Nuestros Ranchos Site

Thanks Joseph for recording the conversation, I am such an auditory learner.
I have some questions about being involved as an indexer (not an
arbitrator..lol).

Questions:
1) Where would we get the census and notary records that are being asked for
us to index?
a) Would these records be provided to us?
2) There is a present sentiment of not duplicating existing church records
of marriages or baptisms, however some of these records do no exist for
certain time frames.
a) Personally, I would be interested in helping with this data, even if
augmented through census data. More specifically, records missing for
Tlaltenango, Zacatecas. Would these records/films be made available for us to help
with the indexing?
3) There are 26 films, will each of us be responsible for one, or will
there will be several of us working on them to double check against our data
input?

While I am a full time public school teacher and part-time professor, I find
myself very busy, but am willing to help in any way I can....If I have the
film at my disposition, in a readable format, I have no problems inputting
data. However, if I have to take photo copies of the film, after picking up the
film, this may be more problematic.

Hey, just for kicks, I am putting this in: my great great grandmother was
the only person who proudly indicated that she was NOT CATHOLIC in one of the
census. She indicated that she was Presbyterian...now where did she get that
from (LOL).

Esperanza
Chicagoland area

************************************** See what's new at http://www.aol.com

Did anybody go to the Texas Hispanic Conference?

I was hoping for some kind report or article.

--
Esther A. Herold

-------------- Original message --------------

> Hello Arturo:
>
> Well, I am not going either.
>
> Last month I went to Aguascalientes and Leon, Gto., Guadalajara & Lagos de
> Moreno. And.....I came back with the ecoli bacteria again! Right now, I am
> on some strong drug.....because I need to get well!!!
>
>
> In Nov, Lee & I are going to Veracruz. And, of course our trip to Vegas for
> New Years is all set. Our oldest daughter is joining us this year.
>
> However, I am doing genealogy. I am going to help Angel Brown publish some
> records out of Mexico. I need to help so that can come out as soon as
> possible. Will tell you later....
>
> Arturo....I got a couple of copies of some Teocaltiche stuff.....could not
> get the book itself....so a copy is just as good. I bought the cabildo
> records of Guadalajara...and got home..... read my list and it shows that I have
> them in my library....have looked and looked and cannot find them!!!!
>
> When I have time I will tell you about my trip to Mexico.....it was a trip
> from hell! Although, it was also funny and crazy!! One thing I will tell
> you....I will never, and I mean never stay with anyone again. I mean their
> home!!! I really missed having Josie with me....we seem to get along okay.
>
> Josie is in the process of moving to Houston. She will be living pretty
> close. Her daughter lives here....maybe 20 miles or less? She bought a house
> and is selling her San Antonio home.
>
> Do you remember the lady that we know that sold some records to
> Ancestry.com? I do not want to mention any names.....the records were not hers
> to
> sell......she was paid $15,000.00 which went into her pocket. Well, last
> Friday
> she was picked up by the DA's office taken to jail and booked. For
> genealogy????
> For stealing, really, not for the $15,000 but for about $3800.00 from the
> last year's conference held in Corpus Christi. Only in Texas!!! She was
> with the SAGA group. Acturally she was SAGA; she would not let anyone see the
> treasury report...or any other report... The group has 'regrouped' and are
> trying to keep afloat with the terrible reputation that has befallen them.
>
> Anyway, that is not just idle gossip. I cannot imagine why someone would
> mess their reputation for such a small amount of money.
>
> Mickey
>
>
>
> ************************************** See what's new at http://www.aol.com

Carlos de Esparza & Rafael de Esparza

Carlos arrived in Ecuador in 1582

Rafael arrived in Mexico City in 1578 (before Lope!)

I have no doubt there related somehow, they descend from the same House of Esparza.
There might be a higher chance that Rafael is the brother of Lope. Since they both arrived in Mexico city.

Source:

Daniel Mendez del Camino

Hello,

I just wanted to let everyone know, that Lynn Turner a member of the Ranchos
group, will be teaching at the conference in Salt Lake. So I suggest that
those of us, that attend stop by and say hi, to Lynn.

And maybe those us who attend, can get together and introduce ourselves.

