Nuestros Ranchos Site

In my research, I have encountered a baptism record that indicates a child (possibly my 3rd G-grandfather) was abandoned at the house of a woman in Guadalajara in 1781. The record provides the child's first and middle names but omits any mention of parents or even godparents. At some later time, the child would have been given a surname. Was this name assigned by the Church? Or, if the child's father eventually stepped up and acknowledged the child as his, how would the family name be established: by Church action or by civil action? Where (if anywhere) would such action be recorded? Thanks for any assistance you can provide with my request.

Hola prim@s,

Here’s my work on another family who used the Alcocer surname, appearing in Mexico near the end of the 16th century.

Brothers Alonso de Alcocer Belfelt and Juan de Colonia Belfelt were from Sevilla, Spain; from them would descend families who used the surnames Alcocer and Colonia, who lived in Mexico City, Penjamo Gto and in Patzcuaro Mich.

Alonso de Alcocer and Juan de Colonia were sons of Conrado Belfelt de Colonia and Leonor de Alcocer, of Sevilla. Leonor de Alcocer was said to descend from the “illustrious and noble house of Alcocer of Spain”; she was daughter of Alonso Sanchez de Jerez and Beatriz de Toledo, merchants, who lived on Calle de Catalanes in Sevilla. I don’t know which of them descends from the Alcocer, since I’ve done no work on that line. Maybe one of you has a lead?

Conrado Belfelt de Colonia was born in Cologne, Germany, so “Colonia” is a toponym (during his lifetime, native sevillanos would call him “el Flamenco,” thinking he was from Flanders). He was said to descend from the illustrious and noble house of “Belfelt” (also spelled “Berfelt” in some documents). I consulted with a Spanish cousin of mine, who lives in Germany, and who translates and transcribes texts and books between German and Spanish, and we think that “Belfelt” is an hispanization of “Welser” (usually spelt and pronounced “Belzer” and “Belzar,” in old Castilian texts). The Welser were a powerful family of bankers and merchants from Germany, active in Spain and its territories during the Hapsburg era. This would make sense, as Conrado Belfelt was a merchant - he sold nails and mercantile in his shop, located on Calle de Carpinteria, parish of San Salvador, in Sevilla. He was highly regarded in his community, lived in a very prominent house (with several servants), and was apparently the head of a German merchants guild; members used to “take off their hats,” when in his presence, underlining his noble pedigree. He was murdered while returning from a farm that he owned, his body found by the city walls of Sevilla. He might have died intestate, since their two sons migrated to Mexico. They also had a daughter named Beatriz or Ynes, who remained in Sevilla and who was married to a “fulano” Martinez.

The earliest documentation I’ve found for this family is Juan de Colonia’s 1578 petition to travel to Mexico (PARES/AGIS). His brother Alonso was already living there. In his petition, Juan includes a letter that his brother had written him, dated 10 Dec 1577; Alonso describes his arrival, and contracting “a chapetonada, which kills 1/3 of all those who arrive here from Spain.” From the sound of it, Alonso likely arrived a couple of months before he wrote his brother. He encourages Juan to join him and to try his luck, since “you have no father nor mother, and they left us with no inheritance.” My favorite part, is where he quotes a popular refrain: “Quien adelante no mira, atrás se halla”: “he who does not look ahead, will be left behind.” That really captures the spirit of these brave men and women!

On a side note, I also noticed Juan de Colonia’s address on the letter, and on a whim, I checked it out, to see where he was living: “la calle del atocha, casa de los fucares en madrid.” I absolutely got goosebumps! The Fucares - or “Fuggar,” “Fúcar” in Spanish - were another powerful family of bankers & merchants from Germany, with strong ties to the Emperor Carlos V. Their palace in Madrid no longer stands, but it was located on the corner of Calle Atocha and Calle de Fúcar (named for them) - just 2 blocks away from my current home in Madrid!!! I got chills, thinking that a possible ancestor of mine lived so near to me, 4 centuries ago!!!

