfilming trip. I think this along with your call for volunteers for
the Colotlan Census is something that could very much benefit future
genealogist. you could make a difference!



Along that lines I've been thinking of making a call for volunteers,
but am not ready yet. My project is the Notario records of Guadalajara.
I was thinking that if 25 people volunteered to look at 1 or 2 films a
year that we could start giving the Nortario records a much better
index than is currently available. There is real "gold" in those
records for many and possibly for many of us, but the way they are
catalogued its like looking for a needle in a haystack. I'm not sure
but if we took one film and