Jonathan

--------- Original Message --------
From: research@nuestrosranchos.org
To: research@lists.nuestrosranchos.org
Subject: [Nuestros Ranchos] Salt Lake City Conference
Date: 10/04/07 14:36

>
> As it turns out I will not be able to attend the conference in Salt Lake
City that will be held in two weeks.
>
> There is however, at least one Ranchos member who will be attending and
would like to meet any other Ranchos members attending and perhaps share
accomodations. Please contact me personally and I can help put you in
touch.

Hey everyone...

I just posted on my blog the latest schedule for the annual Hispanic genealogy
and family history conference at the FHL (Family History Library) in Salt Lake
City. I posted it before the FHL did, shh...

http://hispanicgenealogy.blogspot.com

The conference will be October 19 and 20

Lynn

----------------------------------------------------------------------
NOTICE: This email message is for the sole use of the intended recipient(s) and may contain confidential and privileged information. Any unauthorized review, use, disclosure or distribution is prohibited. If you are not the intended recipient, please contact the sender by reply email and destroy all copies of the original message.

I just returned from Jalpa, Zacatecas. As someone mentioned and I already
knew Jalpa records are skimpy....very skimpy. What I found out and yet to
verify. The Arechigas arrived in Jalpa at approx 1820, it was 7 brothers and one
sister from Spain. The Chavez arrived to Jalpa in approx 1880 from Ixtlan
Jalisco, there were two or three cousins Vicente Chavez Sanchez, Daniel Chavez
married to Emiteria Sanchez, a third possible cousin was Refugio Chavez.

I also got a book recently a professor on the story of Jalpa, if anyone is
interested, I can give title and email address to the professor at La Casa de la
Cultura.

Juanita, I live in Los Angeles and Dr. Maloney is here is Santa Monica, hope
your eye surgery went well.

************************************** See what's free at http://www.aol.com.

Hello everybody! I wento the FHC and happen to notice they had the Catalogos a Indias from 1509-1680. I quicky remembered about Don Lope! So I scanned myself a copy of Lope and his maestro Don Enrique de Manleon. I have both now for my records and it dates 1593 in Mexico City. If anyone wants one I can scan one over email. Email me at

I have just posted a new link in the LINKS section of the site that points to the site of the Biblioteca Publica del Estado de Jalisco which is run under the auspices of the Universidad de Guadalajara.

The library's collection includes a large manuscript collection dating from early colonial times including the archives of the Real Audiencia de Guadalajara and the Franciscan Fund which holds the original manuscripts of the Historia de la Conquista de Nueva Galicia.

Fondo Franciscano.- (1531-1950)

Formada por 340 volúmenes de documentos procedentes de algunos conventos y colegios de Guadalajara. Cada volumen incluye documentos de diversos asuntos: Cédulas, Órdenes, Bulas y algunas monografías, destacando la obra de don Matias de la Mota Padilla "HISTORIA DE LA CONQUISTA DE LA NUEVA GALiCIA", basada en los archivos de los conventos de San Francisco de Guadalajara y Zapopan, principalmente en los apuntes de Fray Antonio Tello. El "LIBRO CUARTO DE LAS FUNDACIONES DE LOS CONVENTOS DE LA SANTA PROVINCIA DE JALISCO Y DE ALGUNAS COSAS DIGNAS DE MEMORIA QUE HAY EN ELLA" obra de Fray Antonio Tello y Ia "FISICA PARTICULARIS" de Francisco Javier Clavijero.

Archivo de la Real Audiencia de Guadalajara.- (1530-1821)

Constituye uno de los acervos más importantes para la Historia de la región, además de ser uno de los de mayor volumen. Está integrado por expedientes y cuadernos que emanaron de ésta Institución desde su fundación en 1548, aunque la mayor parte del archivo contiene documentos a partir de 1560, cuando la Audiencia se traslada a Guadalajara, al declararse esta ciudad su sede definitiva. La Audiencia ejerció funciones políticas, Administrativas, Judiciales y de Gobierno. Los expediente se encuentra organizados bajo los siguientes ramos:

RAMO CIVIL: (1530-1821) Con documentos referentes a causas civiles que conocían los oidores, pleitos sobre tierras, aguas o minas; propiedad de esclavos, cobranzas de dinero, concursos de bienes sobre deudas; testamentos e inventarios de intestados, etc. Consta de 447 cajas, con 7359 registros de inventario que ya están integrados en una base de datos.

RAMO CRIMINAL: (1600-1821) Con documentos referentes a las causas criminales o hechos de sangre y violencia, que eran presentados ante la Audiencia y sus Alcaldes del Crimen. Este ramo cuenta con 174 cajas, 2715 registros de inventario integrados en base de datos.