Alonso de Alcocer and Juan de Colonia managed to establish themselves in Mexico; they had connections with viceroys Luis de Velasco, Gaspar de Zuñiga, and Diego Fernandez de Cordoba, all who awarded them land grants, governmental posts, and other favors. Alonso also received letters of recommendation from the Marquesa de Guadalcazar (Mariana Riederer von Paar, wife of Viceroy Diego Fernandez de Cordoba), her sister, la Condesa de Barajas (Maria Sidonia Riederer von Paar, Lady in Waiting for Queen Margarita de Austria) and la Duquesa de Valhermosa (Maria Luisa de Aragon y Wernstein), revealing strong ties with the Royal Court in Madrid - “la Madrid de las Austrias.” Notable is the fact that all three women were of German nobility - like Alonso & Juan.

Both Alonso de Alcocer and Juan de Colonia appear in Actos de Cabildo del Ayuntamiento de la Ciudad de Mexico in the early 1600’s; they were involved in tribute collection - Juan de Colonia served as “arrendatario de la sisa del vino” - the wine tax. This fits in with him living with and likely working for the Fucares in Madrid. Alonso was said to own some mills around Mexico City, as well as cattle haciendas in the province of Michoacan (likely, Penjamo, where his descendants would live. The Colonia’s of Patzuaro owned a hacienda in Valle de Taramequaro, Mich).

Here’s what I have on thee two branches:

ALCOCER - Mexico City & Penjamo

Alonso de Alcocer married Maria de Herrera Contreras on 29 Jan 1582; she was from Zacatecas, Zac; daughter of Gaspar Rodriguez de Contreras (of Pedroche, Cordoba) and Isabel Mendez de Herrera (of Zamora, Castilla y Leon). They had two children that I know of:

1. Juan de Alcocer, b. 10 Jul 1586, Mexico City.
2. Beatriz de Alcocer, b. 28 May 1590, Mexico City.

GENERATION II

Their son, Juan de Alcocer, was contador del Santo Oficio and later, tesorero de la Real Caja y de la Santa Cruzada. He married Guimar Davalos y Bocanegra, daughter of Diego de Bocanegra Cervantes y Villaseñor cc Maria de Verdugo y Avalos.

From them would descend the Alcocer y Bocanegra’s who lived in Penjamo:

Hola Jorge Luis. John Inclan y juan Pablo:

Ya que estan comentando sobre Ruiz y Haro Velasco, por mi madre tengo
ascendencia de los
Ruiz de Velasco, tambien de la zona de Ocotlan, aqui les mando lo que tengo
a ver en que
me pueden ayudar, soy el 18 i. de este reporte, mil gracias por su ayuda

Tomas Alejandro Villegas Gomez.
*

Descendants of xxxxggg RUIZ-de-VELASCO
*

*

Generation No. 1
*

*

1. xxxxggg1 RUIZ-de-VELASCO was born Unknown in Prob.: Jal., Méx., and died
Dead in Prob.: Jal., Méx.. He married ffffyyy NOSEELAPELLIDO Unknown in
Prob.: Jal., Méx.. She was born Unknown in Prob.: Jal., Méx., and died Dead
in Prob.: Jal., Méx..

More About xxxxggg RUIZ-de-VELASCO and ffffyyy NOSEELAPELLIDO:

Marriage: Unknown, Prob.: Jal., Méx.

Children of xxxxggg RUIZ-de-VELASCO and ffffyyy NOSEELAPELLIDO are:

2. i. Tomás2 Ruíz de Velazco, b. Unknown, Prob.: Jal., Méx.; d. Dead, Prob.:
Jal., Méx..

3. ii. Antonio RUIZdeVELAZCO, b. Unknown, Prob.: Jal., Méx.; d. Dead, Prob.:
Jal., Méx..
*

*

Generation No. 2
*

*

2. Tomás2 Ruíz de Velazco (xxxxggg1 RUIZ-de-VELASCO) was born Unknown in
Prob.: Jal., Méx., and died Dead in Prob.: Jal., Méx.. He married Francisca
Sagú Unknown in Prob.: Jal., Méx.. She was born Unknown in Prob.: Jal.,
Méx., and died Dead in Prob.: Jal., Méx..

More About Tomás Ruíz de Velazco and Francisca Sagú:

Marriage: Unknown, Prob.: Jal., Méx.