RAMO FISCAL. (1580-1847) Consta de 1775 libros encuadernados en piel, tocan asuntos Fiscales, manifestaciones del Real Ensaye, caudales del ramo de peajes, tabacos, papel sellado, renta de naipes, registro de reales alcabalas, etc. Esta inventariado e integrado en base de datos.

Archivo del Juzgado General de Bienes de Difuntos.- (1549-1821)

Son 297 cajas, 3314 expedientes, con documentos que tratan en su mayoría asuntos sobre bienes de particulares que murieron sin dejar testamento pero además contiene documentos sobre causas civiles, inventarios de bienes de haciendas, legados y otra diversidad de asuntos. Esta integrado en una base de datos.

Archivo de examenes de Abogados.-

Este acervo esta integrado por 402 expedientes referentes a solicitudes para exámenes de Abogados y Escribanos Públicos de la Real Audiencia de Guadalajara.15 expedientes que van de 1720 a 1820y 387 expedientes del Supremo Tribunal de Justicia, que van de 1823 a 1911. Está inventariado e integrado en base de datos.

Archivo del Supremo Tribunal de Justicia del Estado de Jalisco. (1822-1919)

Is there a resource for early marriage records from Aguascalientes, Aguascalientes. There appears to be no filmed marriage records prior to 1663.

I am looking for the marriage of Felipe Diaz de Santiago with Isabel de Turises which should have occured sometime between 1630 and 1640.

Any leads would be greatly appreciated.

Hola a Todos!

Busco algien que se llama Genaro Martinez nacido alrededor ¿1890-1895?, hijo de Aurelio Martinez. No conosco la madre. Y no conosco donde nacio. Solamente se que debe de ser Ojuelos, Jalisco, Pinos, Zacatecas o Aguascalientes, Aguascalientes.

Muy agradecida por cual quer ayuda.

Sofia

Hello Everyone!

I am looking for someone called Genaro Martinez who I believe was born ¿1890-1895?, son of Aurelio Martinez. I do not know the mothers name and I do not know where he was born, but I am certain it must be Ojuelos, Jalisco, Pinos, Zacatecas or Aguascalientes, Aguascalientes.

Thank you for any help.

Sofia

This person would like to know about the Villasenor/Cervantes/Lara
ancestral lines. You can either email me your replies or to the group
and I'll forward the messages.

thanks,

joseph

====================

Joseph Puentes
http://PleaseListenToYourMom.com (Women's Peace Podcast)
http://H2Opodcast.com (Environment Podcast)
http://H2Opodcast.blogspot.com/ (Blog for above)
http://NuestraFamiliaUnida.com (Latin American History Podcast)

-------- Original Message --------
Subject: Re: Nuevo Leon or Not?
Date: Mon, 24 Sep 2007 15:04:05 -0500
From: j
To: Clean
References: <001801c7fd30$58fa3a80$0c00a8c0@Johnny>
<46F5DE80.6060808@nc.rr.com> <002901c7fd99$530ddeb0$0c00a8c0@Johnny>
<46F65507.2000009@nc.rr.com>

Joseph,

I see that there is no real headway with my desire to seek my mother's
ancesters through you, so I will then approach my communications with
you with an interest in the Jalisco research. I am submitting my
portion of my research dealing with 3 generations of Micheles if you are
willing to show me what research your organization has on the
Villasenor/Cervantes/Lara ancestral line which I need to begin to
complete this line of my ancestry. Let me know what you are willing to
part with, but it is this line of ancestry that I am most interested in
because this is the line that takes us into the European line of
connected ancestry. Let me hear from you soon. Just as soon as I hear
from you I will send you the 3 generations of Michel ancestry.
Primarily what I am interest in at this point is to hear that you do
have research on this line of ancestry leading into the European
ancestral line.

Juan Andres Michel

I am looking for descendencia de Diego Vázquez de Buendía
Diego Vázquez de Buendía puede ser hijo del conquistador casó con
Josepha Flores que era difunta el 12 de Octubre de 1645 cuando testó el
padre de ella Don Hernán Flores de la Torre.

Doña Juana Velázquez y el Capitán Diego Vázquez De Buendía tuvieron 3
hijos y 4 hijas, de los que se sabe hasta ahora son:
Tercera Generación
3-1 Juana VÁZQUEZ Velázquez
3-2 Hernán VÁZQUEZ Velázquez
Palomino y Cañedo dice que su descendencia al parecer quedó en
Aguascalientes.
Any information related to them, I will apreciate. I concentrate por years
my research to Jalisco and not until now that I begin participating in
Nuestros Ranchos that I am searching in Zacatecas and Aguscalientes.
Thank you

Sylvia H Corona

Let me suggest that you visit the "Mexico folder" link below, of a new Family Search (Research Wiki - Beta) page that contains all-around information about finding ancestors in Mexico.

It includes about 50 recent Articles (written this year by LDS family history experts), - - - with descriptive information, links and references with a high quantity of research sources, bibliographies, disertations, monographs, lessons, and other concepts relating to research about ancestries in Mexico.

http://www.familysearchwiki.org/u-s-and-canada/mexico/

Happy browsing, and good hunting !

Efrain Conrique
San Diego, California

I am a descendant of the Juan Caliz also. I descend throught the Arredondos who married Santos COy and the Yslas Palacios of the mining area of Villaldama, Nuevo Leon who also married Santos Coy.

THe dna testing the results posted out on Gary Felix's Genealogy of Mexico website suggest a semitic origin to the family.

http://members.tripod.com/~GaryFelix/index63.htm
--
Esther A. Herold

-------------- Original message from Jan Jaeckle : --------------

> Hi Ed,
>
> Bernardo de los Santos Coy does appear to have created his name, although
> we cannot be sure since no one has been able to find the genealogy of his
> parents, especially his father, Juan de Caliz.
>
> However, the "Coy" part of his name is from his mother, Catalina Gomez de
> Coy. The musing about a Scottish visitor named McCoy traveling in Spain comes
> from Rodolfo Gonzalez dela Garza in "Mil Familias de Tamaulipas, Nuevo Leon,
> Coahuila y Texas, Tomo III." His extensive info comes from documents & personal
> interviews. I suspect that the idea was oral Santoscoy family history suggested
> to Mr. Gonzalez decades ago when he did his original interviews.
>
> Jan
> Edward Serros wrote:
>
> There is a connection between the de los Santos Coy/de la Garza Falcon families
> of Saltillo/Monterey and Valparaiso, Zacatecas.(Ranchos area). I tried to attach
> the marriage dispensation record from the Sagrada Mitra de Guadalajara which
> documents such a connection to my file in the Ranchos data but I was
> unsuccessful. I will retry later.
>
> I would like to communicate with anybody with any connection with the Santos Coy
> of the Ranchos area. My Felgueres family has two separate marriages with the
> Santos Coy or de los Santos Coy or simply Coy or Coi family in the late 1700's
> and early 1800's.
>
> It is clear to me that the Coys (or McCoys) of Scotland and England have
> absolutely no connection with the de los Santos Coy surname of Mexico which was
> created arbitrarily by the original Bernardo de los Santos Coy (see book "The
> Coy Family Reunion" by Robert Garcia and Yolanda Kirkpatrick, plus other
> sources). The Spanish of the 1500's and 1600's took great liberties with
> apellidos (surnames).
>
> Ed

I have attached a pdf file of what I have so far. I have used the books of Garemendia Leal and the archives of monterrey as sources for this information.
FAMILIAS DE MONTERREY, TOMO III
http://www.borderlandsbooks.com/searchdb.asp
I have Bernardo Santos COy married 2 times.

Also, at the Genealogy of Mexico site by Gary Felix there is a Santos out there from Tamulipias that had the y-dna tested and it looks like the origin is semitic not european.

http://members.tripod.com/~GaryFelix/index63.htm

I hope this helps.