Children of Tomás Ruíz de Velazco and Francisca Sagú are:

i. Pedro-Jhp3 Ruiz de Velazco Sagú, b. 05 May 1784.

ii. José-Ignacio-Estanislao Ruíz de Velazco Sagú, b. 06 May 1786, Ocotlán,
Jal., Méx; d. Dead, Prob.: Jal., Méx..

More About José-Ignacio-Estanislao Ruíz de Velazco Sagú:

Baptism: 12 May 1786, Ocotlán, Jal., Méx
**

iii. Ma-Esfefana-Esmenegilda Ruiz de Velazco Sagú, b. 17 Abr 1791.

iv. José-Hilario-de-la-Trinidad RuízDeVelazco Sagú, b. 03 Ene 1797, Ocotlán,
Jal., Méx.

More About José-Hilario-de-la-Trinidad RuízDeVelazco Sagú:

Baptism: 08 Ene 1797, Ocotlán, Jal., Méx
**

4. v. Ma-de-Jesús Ruíz de Velazco Sagú, b. Unknown, Prob.: Jal., Méx.; d.
Dead, Prob.: Jal., Méx..
*

*

3. Antonio2 RUIZdeVELAZCO (xxxxggg1 RUIZ-de-VELASCO) was born Unknown in
Prob.: Jal., Méx., and died Dead in Prob.: Jal., Méx.. He married
Maria-Ignacia RUIZ Unknown in Prob.: Jal., Méx.. She was born Unknown in
Prob.: Jal., Méx., and died Dead in Prob.: Jal., Méx..

More About Antonio RUIZdeVELAZCO and Maria-Ignacia RUIZ:

Marriage: Unknown, Prob.: Jal., Méx.

Children of Antonio RUIZdeVELAZCO and Maria-Ignacia RUIZ are:

5. i. Rafael3 RUIZ-de-VELASCO-RUIZ, b. Unknown, Prob.: Jal., Méx.; d. Dead,
Prob.: Jal., Méx..

ii. Jose RUIZ-de-VELASCO-RUIZ, b. Aprox. 1789, Ocotlán, Jal., Méx.; d. Dead,
Prob.: Jal., Méx.; m. Maria-Dionicia GODINEZ-ORTEGA, 12 Nov 1831, Ocotlán,
Jal., Méx; b. Aprox. 1806, Ocotlán, Jal., Méx.; d. Dead, Prob.: Jal., Méx..

More About Jose RUIZ-de-VELASCO-RUIZ and Maria-Dionicia GODINEZ-ORTEGA:

Marriage: 12 Nov 1831, Ocotlán, Jal., Méx
*

*

Generation No. 3
*

*

4. Ma-de-Jesús3 Ruíz de Velazco Sagú (Tomás2 Ruíz de Velazco,
xxxxggg1RUIZ-de-VELASCO) was born Unknown in Prob.: Jal., Méx., and
died Dead in
Prob.: Jal., Méx.. She married Antonio Castellanos Sagú Unknown in Prob.:
Jal., Méx., son of Francisco Castellanos Becerra and Matiana Sagú
Villarruel. He was born Unknown in Prob.: Jal., Méx., and died Dead in
Prob.: Jal., Méx..

More About Antonio Castellanos Sagú and Ma-de-Jesús Ruíz de Velazco Sagú:

Marriage: Unknown, Prob.: Jal., Méx.

Children of Ma-de-Jesús Ruíz de Velazco Sagú and Antonio Castellanos Sagú
are:

i. Ma-Manuela-Catarina4 Castellanos RuízDeVelazco, b. 30 Nov 1820, La Barca,
Jal., Méx.

More About Ma-Manuela-Catarina Castellanos RuízDeVelazco:

Baptism: 30 Nov 1820, La Barca, Jal., Méx
**

ii. José-Mauricio-dela-T Castellanos RuízDeVelazco, b. 22 Sep 1822, Ocotlán,
Jal., Méx; d. Dead, Prob.: Jal., Méx..

More About José-Mauricio-dela-T Castellanos RuízDeVelazco:

Baptism: 26 Sep 1822, Ocotlán, Jal., Méx
**

iii. Ma-Rafaela-Nazaria Castellanos RuízDeVelazco, b. 31 Jul 1824, Ocotlán,
Jal., Méx.