Let me know if there is more I can do.
--
Esther A. Herold

-------------- Original message from "phyls esparza" : --------------

> do not know if this is correct but this is what we have found on the
> Coy........
>
> Descendants of Juan de Calis
>
>
>
>
> Generation No. 1
>
>
> 1. JUAN1 DE CALIS was born 1575. He married CATALINA GOMEZ DE COY.
>
>
> Child of JUAN DE CALIS and CATALINA DE COY is:
>
> 2. i. BERNARDO DE LOS SANTOS2 COY, b. 1603.
>
>
>
> Generation No. 2
>
>
> 2. BERNARDO DE LOS SANTOS2 COY (JUAN1 DE CALIS) was born 1603. He married
> BEATRIZ RUELAS ROJO.
>
>
> Children of BERNARDO COY and BEATRIZ ROJO are:
>
> 3. i. BERNARDO DE LOS SANTOS3 COY, b. 1625; d. 1675.
>
> ii. CATALINA DE LOS SANTOS COY, b. 1630; m. LORENZO GUTIERREZ GARCIA.
>
>
>
> Generation No. 3
>
>
> 3. BERNARDO DE LOS SANTOS3 COY (BERNARDO DE LOS SANTOS2, JUAN1 DE CALIS) was
> born 1625, and died 1675. He married INEZ DE LA CERDA 1645.
>
>
> Children of BERNARDO COY and INEZ LA CERDA are:
>
> 4. i. PEDRO COY DE4 LOS SANTOS.
>
> ii. JUAN DE CALIX COY DE LOS SANTOS, m. MARIA DIAZ.
>
> 5. iii. NICOLAS DE LOS SANTOS COY, b. 1645, Coahuila, Mexico.
>
> iv. JOSE DE LOS SANTOS COY, m. LEONARDA GUAJARDO FLORES MARTINEZ.
>
> v. DIEGO DE LOS SANTOS COY.
>
> 6. vi. ANA MARIA DE LA CERDA COY, d. 1707.
>
> vii. BERNARDO DE LOS SANTOS COY, m. JUANA DE CEPEDA.
>
> viii. CATALINA LOS SANTOS COY, m. (1) FRANCISCO SALAZAR TREVINO; m. (2)
> LORENZO GUTIERREZ GARCIA; b. 1600.
>
>
>
> Generation No. 4
>
>
> 4. PEDRO COY DE4 LOS SANTOS (BERNARDO DE LOS SANTOS3 COY, BERNARDO DE LOS
> SANTOS2, JUAN1 DE CALIS) He married FRANCISA TREVINO MORALES.
>
>
> Child of PEDRO LOS SANTOS and FRANCISA MORALES is:
>
> i. PEDRO COY5 DE LOS SANTOS, b. 1662; m. MARGARITA MARTINES DE LA GARZA
> FALCON, May 04, 1681; b. 1662.
>
>
>
> 5. NICOLAS DE LOS SANTOS4 COY (BERNARDO DE LOS SANTOS3, BERNARDO DE LOS
> SANTOS2, JUAN1 DE CALIS) was born 1645 in Coahuila, Mexico. He married ANA
> MARIA GUERRA.
>
>
> Child of NICOLAS COY and ANA GUERRA is:
>
> i. MARIA JOSEFA SANTOS5 COY, b. 1712; m. BLAS MARIA VILLARREAL DE LA GARZA
> FALCON, Abt 1745; b. 1712, Real de las Salinas, Nuevo Leon , Mexico; d.
> 1767, Camargo, Mexico.
>
>
>
> 6. ANA MARIA DE LA CERDA4 COY (BERNARDO DE LOS SANTOS3, BERNARDO DE LOS
> SANTOS2, JUAN1 DE CALIS) died 1707. She married DIEGO FERNANDEZ DE CASTRO.
> He was born 1623 in Alferez Real Diego FERNANDEZ CASTRO, and died April 18,
> 1672.
>
>
> Child of ANA COY and DIEGO DE CASTRO is:
>
> i. JOSEFA FERNANDEZ5 CASTRO, b. 1652.
>
> ----- Original Message -----
> From: "Leticia Leon"
> To:
> Sent: Tuesday, September 18, 2007 11:17 AM
> Subject: Re: [Nuestros Ranchos] Ramirez De Coy
>
>
> Hi! I have no clue, yet.
> I am waiting for Lic. Mariano Gonzalez-Leal next edition of "Retonos de
> Espa

Here is a Message from a member of the nuestrosranchos.org group. Have a
look at this web page for the images Benicio refers too:
http://www.nuestrosranchos.org/node/16278 This album is open to the
public so please pass this URL to all your friends, especially those in
Mexico and with special emphasis on those from Nuevo Leon.

Un mensaje de un miembro del groupo: nuestrosranchos.org Mira aqui:
http://www.nuestrosranchos.org/node/16278 para ver los imagenes. Este
album esta abierto para el publico. Manda la direccion del album a sus
amigos, especialmente a los que viven en Mexico y con enfasis especial a
los que viven en Nuevo Leon:

Joseph,

Soy Benicio Samuel Sanchez, de Mexico, seguimos con nuestros proyectos.