More About Ma-Rafaela-Nazaria Castellanos RuízDeVelazco:

Baptism: 31 Jul 1824, Ocotlán, Jal., Méx
**

6. iv. Antonio Castellanos RuízDeVelazco, b. Unknown, Prob.: Jal., Méx.; d.
Dead, Prob.: Jal., Méx..

7. v. José-Trinidad Castellanos RuízDeVelazco, b. Unknown, Prob.: Jal.,
Méx.; d. Dead, Prob.: Jal., Méx..

8. vi. Ramón Castellanos RuízDeVelazco, b. Aprox. 1812, Ocotlán, Jal., Méx.;
d. Dead, Prob.: Jal., Méx..

9. vii. Ysidora Castellanos RuízDeVelazco, b. Unknown, Prob.: Jal., Méx.; d.
Dead, Prob.: Jal., Méx..

viii. Quirino-dela-Trinida Castellanos RuízDeVelazco, b. 03 Jun 1830,
Lomalarga, Ocotlán, Jal..

More About Quirino-dela-Trinida Castellanos RuízDeVelazco:

Baptism: 06 Jun 1830, Ocotlán, Jal.
*

*

5. Rafael3 RUIZ-de-VELASCO-RUIZ (Antonio2 RUIZdeVELAZCO,
xxxxggg1RUIZ-de-VELASCO) was born Unknown in Prob.: Jal., Méx., and
died Dead in
Prob.: Jal., Méx.. He married Cristina GODINEZ Unknown in Prob.: Jal., Méx..
She was born Unknown in Prob.: Jal., Méx., and died Dead in Prob.: Jal.,
Méx..

More About Rafael RUIZ-de-VELASCO-RUIZ and Cristina GODINEZ:

Marriage: Unknown, Prob.: Jal., Méx.

Child of Rafael RUIZ-de-VELASCO-RUIZ and Cristina GODINEZ is:

10. i. Jose4 RUIZ-de-VELASCO-GODINEZ, b. Aprox. 1826, Ocotlán, Jal., Méx.;
d. Dead, Prob.: Jal., Méx..
*

Hello,

I'm looking for any information about Pedro Alvarez de Navia. He was a resident of Tlaltenango about 1640-1650. The only thing that I know is that he was the "nephew" of Francisca de Molina "su tia" (Tapia or Bobadillo) wife of Antonio Vela. Both were godparents in a baptism in Tlaltenango where the relationship was stated. I want to understand how he was related to Francisca

Thank you in advance

sus

Hello,

Does anyone know where to find baptism records for San Matias, Pinos, Zacatecas between 1647-1680?.

Thanks

Happy hunting in 2020!

sus

Hello everyone!

I am wondering what age range were the term parvulo in the XVII century? I thought it was toddlers but I've read on different books that it would include children as old as 7....

What do you think?

Hello,
New theory about the parents of Juan de la Torre (married to Juana de Gamboa)
I'm still working with land records. I'm submitting the following information:
This is the history of EL MESQUITE in Jerez Zacatecas. (documented)
1. Initially the land was purchased by Miguel Caldera 1592
2. Miguel Caldera trades the land with his son in law Juan de la Torre Valdes (married to Ysabel Caldera) 1596
3. Juan de la torre takes posession in 1630
4. Heirs of Juan de la torre take posession in 1644 (Sebastian, Pedro, Diego and Juana de Gamboa)

EXPLANATION:
It is clear that the first Juan de la Torre Valdes is the one married to Ysabel Caldera. In the document Juan de la Torre Valdes is refered as the "yerno" of Miguel Caldera.
Now the problem is the 34 years between the second document and the third document. It is clear that the one that takes posession in 1630 is Juan de la Torre Valdes (married to Juana de Gamboa), because on document fourth the heirs are the sons and wife of Juan de la Torre Valdes (married to Juana de Gamboa). The document doesnt explain why (or how) it took posession, but it was clearly a transfer. I believe that the reason is that JUAN DE LA TORRE VALDES (MARRIED TO JUANA DE GAMBOA) IS THE SON OF JUAN DE LA TORRE VALDES (MARRIED TO YSABEL CALDERA). This theory will explain the 34 years between the land exchange and when the second Juan de la Torre took possession. Another clue to me is that clearly the transfer wasn't a purchased (in the first purchased of the land by Miguel Caldera was even marked how much Caldera paid for the land)

SOURCES:
https://www.familysearch.org/ark:/61903/3:1:3Q9M-CSDL-69K6-B?i=110&cat=…

With this explanation my tree would look like (this is not my tree):
https://gw.geneanet.org/tdowling?lang=en&n=caldera&oc=0&p=miguel

Any comments??

happy Holidays

sus

Hi,

I found a padron from 1861 when the municipal of Degollado was created.
I'm not sure how to attached a pdf file to this site. If someone can tell me how to attach it I can share it.

Thank you,
Esther

Sometimes in old documents when people referred to certain family relations, they didn’t meant them to be as present day.

Example: my son could be the son-in-law
Brother was used also for brother-in-law
Nieto or nieta could be used for grandchild or great-grandchild.

Several genealogies and researchers have had headaches when Encountering some of this terms.

Best regards

José Humberto Suárez Villarreal

> On 30 Dec 2019, at 15:46, "research-request@lists.nuestrosranchos.org" wrote:
>
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> DAILY DIGEST
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> Today's Topics:
>
> 1. Re: Where did Petronila first appear? (Angelina)
> 2. Where did Petronila first appear? (rachkath@me.com)
> 3. Re: Where did Petronila first appear? (Angelina)
>
>
> ----------------------------------------------------------------------
>
> Message: 1
> Date: Sun, 29 Dec 2019 15:36:49 -0800
> From: Angelina
> To: "research@nuestrosranchos.org"
> Subject: Re: [Nuestros Ranchos] Where did Petronila first appear?
> Message-ID: <085235AB-E34B-4816-A977-A9A7AF6945EC@markleweb.com>
> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=utf-8
>
> Rachel,
>
> That is the question we have all been asking ? I believe that there is at least one Informaciones Matrimoniales that state that Petronila was Moctezuma?s granddaughter ? at least that is what memory serves. The million dollar question is who her parents were. Supposedly, Guillermo Tovar de Teresa had located proof of her parentage and supporting the theory that she was daughter of Diego Sotelo; unfortunately, he died before he was able to publish his findings. However, he did share his information with Mariano Gonz?lez-Leal so there is hope to getting our questions answered.
>
> As fo Martin ? I believe he was Martin de Gabay, el Navarro. However, he has been referred to as Martin Navarro as well.
>
> If you look back in the archives on Nuestros Ranchos, you will see that this topic is pretty well covered.
>
> -Angelina-
>
>> On Dec 29, 2019, at 1:49 AM, rachkath@me.com wrote:
>>
>> I'm new to the family of Petronila's descendants. A very distant cousin of
>> mine posted a family tree on Ancestry with 33,000 people including my 8th
>> great grandparents, Joseph de Contreras and Cecilia de Renteria. My cousin
>> doesn't list her sources on Ancestry so I have been slowly researching and
>> documenting each person. Today, I made the mistake of picking up Chipman's
>> book which says my 13th GGM Petronila de Sotelo doesn't exist. Ancestry.com
>> and Family Search seem to back him up. All the records people cite are not of
>> Petronila. I want to prove she existed. What do you know about Martin de
>> Gabay Navarro? My first question is, "Is his name Navarro de Gabay or de
>> Gabay de Navarro? (Martin Navarro from Gabay or Martin de Gabay from
>> Navarre?). I'm starting to realize that some of these names are places. Can
>> someone tell me what PARES and SHARR are? I want more places to dig. I'm
>> stubborn and I just finished an MS in Business - not a related field but I am
>> trained to research and I don't know what to do with my extra time. If
>> Petronila is not Leonor Valderrama's descendant, I have also lost
>> Charlemagne. He is a direct ancestor of Cristobal Valderrama and Diego de
>> Sotelo. I'm now regretting not going into that giant LDS temple in my
>> hometown of LA. I was under the incorrect impression that they only had US
>> records and maybe some European records. Do they have anything that is not on
>> FamilySearch or My Heritage? Any help welcome... Thanks, Rachel Juarez Vargas
>>

Hola todos, quisiera saber si alguien en el grupo esta haciendo genealogia de las familias Valdivia y Navarro de los Altos de Jalisco. Estoy un poco atorado y necesito saber si alguien puede ayudarme. La pareja que busco es Joseph Eleuterio Valdivia casado con Francisca Navarro. Tengo la fecha de su matrimonio y ya revise el documento, pero lamentablemente no mencionan a los padres de ninguno. No he podido encontrar al Inf Mat para ver si ahi los mencionan.