Poco a poco vamos avanzando en cada uno de ellos, desafortunadamente
otros estan completamente detenidos.

Hoy estoy pidiendote tu ayuda - solo si consideras que es posible-.

Reenviar a quienes vivan en Mexico cualquiera de las siguientes imagenes
para el proyecto de Genealogia Molecular. La imagen llamada
"Poster-Gente" la creamos exclusivamente para las personas de Nuevo Leon
Creo que tu y yo somos R1b.

Tambien te informo que debido a la falta de informacion en español sobre
Genealogia Molecular he pedido que pongamos en linea un website , con
temas que ayudaran a entender y usar las bases de datos de DNA.

Este portal esta en www.genealogiamolecular.com

Como siempre agradezco toda la ayuda que sea posible y me pongo a tus
ordenes.

Tu amigo,

Benicio Samuel Sanchez Garcia

Here is how I found the batch numbers for my specific ranchos (but there
is no guarantee there will be batch numbers for your ranchos):

1) go to the IGI

2) Under the first name put either "Jose" or "Maria"

3) Under the Last Name put a very very common name like "Garcia" or
"Hernandez" or "Gonzalez" etc.

4) Under Region put Mexico

5) Under State put "Jalisco" or what ever state you are looking for

6) click on search.

you will get several hundreds or probably 1000's of results. so

7) use your "Search" tool on your computer and put the name of the
rancho you are looking for. Let's say "Tamazula De Gordiano"

8) search page by page until you find an example of someone from
Tamazula De Gordiano

look for the batch number next to the film number. here is an example:

JOSSE MARIA GARCIA ARCEA Pedigree
Male

18 JUL 1798 San Francisco, Tamazula De Gordiano, Jalisco, Mexico

Parents:
Father: JOSSE MA. GARCIA Family
Mother: TERESA ARCEA

Source Information:
Batch No.: Dates: Source Call No.: Type:
Printout Call No.: Type:
C603754 1789 - 1817 0225986 Film NONE

9) now you have the batch number (C603754) for the period of time from
1789 thru 1817 so now we go about "Guessing" what the batch numbers are
for earlier and later periods

10) Plug in C603754 into the batch window on the IGI search and if you
leave Jose Garcia in you'll get all the Jose Garcia for Tamazula if y ou
take off the Jose you'll get all the Garcia but now we want to play with
the C603754 number.

11) modify C603754 to C603753 and see what happens and yes bingo we get
these results:

C603753 1783 - 1804 0225985 Film NONE

12) and again:

C603752 1761 - 1783 0225984

13) and again:

C603751 1652 - 1761 0225983

we know this is as far back as we can go by clicking on the film number
and seeing the earliest dates available on film

14) now lets guess going forward from C603754 to C603755 and we get:

C603755 1817 - 1835 0225987

15) and again to:

C603756 1835 - 1843 0225988

16) and again to:

C603757 1743 - 1850 0225989

sometimes it works like this and sometimes the numbers don't show a
pattern especially when you get the J (males) or K (females) listings.
Sometimes on the IGI search you need to do the "Jose" and "Garcia" and
"Mexico" and "Jalisco" and then insert a date for the missing set of
years in your batch numbers. Maybe there is a batch maybe there is not
for those missing years. Maybe there isn't even records for those years
so thus the missing batch records or film record for them. also you
need to limit your "Event" to marriages to find the marriages. well you
really don't have to but its easier.

well I kind of rushed through this and would be willing to explain a bit
more if any of the confusion above is more unclear that I think it is.

joseph

ps: I wish I hadn't done one that turned out to be done already
finished. as you can see from the "Related Places" in Jalisco there are
_possibilities_ for these in Jalisco:

Hola Compañeros Genealogistas;

El motivo de la presente es darles las gracias a todas
las personas que me ayudaron en lo que pudieron sobre
mi solicitud de ayuda para saber donde se encontraba el
rancho "El Lobo", donde nacieron mis Bisabuelos Maternos
y ya encontre el dato, si estaba en el INEGI, pero no lo
habia sabido buscar, asi me entero que el RAncho
"El Lobo" esta en el municipio de Tototlan, Jalisco, y
debe estar cerca de los limites con el Municipio de
Ocotlan, Jalisco, por lo que en el acta de Matrimonio
Civil de mis Bisabuelos deberian haber especificado
que eran "Originarios y vecinos del Rancho El Lobo
de la Municipalidad (o Conprencion) de Tototlan"

Aqui esta el enlace de la Mapoteca del INEGI donde
esta tambien sus estadisticas:

http://mapserver.inegi.gob.mx/dsist/ahl2003/general2.cfm?clavegeo=170796

Tambien doy mis mas sinceras gracias a todas aquellas personas
que me escribieron dandome las condolencias por el reciente
fallecimiento de mi Tia Aurora Gomez Gomez.