Seria posible que alguien me pueda dar una pista o informacion adicional? Se los agradeceria mucho.

Tambien, me gustaria saber si alguien pudo conseguir o tiene los libreo del Sr Mariano Gonzalez Leal (Retoños de España en Nueva Galicia Tomo 6 Vol 1, y Tomo 7 de la mas reciente edición)?

Saludos y gracias de antemano por cualquier información proporcionada.

FERNANDO OSÓREZ Maestro De Santiago

I had stopped at Fernando Osórez when posting this line:
1). Alfonso Fernandez Villaseñor and Elvira Osórez (daughter of Fernando Osórez maestro de Santiago)

2). Fernan A. Villaseñor and Aldonza Gutierrez de Tapia

3). Diego Villaseñor alcaide de Segovía married to Maria Serones (Seron)(Seronis)

4). Juan Villaseñor Serones and Elvira de Tovar y Enriquez de Castilla

5). Diego de Villaseñor-Tovar and Isabel Alfonso de Villaseñor

6). Diego Villaseñor-Tovar"de Burgos" (b.1442 and d.1520) and Guiomar de Orosco y Sandoval

7). Juan de Villaseñor-Tovar y Orosco (b.1500) and Catalina Cervantes y Lara de Andrada

But I now have more information from papal records. Fernando Osórez “fue hijo de un “caballero profeso de la dicha Orden y de una mujer suelta” they never married. It seems that Fernando Osórez spent much of his youth living with a maternal uncle, Gonzalo Mexia (Messia) Mexia and Messia were used interchangeably by this Family, Guillermo Tovar De Teresa was mistaken when he said that they did not use both spellings.) From other pieces of the puzzle the maternal grandfather is positively identified. The “mujer suelta was “Beatriz?” Mexia, daughter of Fernán Rodríguez Mexía (Messia)

Here are some of my notes on his parents and grandparents:

Fernando Osórez fue hijo de don “Osorio Perez, caballero desta Orden”

While researching the ancestors to my Nueva Galicia Villaseñor line I came across some interesting information that connects it to the ancestors of other founding families of Nueva Galicia.

31º. Maestro De Santiago Fernando Osórez is the illegitimate son of Osorio Perez and “Beatriz?” Mexia. Osorio refused to marry even though he was free to do so. Papal records allow Fernando Osórez the right to inherit since there was nothing blocking Osorio from getting married to Fernando’s mother. Fernando Osórez succeeded his uncle, 30th maestro De Santiago Gonzalo Mexia. It looks as Fernando Osórez is raised by the Mexia Family as he follows his maternal uncle as maestro De Santiago.

Paternal grandfather 22º maestre de Santiago Juan Ozores (u Osórez)

The maternal grandfather is comendador mayor de Leon Fernán Rodríguez Mexía.

An interesting fact is that both Pedro Fernandez De Hijar and comendador Sancho Sanchez are in records pertaining to Fernando Osorez. Pedro Fernandez De Hijar is named as a nephew to Fernando Osórez.

I have stories to go with the names in my book. I also provide more information regarding Diego Velasco De Temino’s ancestry. I have interesting pieces that when put together leads me to believe that there is a strong probability that I have discovered Alfonso Ruiz De Temino’s “Velasco” ancestry. I will present this information when I have more conclusive evidence.

The line with additions looks like this:

1). Juan Osórez

2). Osorio Perez and (Beatriz?) Mexia (daughter of Fernan Rodriguez Mexia ( also identified by other genealogist as also using the name Fernan Gonzalez Mexia) Fernan Rodriguez Mexia [Mesia] was comendador mayor de Leon.

3). Alfonso Fernandez Villaseñor and Elvira Osórez (daughter of Fernando Osórez maestro de Santiago)

4). Fernan A. Villaseñor and Aldonza Gutierrez de Tapia

5). Diego Villaseñor alcaide de Segovía married to Maria Serones (Seron)(Seronis)

6). Juan Villaseñor Serones and Elvira de Tovar y Enriquez de Castilla

7). Diego de Villaseñor-Tovar and Isabel Alfonso de Villaseñor

8). Diego Villaseñor-Tovar"de Burgos" (b.1442 and d.1520) and Guiomar de Orosco y Sandoval

9). Juan de Villaseñor-Tovar y Orosco (b.1500) and Catalina Cervantes y Lara de Andrada

Rick A. Ricci
Source: book “Mygenes2000”

Aside from Mexican civil and church records, what type of medical records would have been kept that would document a persons death, particularly when an epidemic struck? Are there such records available online? Available if I write a letter to some office/department in Mexico?

Gracias

Hi

I have DNA from the British Isles and I can see through other relatives who have taken the test that it comes from my paternal grandmother's family. Her father was a Cavazos and her mother was a Gracia, they lived in (close to) Monterrey.

Anyone else out there unexpectedly have British/Irish/Scottish genes? . My percentage is very small (2%) so timewise it must go way back, but its also there in my siblings (1-2%) and another relative two generations above me (Ireland/Scotland 6% and England/Wales/Northwestern Europe 5%) so I dont think its a mistake. My best guess is the slave market of Sevilla, where white slaves (often fishermen taken captive in the North Sea isles) were sold along with slaves from Africa. But maybe someone researching Cavazos or Gracia has come across an Anglo name?

Regards
Denise

I found a map in one of the tierras y aguas books that are available from familysearch.org, but unfortunately, whoever made the film didn't unfold the map to take pictures of it. it's really important for me to see that map unfolded, I have relatives in Guadalajara that might be able to go to the Fondo de Tierras y Aguas of the Archivo Histórico del Estado de Jalisco,and unfold the map and take pictures of it.

Is it possible to go there and see the actual documents?

Has anybody been there?

Hi

Has anyone heard of Don Pedro Pablo de Gavai?

He turns up as padrino to a mulatto slave (possible ancestor of mine!) in this record of baptism 1713 for Juan Antonio Joseph Altamira
https://www.familysearch.org/ark:/61903/3:1:9392-KW9K-LT?i=528&cc=18745…

I found this info on a pedro de de arana y gavai (espanol) bapt 1690 in Aguascalientes:
https://www.familysearch.org/ark:/61903/3:1:S3HY-64V7-773?i=195&cc=1502…

Same guy?

How does his mother Francisca Gabai tie in with the other Gabais of Aguascalientes?

Regards
Denise Fastrup

Hello fellow researchers

I'm waiting for my mtDNA results and while I wait I'm trying to see if I can get my maternal line back a little bit further.

The earliest mother's mother's mother I can document using Family Search films is Beatriz Delgado, Spanish, born about 1595. She's the mother of Francisca de Rodas and Catalina Ponce who married in Tlaltenango. Both daughters are in my direct line, but my maternal line goes back through Catalina.

1636 - Francisca de Rodas with Rodrigo de Castro (left side entry has the parents)
https://www.familysearch.org/ark:/61903/3:1:939N-BR9M-FN?i=47&wc=3PS7-7…

1648 - Catalina Ponce and Manuel de Viera
https://www.familysearch.org/ark:/61903/3:1:939N-BR1Y-P?i=101&cc=1804458

Apparently, Pedro Calderon Solano passed away and Beatriz remarried with Antonio de Castro. I've read the online Tlaltenango marriage film and found nothing else relating to them, unless I missed it due to the hard-to-read handwriting. I don't believe Beatriz and Antonio de Castro had children.

Before I knew she was my ancestor, and back when I had an Ancestry free trial, I saw several trees which had Antonio de Castro (father of Rodrigo) married to a BRIGIDA Delgado about 1624 or 1634. Her parents were said to be Luis Delgado and Ana Flores Rubin from Guadalajara. It's Ancestry, so all the info looked copied from other trees and there were no real sources that I remember. But I see in the gedcom Luis Delgado and JUANA Flroes from Guadalajara with a son Juan Delgado Flores married in the 1630s in Tlaltenango. I was wondering if the info about Brigida/Beatriz came from anyone here or if anyone knew anything about a Brigida or Beatriz or had any sources to point to about her parentage or anything else that might help.

I know there was a Beatriz Delgado married to Martin Gonzales a generation or so earlier, so this one probably fits in there somehow.