Aprovecho tambien el presente, para solicitarle a Samuel Sanchez
que me conteste sobre mi requerimiento para solucionar el problema
del faltante de la firma en la forma de recoleccion de ADN de mi
sobrino Carlos Alberto Villegas Gomez y saber si recibio satisfactoriamente
los 30 Archivos Genealogicos ya sin Signos Diacriticos de las muesras
y saber cuando las va a enviar al Instituto Sorenson.

Desde Guadalajarra:

Tomas Alejandro Villegas Gomez.

El día 12/09/07, Eventos Genealogicos, de Historia y Publicaciones
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Saludos desde Guadalajara:

Tomas Alejandro Villegas Gomez

Does anyone know what "hijo de estado chico" means in a church document? We have in particular a marriage between Francisco Godoy and Maria Rosa Llamas, where it states that Francisco is "hijo de estado chico" de Nicolas Godoy y Brigida Ortiz...

See the document scan at:

http://www.ramosfamily.org/nextgen/showmedia.php?mediaID=124&medialinkI…

Any information about Don GABRIEL ORDOÑEZ RIFARACHE Clérigo Presbítero. I
know that "Don Fray Juan de Valle y Arredondo (Obispo 1608-1617) le
presentó al oficio de Pánuco y villa de Aguascalientes y después al del
Fresnillo".
Please anyone that runs across information on him, please let me know.
Thanks

Sylvia H Corona

The familysearchindexing.com site has recently put up the Aguascalientes section of the 1930 Mexico census up as a project!

Given that most people in this group are computer saavy and that this state is smack in the heart of our area of research, we should try to get as many people involved in helping out with this indexing project. You can volunteer to index as little or as much as you want and you can do it anytime you want over the internet.

Sign up for an account and start indexing today! I just did a couple of batches and it was quite simple.

http://www.familysearchindexing.org/en/index.jsp

Raul, I don't know if you have this information but I do have some of your line from Los Haros, Jerez Zacetacs that shows it a couple of generations further back than you posted in your file on both the Santiago and Haro families. My records only have 3 children for Jose Maria Hurtado and Maria Matilde Santiago, they are Pascuala 1889, Fabiana 1900 and Benigno in 1903.

Baptism: 19 March 1872 in Jerez
Matilde born in Los Haros Jueves 14 March 1872 4pm
Parents: Catarino de Santiago and Luisa de Haro
Pat grn: Ant. De Santiago and Trinidad Mercado
Mat grn: Basilio de Haro and Margarita Roman
Pad: Pilar de Santiago and Maria Benita de Luna
Source Information:
Batch No.: Dates: Source Call No.: Type: Printout Call No.: Type:
C607172 1871 - 1873 0439854 Film NONE

I"m in the process of updating my information on Rootsweb.com since I find that site very easy to read. If you'll put in Matilde Santiago's birthdate it should pull up the file on this family plus her husbands family too. I will postpone updating until Monday evening since updating usually pulls it of line for a couple of days.. If I can be of any further help just let me know.

Linda Castanon-Long in B.C.

Hola Primos! (Note: the rest of this message will be in English)

Well - was cruising the WEB - just looking - when I came across this site:

http://americanhistory.si.edu/collections/group_detail.cfm?key=1253&gke…

and thought I would share. It isn't necessarily about our Ranchos area, but it is about our shared heritage - and since this is the time of year to recognize (nationally) our Heritage (whatever they choose to call it) I thought it might be of interest to you.
You also might be interested in this other Smithsonian site:

http://www.smithsonianeducation.org/educators/resource_library/hispanic…

How will you celebrate?? (I think Joseph will be looking for some MENUDO q;-) )

If you will be in Washington, DC during this time period, click on the Heritage Month Calendar for activities sponsored by the Smithsonian.