Thanks in advance for any help
~ Andrea

I would like to verify with the group the different distinctions that come up when looking at a marriage dispensation.

Concerning the dispensation here:

https://www.familysearch.org/ark:/61903/3:1:9392-GR7B-JV?i=155&cc=18745…

It states: "El impedimento de afinidad licita en prmier grado igual"

I understand this to be a legal relationship in the first degree. Does this mean that the new bride is the sister of the deceased wife?

The charts here: https://ccoo1.webs.upv.es/Legislacion/Trabajo/Decreto_34_consanguinidad…, are mildly confusing and I would like to double check.

Based on other records, the deceased wife was 18 at the time of her death in 1886. The new wife is 32 in 1892, so there would have been an 8 year difference between the two women. Additionally, the old wife's parents are listed as Jesus Chavez and Antonia Ortega. The new wife's parents are Juan Jesus Chavez and Antonia Gutierrez. I don't want to jump to the conclusion just yet that Antonia is an Ortega Gutierrez/Gutierrez Ortega just yet, and I am looking for direction in the dispensation.

There appears to be a consensus that Luisa de Quesada y Mendoza and her sister Maria may be the legitimate daughters of Alonso de Quesada and Juana Bautista Hernandez de Arellano y Mendoza. That said, I've yet to locate one solid piece of evidence that confirms the relationship.

Given Luisa's surname it is easy to assume she is the daughter of Alonso and Juana. Although it certainly seems likely, I'm hoping someone has come across a new source document that confirms the relationship.

Thanks in advance to those that take time to look at this.

Hi All. I am wondering if any fellow member can help me with this. Looking at old Census (Padrones) of Juchipila and Moyahua, what do the following letters mean? They are placed after each ndividual's name. One or the other is placed, not all at once. It's my first time looking at these records. Thanks!

cc
c
p
cv
cp
cd
s
cs

My 2nd Paternal Great Grandmother was Martina Huizar, who was married to Pascual Navarro, her parents I believe were Josef Anselmo Huizar and Dolores Perez. Anyone here have Huizar ancestors from La Venta Del Astillero, Zapopan, Tesistan, or Lagos De Moreno Jalisco? I'm having a hard time with finding more ancestors from side of my family.

I joined this group to find more information on the Macias family from Aguascalientes and Nochistlan. My Macias line starts with my Paternal Great Grandfather Higinio Zaldivar (Saldivar) Macias B: Jan 11, 1887 in Nochistlan Zacatecas and Died Feb 8, 1954 in D.F. His Mother was Maria Del Refugio Macias B: Abt 1863 in Nochistlan and she was married to my GG Grandfather Atanasio Saldivar Duran.

I was wondering if any of you have experience on what is going on when certain children of the same parents are labelled legitimate while others are labeled naturales.

For example, the children of Jose Ramos and Anastasia Jimenes, who were living in Sayula, Jalisco in the 1860s.

The two following children are listed as legitimate:

Barvara: https://www.familysearch.org/ark:/61903/3:1:9392-GL94-TX?i=220&cc=18745…
Ma. Genobia: https://www.familysearch.org/ark:/61903/3:1:9392-GP9C-6B?i=465&cc=18745…

But this son is listed as natural:

Petronilo: https://www.familysearch.org/ark:/61903/3:1:9392-GP9X-GY?i=171&cc=18745…

Perhaps I need to look further into Jose and Anastasia to see if they are related, but I was just looking for what immediately comes to the mind of the more experienced researchers here.

Thanks!

Hola prim@s,

I’ve finally finished indexing the early San Matias Sierra de Pinos parish archives and formatted them into a PDF, that can be downloaded here:

http://www.nuestrosranchos.org/node/24112

Saludos!
Manny Diez Hermosillo

I am looking for the matrimonio for Pablo Valdez and Trinidad Marquez. It is supposed to be in book 299835 on 13 diciembre 1815. I have looked page by page from noviembre 1815 through the end of 1816 and I am not seeing it. Help! And thank you...

Looking for information on Surnames: Ornelas, Garnica, Zarate, Guzman, and Villaseñor. Are they mentioned in the Book "Retoños de España en la Nueva Galicia?" Does anyone have a digital copy of this book?

Thank in Advance

Francisco Escobar