Food anthropologist...that is what she was....if I could re-live my life,
that is exactly what I would have been!!! It has been said that food is one of
the last vestiges of a culture to totally disappear when there is a dominant
cultural take-over (wars, conquerors, etc). I am so jealous Arturo.....I
would have loved to heard her lecture. I have often wondered how tamales were
made before the introduction of lard...which is definitely European....and yet
I've read that it is one of the oldest recipes in Mexico!

My husband's diet sounds very much like your father's...but it is out of
choice...he was raised in a small village where meat was/is not readily
available. (Most of the homes of the poorer people did not have electricity until a
few years ago!). Me, on the other hand, grew up in a household where a meal
was not complete unless there was meat and some sort of pasta/rice dish.
Beans were not served often...but I so enjoy them...and they enjoy messing with
me (smile).

Esperanza

************************************** See what's new at http://www.aol.com

And then again many people would be resistant to the idea that during the conquest, the Mexicans(Aztecs) ate the españoles, their conquerors.

To anyone faint of heart, do not read beyond these words because I have quoted from Bernal Diaz del Castillo's History of the Conquest of Mexico.

Alicia

During the conquista while they were at war with each other the Aztecs would capture los españoles, cage them alive, fatten them and then carve out their hearts while they were still living and feed the warm hearts to their gods, the rest of the body they would eat. But then they complained that the españoles were too bitter to the taste and I quote from "The History of the Conquest of Mexico by Bernal Diaz del Castillo.(page 342)

"We all directed our eyes thither and shocking to relate! saw our unfortunate countrymen driven by force, cuffs and bastinades to the place where they were to be sacrificed, which bloody ceremony was accompanied by the mournful sound of all the instruments of the temple. We perceived that when they had brought the unfortunate victoms to the flat summit of the body of the temple, where were the adoratories, they put plumes upon their heads, and with a kind of fan in hand of each, made them dance before their accursed idols. When they had done this, they laid them upon the bricks, on the stone used for the purpose, where they cut out their hearts, alive, and having presented them, yet palpitating, to their gods, they drew the bodies down the steps by the feet, where they were taken by others of their priests. Let the reader think what were our sensations on this occasion"

If at any time I begin to bemoan the Spanish Conquest all I have to do is read the history of the conquest and and it puts my mind at ease knowing that we were better off after the conquest, not perfect but better.

----- Original Message ----
From: Joseph Puentes
To: general@nuestrosranchos.org
Sent: Monday, September 17, 2007 1:04:20 PM
Subject: Re: [Nuestros Ranchos] Vegeterian Mexican Cooking

I moved over to the general list.

thanks Arturo and Marge. Can you imagine how they must have been eaten
by the mosquitos if they were also eating them in quantities large
enough to form bricks.

Arturo if your memory triggers the names of those guest lecturers I'd
love to contact them to see if they'd be willing to do a podcast on that
subject for the http://NuestraFamiliaUnida.com site.

thanks again very interesting reply from both of you.

dogs, huh, I betya a lot of Mexican folk would resist the idea that our
ancestors ate them. Then again a lot of folks are resistant to the idea
that the Mexican population has a significant African blood line mixed in.

joseph

====================

Joseph Puentes
http://H2Opodcast.com (Environment Podcast)
http://H2Opodcast.blogspot.com/ (Blog for above)
http://NuestraFamiliaUnida.com (Latin American History Podcast)

arturoramos wrote:
> Joseph:
>
> I applaud you on your conviction and resolve to make the conversion. I tried vegeterianism for a while in college and converted back.
>
> My father, for health resasons, is largely a vegetarian as of several years back. He eats some fish and a bit of chicken but nothing else. He gets to eat nopales, frijoles, calabazas, elotes, huitlacoche, tunas and all sorts of other foods that he loves. The problem is more social since my mother and most of his acquaintances still eat menudo, pozole and tacos de carnitas. To my mother's credit she has started making chicken pozole.
>
> Anyhow, in college I had a course on pre-Hispanic Mexican history and anthropology and we had a guest lecturer for a couple of classes on the historic gastronomy of Mexico and given that turkeys and dogs were pretty much the only domesticated animals in Mexico... yes Mexicans ate dogs... little ones that looked like Chihuahuas but fatter because they force fed them corn... the diet was largely vegetarian.
>
> Beans, huitlacoche and fresh water algea and moss provided rich vegetarian protein sources.